Rick2you2

Let me clarify what I wrote. Apparently, I wasn’t clear. I am the one saying we may be headed towards a critical mass. I don’t need to rely on anyone to say they “may” be headed that way. My damned crystal ball broke last week and the mechanic closed his shop. Could I be wrong? Sure. The basis for my comment are all the complaints about the very high prices on auction pieces that weren’t that good, including at least one long timer who can’t justify paying prices he is seeing for panel pages, and Gene’s earlier comment about pricing. Look at all of them. I do not see a top to bottom market collapse. There is too much money in this hobby. What the aforementioned comments suggest to me is a “hollowing out effect”, in which lesser “classic” pieces sit unsold or quietly drop while people move on to things they perceive have better value. Perhaps modern, perhaps War, darned if I know. Most collectors, I think it is fair to say, don’t spend hundreds of thousands of dollars every year on trophy pieces. These boards may have a disproportionate number of people who do. I don’t know that either, but I do know quite a few boardies spend more than I will on these works. So for the more typical collector, the top end prices are fun to look at, but do not reflect the reality of what they, or I buy. So for me, and most people, that hollowing out effect is more relevant than whether a Frazetta piece goes for 1M or 2M. As to the “feeding frenzy” at the shallow end of the pond, it takes time to turn a herd of stampeding cattle. Do I know prices will stabilize high or drop? No, I thought I was clear. That damn crystal ball just won’t work anymore. Maybe I should try tarot cards. I strongly do not think a classic Tulipmania price crash is in the offing. But market changes are certainly suggested by the comments. Better?

I don't think critical mass is there yet, but the comments suggest it is headed there. To answer your question, feeding frenzies can be pushed, or maybe created, by dealers bidding up items to protect the prices of their stock; auction houses that bid on their own account; shills, and gullible people who don't know what is going on or who turn a blind eye to it.

The question is one of quality. I don’t think the top pieces will drop, maybe ever. But, if you look at all the complaining about pricing on lower quality pieces, and people who have stopped buying, maybe this is where the rollback eventually begins. I’ve noticed more dealer swaps of lesser pieces, which is a form of price support as well as gaining a piece worth selling, as each new owner raises the price. Or, maybe I’ve just noticed them more. How often do those attempted flips of mediocre go nowhere? I don’t know, but that would be another clue.

Here's another piece of his. Bet you never knew, the Phantom Stranger does rap!

The issue, as I see it reflected in the comments here is too little quality for the price. High quality? Sure. Mediocre quality? Danger, Will Robinson, danger!

This is the kind of approach to OA which can lead to overshoot and collapse of the market. As Gene noted when writing about a conversation with another old-time collector about pricing, “this will end badly, won’t it?” Or, words to that effect. CD’s have established markets for sale. The OA market has a relatively narrow throat.

Thanks, Alex. Compared to what you could get at the recent HA auction, the newer art can be a terrific bargain (usually)

It isn’t just the high earners. There are also old-timers who can essentially flip high value pieces into other high value pieces which they see as having more growth potential or interest. About those high earners, the question then becomes whether there are a sufficiently large number of them to sustain the broad spectrum price rises over the last few years. Gene’s earlier comment suggests maybe not.

Interesting. I don’t own any Marvel artwork, although I certainly read the books. I just don’t care much for his published work, particularly at Marvel. Oh, he could draw wonderfully. I saw that in his biography a few years ago, and which had illustrations. But I find a lot of his published work looking rushed, almost sloppy, and I wasn’t impressed with its “kinetic energy”.

Looks like the groom got a healthy dowery.

Thank you. And I don't post them all, either.

I originally hadn't planned to post this recent acquisition, but after seeing the results of the recent Heritage Signature auction, and how little a buck brings, I changed my mind. What follows cost all of $1,500. This is the art for the upcoming (main) cover for DC's new Halloween Special by John McCrea. DC is also coming out with at least one variant cover, but a certain character wasn't included in it, so I didn't pursue. Anyway, the package consisted of an original pencil cover, an original inked cover (over his pencil scan), a preliminary (which I am leaving out, and is on the back of the pencil page), and what I think had the most dynamic layout: John's original proposal for a cover to DC that was rejected. See what youi think. I am sorely tempted to ask for a commission of the thing. When looking at the pencil version, you may notice that the Phantom Stranger and Deadman are on opposite sides of the page. I asked him why he mirror-imaged it for the inked version, and he said that it allowed him to catch errors in his pencil work. I never heard that before, so I thought I would pass it on. By the way, this is what the final, published art will look like: And the prelim, which is slightly cut off at the edges: Now, that's $1,500 well spent, in my opinion.

Frankly, I think it’s undervalued, too. Some of its political content, however, is a bit dated (like Spiro Agnew, the hyena).

Hang around here for a while. You’ll get to be an expert.

My suspicion is that some of it will show up on dealers’ sites over the next year. They can only make money if they have stock, and the market has shown an amazing capacity to grow in price. Don’t forget what Bechara said: prices always go up. Unless they don’t. That long time collector’s comment suggests lots of people are thinking Tulipmania is just around the corner. As for me, I’m perfectly comfortable buying new art. RPG’s are collectible? Rocket propelled grenades? Who knew?

I've made this same point earlier, but the truth is, most people can't afford whole stories, or even sequences. So, we settle for the story telling on a page by page basis.

Yes, but they belong in the other thread. There was one piece I bid on. That was the Amy Reeder inked cover from Madam Xanadu, No. 9, which went for a bit more than I bid (or expected), without the BP, at $1,680. I already had 3 interior pages from the series, and one is better than the cover, which isn't particularly heart-stopping. Given past prices, and adding in the generic inflation in pricing over the last few years, it went for a bit higher than I would have expected (maybe $200-300)(without BP). Not too upset; I almost didn't bid on it all.

Kind of ugly, too. She looks more like She-Hulk with her mascara running.

Something in the water. But, I think it has to do with a tie-in to Spiderman for Andru and Sub-Mariner's tie-in to Everett.

So, the auction is moving forward. So far, I think someone got a good deal on the Jason Shawn Alexander Hellboy Page and an early Hawkman page Anderson page having Adam Strange along with Hawkman.

If you mean written in on the top, it is usually included, but its absence is not likely to matter. The only question I would have, and which is presumably your concern, is whether it is fake. Extremely unlikely, the artist probably ran out of Marvel board, or didn’t like its texture. Just look at the comic and compare tiny details.

Don’t forget this is just a chat board intended to give lower priced pieces a time in the spotlight. Buying something for $2,500 isn’t particularly cheap, but seeing what is going on a level up from the bottom, particularly on artists, subjects, etc., can provide valuable insights as where you may want to allocate funds. After thinking $2k was a good target, I still had to consider the house premium of 20%. That may be a requirement for cost basis accounting, but shouldn’t factor into private sales.

Good luck, unless they include things I'm interested in.

I didn’t want to be that blunt, but that is why I just added the topic.

With all the attention paid to the higher end of the auction, I thought it might be interesting to see what people thought of the items and prices which mere mortals can regularly afford. Unlike “Morlock” art, where the cost is known, we obviously don’t know what a piece will ultimately sell for. Likewise, people may not want to “tip their hand” to items of interest until the auction ends (or, maybe they do). And, since this a major Heritage auction, I am picking a higher range. So, if you see a piece which you either think should sell for less than $2,500, or which does sell for less than $2,500, and you have some thoughts, by all means go for it (knowing they won’t be buried in wonder as all eyes are glued on a Ditko Spider-man piece or some other costly work). And yes, I am watching a few things, but I am torn about how much I like them. So, the pricing near the end will affect my bidding decision. I will wait.