Comic book collecting with a foreign variant focus 20 20

[pickycollector]

 

[Chespirito]

 

 

[TheLiamSturgess]

Here's a super cool one...

 

]img][/img] Czech edition. Took me forever to find and a lot of money but its here.

[Define999]

Those Mexican Swamp Thing books are sweeeeet!

 

Have to agree man... recently there was a set of 5 of these on ebay. Guy wanted like 300 bucks and they were beat to hell. Like good- hell..... Lsc's seem to be in pretty good condition. Novaros in general are always pretty beat up.... I don't know if you can confirm that Ches? Chesperito has much more experience in Mexicans than I, but from what I have seen if you can find a Novaro in Fine or higher your pretty damn lucky.

[Define999]

Here is one of my favs...

 

 

Collects H180-1, With a Hulk 181 pose sketch by Trimpe

 

Wow Ches, that freakin cool! What year did this come out? Looks like a different Novaro logo..... didn't realize the Marvel license switched from La Prensa to Novaro at some point.

[Chespirito]

Honestly, I think that as far as Marvel goes in Mexico, La Prensa was only to the late 60s, maybe hit some of the 70s. Novaro and Novedades was 80s, and it's Vid, currently. But I'm no expert, just from what I have noticed. The moderators in this site:

http://www.spidermex.com/inicio.php

 

...are a wealth of knowledge when it comes to Mexican books...

[Chespirito]

Here's a super cool one...

 

]img][/img] Czech edition. Took me forever to find and a lot of money but its here.

 

I remember that mission ...That book is a headache to find

[Define999]

Nice grade on that bad boy! Is this the first time Ditkos AF15 cover art made it ontu a Italian book?

Yes, l’Uomo Ragno #18 is the first (and only) use of the cover artwork of AF #15. L’Uomo Ragno #1 featured a collage with Romita artwork. Spidey has those little "sparklings" around his head, and if no one knows, might think it’s his Spider-sense tingling, while it’s taken from the inside pages of the "non-Comics Code" drug-themed issues.

 

The true question, however (at least for completists italian collectors) is: does it have stickers? You have to break the CGC case to find out, or at least they should state so. Issues with stickers and/or posters usually go for prices about 8x the same ones without stickers.

 

Cool, correct me if I am wrong but being that the stickers were structurally part of the comic. There should be a notation by CGC if they are missing the stickers? I have always wondered if CGC’s accuracy would not be as tight with foreign books. I mean who is their expert? Do they have people they can call on in foreign countries? It might be a cool question to ask in the ask CGC forum? How do they handle rare foreign books they have never seen before?

 

So vaillant I have re-written some things to address issues you brought up. I think this might be a little better….

 

Original…

 

Another very important aspect to consider in foreign variant collecting is that for many foreign collectors there preference was for the American editions instead of their own indigenous language versions.

 

Adjusted… easy fix…

 

Another very important aspect to consider in foreign variant collecting is that for many but not all, some foreign collectors seemed to have a preference for the American editions instead of their own indigenous language versions.

 

 

Original…

 

The other issue I believe contributed in this bias for American versions is language. The educational systems in place in Europe and elsewhere around the world usually start children on a path to being multilingual from very early on. English is learned early and most foreign comic book collectors have an almost fluent grasp of the English language. This removes the language barrier and allows them the choice of which books they desire.

Now I am not saying all foreign collectors have this bias, many foreign websites exist celebrating the local published comics along with the American licensed material. I do think however that a good amount of foreign collectors in many countries prefer the American original over the indigenous licensed version.

 

Adjusted…

 

The other issue I believe contributed in this bias for American versions is language. The educational systems in place in Europe and elsewhere around the world usually start children on a path to being multilingual from very early on. Language limitations which could have caused a foreign collector to be pigeon holed into only his countries version didn’t seem to exist. Foreign collectors chose whichever version of a specific comic they wanted and many did choose the American original.

Now I am not saying all foreign collectors have a bias against their indigenous version. Many foreign websites do exist celebrating the local published comics along with the American licensed material. I do think however that a portion of foreign collectors in many countries prefer the American original over the indigenous licensed version.

 

I think these changes make it so it doesnt seem so concrete "de-facto" and gives me some wiggle room.... I am still addressing other concerns as well. Thanks!

 

[Define999]

Here's a super cool one...

 

]img][/img] Czech edition. Took me forever to find and a lot of money but its here.

 

Nice Liaton! I would like at this time to plug Liatons website.... dude has a sheetload of cool variants to peep! Check him out.....

 

http://foreigncomicbooks.yolasite.com/

 

(thumbs u

[Define999]

Honestly, I think that as far as Marvel goes in Mexico, La Prensa was only to the late 60s, maybe hit some of the 70s. Novaro and Novedades was 80s, and it's Vid, currently. But I'm no expert, just from what I have noticed. The moderators in this site:

http://www.spidermex.com/inicio.php

 

...are a wealth of knowledge when it comes to Mexican books...

 

Nice Ches! Thanks! (thumbs u

[Define999]

 

 

Those French Canadians are pretty rare as well.... nice looking too! I have a Iron Man 55 editions heritage I am waiting to pull the trigger on? I should probably do it before the new Avengers comes out me thinks....

[pickycollector]

The first issues (Spider-Man 1-2, Hulk 1-3 and FF 1) are almost impossible to find in high grade.

 

The cover is made of the same paper as the inside pages (in color), and were printed in a very low quality paper. Moreover, a very low quantity of these issues has been printed. No need to say that any copy above VF is extremely rare.

 

After these issues, they started printing the interior in black and white and used better quality paper for the cover, like these ones below.

 

I had all issues in 9.0/9.2 when I was a kid but sold them all as a lot to start collecting original US versions. What a mistake!

 

Now I am trying hard to retrieve these issues in nice shape but the opportunities in the last 20 years can be counted in one hand.

 

I am still looking for nice copies of FF 1 and Hulk 2-3. The hardest of all is by far the Hulk #2.

 

[Barbarian]

One of the most interesting things I find about the foreign editors is when the go nuts with their local artists rather than using the licensed material they already paid for .

 

Here´s a good example:

 

Have a look at a splash page of Batman 251 I found here in the boards. (I think its from a recent remastered colored book)

 

 

 

There was a Brazilian book I was thinking of buying with this cover, but after looking closer, it seems that the images are very different...

 

Brazilian Neal Adams copycat?

 

 

 

 

Then I found out about this threasury format one. Bit better, but still not there.

 

 

The one I am looking for now, is this one (where the original splash page is in):

 

 

 

[DeliBebek]

The first issues (Spider-Man 1-2, Hulk 1-3 and FF 1) are almost impossible to find in high grade.

 

The cover is made of the same paper as the inside pages (in color), and were printed in a very low quality paper. Moreover, a very low quantity of these issues has been printed. No need to say that any copy above VF is extremely rare.

 

That addresses a question I'd been wondering about, since I've seen many overseas comics with newsprint covers. These don't hold up as well over the years.

[davidpg]

I've been picking up the Heritage French Canadian editions for a few years now as I always found them fun to have alongside the originals.

 

I'll try to post some pics tonight

[Define999]

One of the most interesting things I find about the foreign editors is when the go nuts with their local artists rather than using the licensed material they already paid for .

 

Here´s a good example:

 

Have a look at a splash page of Batman 251 I found here in the boards. (I think its from a recent remastered colored book)

 

 

 

There was a Brazilian book I was thinking of buying with this cover, but after looking closer, it seems that the images are very different...

 

Brazilian Neal Adams copycat?

 

 

 

 

Then I found out about this threasury format one. Bit better, but still not there.

 

 

The one I am looking for now, is this one (where the original splash page is in):

 

 

 

 

Sure did love that Adams image!

 

I find it interesting that some foreign publishers reproduced art with their own artists. In many cases things were changed quite a bit, and in others it’s almost like they just traced the original artwork. Were transparencies sent by Marvel for use or black and white shootable artwork or stats or what? How was it done? How were the foreign plates made? I have also always wondered if someone at Marvel had to clear stuff or at least monitor that their very important intellectual properties were not in any way being “manhandled”! Great research Barbarian!

[TrippyMcSkippy-migration]

CGC did NOT notate that the stickers were missing with the books I submitted. I do have an Italian Fantastic Four with stickers that I never got graded.

[Define999]

I had all issues in 9.0/9.2 when I was a kid but sold them all as a lot to start collecting original US versions. What a mistake!

 

Oh man Picky! How ironic now your search for these issues.... This is exactly what I was talking about in my article. It is one of the things I find most interesting about this focus of collecting. Many of these foreigns at the time of there printing were not given the intrinsic value they deserved.... I am not saying this is true of you necessarily, but I do seem to hear this story alot. Collectors just wanted the original American versions.... and thats ok. There isn't anything wrong with that at all...

 

what I find most ironic is the resurgence of interest in these books long after many American collectors had discounted them.... like I stated in my article as "curious footnotes" in comic book history. And that’s not even stating the fact that many on the boards here have seeked these books out for along time but the boards here our a microcosm of hard core collectors. We definitely are not the norm in the comic book collecting world.

 

When I walk into some LCS’s and talk about foreigns mostly every one looks at me with blank stares like I am crazy! Some didn’t even know American comic books were printed in foreign languages at all! They don’t even know they exist much less that people collect them! Trust me when I say these books are not on the collective American radar at all!

 

I own the 1st Punisher in editions heritage and I love the book.

I must get more!

[Define999]

I've been picking up the Heritage French Canadian editions for a few years now as I always found them fun to have alongside the originals.

 

I'll try to post some pics tonight

 

Please do! (thumbs u

[vaillant]

@Define999: Corrections are fine, but I think you should explicitate the fact that in some countries, such a thing would have been out of question.

I think that, if in Italy the publisher did not go bankrupt, almost no one would have started to collect original editions. I mean, of course, there would have been a minority, as it has always been the case, but the very moderate english-literacy of the average italian reader, at least up to the 1990s, would have prevented that also.

Not that the situation changed so much, today’s graduates are often barely english-literate, unless they study some scientific matter, or english literature.

 

Cool, correct me if I am wrong but being that the stickers were structurally part of the comic.

Yes, they were. They were stapled, initially within the centerfold, later on between the cover and the first wrap, occasionally they were polybagged (usually when there was also a poster). Again, the issue came to the collectors' attention, as people become more sensitive about the grade, so it was mostly a curiosity in the 1970s to collect them with stickers. Now it is often a requirement, personally I don’t care, I just care for those stickers I remember I used to have or have seen as a kid…

 

There should be a notation by CGC if they are missing the stickers?

Well, I think so, mostly because it makes a huge price difference on the italian market.

 

I have always wondered if CGC’s accuracy would not be as tight with foreign books. I mean who is their expert? Do they have people they can call on in foreign countries? It might be a cool question to ask in the ask CGC forum? How do they handle rare foreign books they have never seen before?

To be honest, here we should make a distinction between what is considered a "variant" and what is simply a foreign edition collectors enjoy because of the "universal scope" collecting may acquire.

The only issue I would consider a "variant" is L’Uomo Ragno #29, which features an alternate version of the Ditko art to the cover, which very likely was sent to the italian publisher by mistake. And which, incidentally, I think is a lot cooler than the US final version.

Another matter would be books which have meaning for the US market. An example could be the comic-book sized post-war reprint of "Saturno contro la Terra", a long story from 1937 which is – to my knowledge – the only italian comic published in comic book form (in McKay's title "Future Comics", pretty rare).

Or some rare 1930s Disney titles, whose cover art is amazing, which now gained exposure thanks to Fantagraphics' reprint of the classic early Gottfredson stories.