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When did X-Men jump the shark?
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149 posts in this topic

My first issue off the stands was # 252 with Silvestri art and The Reavers. Didn't really understand it with the whole Gateway/portal/they all died during Fall of the Mutants thing. but I eventually backtracked to 94.

 

Post-Byrne, I loved 186, the early 200s leading to the Mutant Massacre, Fall of the Mutants and even the Xtinction Agenda.

 

It jumped the shark right before 300 with X-cutioner's song, which was something like 16 parts and polybagged. And 300 was my last issue, with its god awful JRJR foil cover. Never really read beyond that, and so glad I missed the Joe Madueira Manga days.

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219 was the issue where I said, "I can't take it anymore!"

...Another really hateful cover right there, too.

 

Very much so, and begged comparison with the superior 139 and 171, too.

 

Here's a different lame cover from this same time period.

It tickles me that they went to the trouble to trademark the names of these three losers. lol

 

134046.jpg.67af82fe67dea04de34f5eb1d67e998b.jpg

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219 was the issue where I said, "I can't take it anymore!"

...Another really hateful cover right there, too.

 

Very much so, and begged comparison with the superior 139 and 171, too.

 

Here's a different lame cover from this same time period.

It tickles me that they went to the trouble to trademark the names of these three losers. lol

 

 

:sick:

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When I saw the cover on 155 I was hooked every month for a few years -- even got a subscription! I had read the occasional sporadic x-men hand me down from my brother before that, but 155 is when I became a regular reader. Eventually dropped comics entirely in high school though, so I missed what most of you are describing as the bad stretch in the 200s.

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For me, things got really patchy after Mutant Massacre. The non-sensical storylines and sheer volume of unresolved plot threads began to increase. I think the back to back three part Brood and Genosha stories in the 230s was the end.

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This is such a validating thread lol I didn't pick up an xmen book until the early 200s and I thought it sucked haaaaaaaaaard and yet the x-men were such a big deal to everyone else. Nice to see I'm not crazy and everyone else secretly thought it sucked too :insane: In retrospect its amazing how long the byrne/cockrum/smith momentum kept things going despite major suckage

We all kept buying hoping to see some resolution of the cool subplots that had been introduced. :facepalm:

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This is such a validating thread lol I didn't pick up an xmen book until the early 200s and I thought it sucked haaaaaaaaaard and yet the x-men were such a big deal to everyone else. Nice to see I'm not crazy and everyone else secretly thought it sucked too :insane: In retrospect its amazing how long the byrne/cockrum/smith momentum kept things going despite major suckage

We all kept buying hoping to see some resolution of the cool subplots that had been introduced. :facepalm:

 

Saved for ret-cons. :baiting:

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I have mixed feelings. I think they jumped and then jumped back and then jumped again a whole bunch of times. But that whole "Dark Phoenix Returns" storyline was craap. It hadn't even been 3 years and Claremont had Madeline Pryor show up in a poorly scripted, wholly unnecessary storyline that blew goats.

 

After the 3 issue Dr Doom storyline in 145-147 I really didn't enjoy the title until #205 (with the exception of #159-160). A lot of folks like the Paul Smith run but it just didn't do it for me.

 

And it's not that the bar was set so high either. To me the art was so-so, the writing was so-so...the title was so-so. The plotting became bad. When Byrne left it wasn't just the art he took with him. He supplied Claremont with the good ganja and when the Northern Lights were gone Claremont had to settle for sub-par grass and it showed. The Brood, the Madeline Pryor, Wolvie getting married, Cyclops vs. Squid....eh.

 

It was basically 5 years until the X-Men once again had something to write home about. At that point there was a flurry of good writing. Sadly, consistency would be a problem for a long time as Claremont didn't have a reliable connection that would keep him in the fresh produce.

 

#205 say BWS drop by for an awesome Solo Wolvie tale that also introduced Lady Deathstrike. #206-210 was a decent Hellfire Club story but the Mutant Massacre was great. I loved the Marauders and thought they were inspired villains. For the next oh, 26 years lol things would be hit or miss.

 

#221 & 222 with the introduction of Sinister and Round 2 against the Marauders was great. Fall of the Mutants was decent but the 2nd Brood storyline in 232-234 was great. I really enjoyed Inferno too. Then 251-258 kicked serious butt: The Muir Island Saga, Acts of Vengeance, Jim Lee, the new Psylocke, the Mandarin - great stuff. #268 was really good too. But after that the title never showed any consistency until Dark Reign. That was when things started to get interesting again.

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I have mixed feelings. I think they jumped and then jumped back and then jumped again a whole bunch of times. But that whole "Dark Phoenix Returns" storyline was craap. It hadn't even been 3 years and Claremont had Madeline Pryor show up in a poorly scripted, wholly unnecessary storyline that blew goats.

 

After the 3 issue Dr Doom storyline in 145-147 I really didn't enjoy the title until #205 (with the exception of #159-160). A lot of folks like the Paul Smith run but it just didn't do it for me.

 

And it's not that the bar was set so high either. To me the art was so-so, the writing was so-so...the title was so-so. The plotting became bad. When Byrne left it wasn't just the art he took with him. He supplied Claremont with the good ganja and when the Northern Lights were gone Claremont had to settle for sub-par grass and it showed. The Brood, the Madeline Pryor, Wolvie getting married, Cyclops vs. Squid....eh.

 

It was basically 5 years until the X-Men once again had something to write home about. At that point there was a flurry of good writing. Sadly, consistency would be a problem for a long time as Claremont didn't have a reliable connection that would keep him in the fresh produce.

 

#205 say BWS drop by for an awesome Solo Wolvie tale that also introduced Lady Deathstrike. #206-210 was a decent Hellfire Club story but the Mutant Massacre was great. I loved the Marauders and thought they were inspired villains. For the next oh, 26 years lol things would be hit or miss.

 

#221 & 222 with the introduction of Sinister and Round 2 against the Marauders was great. Fall of the Mutants was decent but the 2nd Brood storyline in 232-234 was great. I really enjoyed Inferno too. Then 251-258 kicked serious butt: The Muir Island Saga, Acts of Vengeance, Jim Lee, the new Psylocke, the Mandarin - great stuff. #268 was really good too. But after that the title never showed any consistency until Dark Reign. That was when things started to get interesting again.

 

Great post!

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I'm surprised at how many people stopped enjoying UXM prior to issue 200. Especially considering this is a Copper Age forum. What, no love for Inferno, Fall of the Mutants, or X-Tinction Agenda? What about the coming of Bishop? I loved that stuff as a kid.

:cloud9:MadelynePryorBanner-2.jpg

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I have mixed feelings. I think they jumped and then jumped back and then jumped again a whole bunch of times. But that whole "Dark Phoenix Returns" storyline was craap. It hadn't even been 3 years and Claremont had Madeline Pryor show up in a poorly scripted, wholly unnecessary storyline that blew goats.

 

After the 3 issue Dr Doom storyline in 145-147 I really didn't enjoy the title until #205 (with the exception of #159-160). A lot of folks like the Paul Smith run but it just didn't do it for me.

 

And it's not that the bar was set so high either. To me the art was so-so, the writing was so-so...the title was so-so. The plotting became bad. When Byrne left it wasn't just the art he took with him. He supplied Claremont with the good ganja and when the Northern Lights were gone Claremont had to settle for sub-par grass and it showed. The Brood, the Madeline Pryor, Wolvie getting married, Cyclops vs. Squid....eh.

 

It was basically 5 years until the X-Men once again had something to write home about. At that point there was a flurry of good writing. Sadly, consistency would be a problem for a long time as Claremont didn't have a reliable connection that would keep him in the fresh produce.

 

#205 say BWS drop by for an awesome Solo Wolvie tale that also introduced Lady Deathstrike. #206-210 was a decent Hellfire Club story but the Mutant Massacre was great. I loved the Marauders and thought they were inspired villains. For the next oh, 26 years lol things would be hit or miss.

 

#221 & 222 with the introduction of Sinister and Round 2 against the Marauders was great. Fall of the Mutants was decent but the 2nd Brood storyline in 232-234 was great. I really enjoyed Inferno too. Then 251-258 kicked serious butt: The Muir Island Saga, Acts of Vengeance, Jim Lee, the new Psylocke, the Mandarin - great stuff. #268 was really good too. But after that the title never showed any consistency until Dark Reign. That was when things started to get interesting again.

If you didn't enjoy the Brood storyline in the 160s, then you are full of mud. That was an epic storyline. :cloud9:

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After the 3 issue Dr Doom storyline in 145-147 I really didn't enjoy the title until #205 (with the exception of #159-160). A lot of folks like the Paul Smith run but it just didn't do it for me.

 

And it's not that the bar was set so high either. To me the art was so-so, the writing was so-so...the title was so-so. The plotting became bad. When Byrne left it wasn't just the art he took with him. He supplied Claremont with the good ganja and when the Northern Lights were gone Claremont had to settle for sub-par grass and it showed. The Brood, the Madeline Pryor, Wolvie getting married, Cyclops vs. Squid....eh.

 

If you didn't enjoy the Brood storyline in the 160s, then you are full of mud. That was an epic storyline. :cloud9:

 

??? mud? How does...Is that like I'm all...what? Can you explain that one. It's cool - it's just a new one and I'm wondering how it works. I don't know how I should feel here.

 

OK, let me see if I can convey how I saw the Brood.

 

Yeah, I really didn't enjoy the Brood storyline. Supposedly vicious cheap Alien knockoffs were out collecting hosts for their queen and talking in plain boring english with their phasers on stun and hijacking huge space whales.

 

I admit that a good portion of this had to do with Cockrum's art. I don't think I ever saw him draw anything with a point Everything was round. Even Wolvie's claws were rounded at the end. Nothing was ever sharp. It was just.....round. Had Byrne still been there co-plotting and doing the art, that solo Wolvie tale in #162 would have had some real balls. Instead I kept expecting Peter Pan to show up. I felt like he was travelling through Candyland meets HR Puff n' Stuff meets Joseph's technicolor creamsicle.

 

This wasn't a dangerous alien landscape where Wolverine had to fight for his life - it was a world of pookas and pookies and pink foo-foos and tra-la-la moopies. Fisher Price colors and all-ages fun for the entire family. I swear I was ready for him to get a drink from the stream and have it be a milkshake. Vanilla.

 

I dunno if Claremont was going through menopause or what but once Kitten aka Sprite aka Ariel the roller skating toothpick joined the team they became a bunch of pussified DC heroes. WTF happened to my X-Men? Now it was Amethyst Princess of Gemworld. I'm surprised that when Dracula showed up in #159 that he didn't sparkle. I mean, Storm gets a Mohawk and Kitten runs off crying? "How could you? How could you get a mohawk you....you...scary punker!".

 

The Brood storyline in #232-234? I thought that was amazing. I disliked the Brood going into that storyline but Claremont really changed my views with this storyline. Silvestri's art helped too. All of a sudden it was like the Brood lost all of the silly stuff and leg-warmers and went from White Lion Hair Metal to Judas Priest Screaming for Vengeance. Now they were vicious and scary and bad-. Now the Brood had some street cred!

Edited by Kramerica
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I dunno if Claremont was going through menopause or what but once Kitten aka Sprite aka Ariel the roller skating toothpick joined the team they became a bunch of pussified DC heroes.

 

I can't stand Kitty Pryde either. Completely unnecessary and unneeded addition to the team.

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I dunno if Claremont was going through menopause or what but once Kitten aka Sprite aka Ariel the roller skating toothpick joined the team they became a bunch of pussified DC heroes.

 

I can't stand Kitty Pryde either. Completely unnecessary and unneeded addition to the team.

 

Mark you hurt me. :ohnoez: I can't let the Kitty bashing go on any longer. I think she is a great addition to the team. In fact she's my favorite female X-Man. The team needed more brains and a "younger" viewpoint; plus her power is pretty cool.

 

It appears I'm not the only Kitty Pryde fan:

 

See the poll from last Thursday and Friday at Comic Book Resources (thousands voted):

 

CBR - Favorite Female X-Man

 

CBR - Least Favorite Female X-man

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I *heart* Kitty Pryde. Her first appearance is the only X-men comic I still own! My best at the time was the only Jewish kid in our neighborhood. It was mostly Roman Catholics at the time. Mike was the only other kid on the street that read comics. We had that bond. I remember how excited he was when he found out Kitty was Jewish. "Kitty's a Jew! They made a Jewish X-man!!" Seriously, I can still hear him saying it.

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I *heart* Kitty Pryde. Her first appearance is the only X-men comic I still own! My best at the time was the only Jewish kid in our neighborhood. It was mostly Roman Catholics at the time. Mike was the only other kid on the street that read comics. We had that bond. I remember how excited he was when he found out Kitty was Jewish. "Kitty's a Jew! They made a Jewish X-man!!" Seriously, I can still hear him saying it.

 

Alright, some Kitty Pryde Love! <3 Thanks Rodey. (thumbs u

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I dunno if Claremont was going through menopause or what but once Kitten aka Sprite aka Ariel the roller skating toothpick joined the team they became a bunch of pussified DC heroes.

 

I can't stand Kitty Pryde either. Completely unnecessary and unneeded addition to the team.

 

Mark you hurt me. :ohnoez: I can't let the Kitty bashing go on any longer. I think she is a great addition to the team. In fact she's my favorite female X-Man. The team needed more brains and a "younger" viewpoint; plus her power is pretty cool.

 

It appears I'm not the only Kitty Pryde fan:

 

See the poll from last Thursday and Friday at Comic Book Resources (thousands voted):

 

CBR - Favorite Female X-Man

 

CBR - Least Favorite Female X-man

 

It's old 1983 Kitty Bashing Paul - and I am sorry :foryou: But all of a sudden the X-Men wasn't about Proteus, the Hellfire Club or the Wendigo. It was about "Professor Xavier is a Jerk!" and "Kitty's Fairy Tale"

 

It ruined the efficiency of the team every time they went out to battle. Everyone else had to worry about Kitten not getting killed when they allow her to go up against anything outside the Danger Room - where she should have remained until she graduated whining.

 

Praise the Marvel Gods that Be that Claremont was given the New Mutants to excercise his desire to write The Facts of Life and Growing Pains

 

NOW, having said that I think Kitty is one of my top 5 favorite X-Men right now in Wolverine and the X-Men which is probably my favorite comic going. The way she has been written for the last 10 years has been great and this last 2 years in W&TXM has been the best she's ever been written. I think her and Bobby dating will make for some good stories.

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I dunno if Claremont was going through menopause or what but once Kitten aka Sprite aka Ariel the roller skating toothpick joined the team they became a bunch of pussified DC heroes.

 

I can't stand Kitty Pryde either. Completely unnecessary and unneeded addition to the team.

 

Mark you hurt me. :ohnoez: I can't let the Kitty bashing go on any longer. I think she is a great addition to the team. In fact she's my favorite female X-Man. The team needed more brains and a "younger" viewpoint; plus her power is pretty cool.

 

It appears I'm not the only Kitty Pryde fan:

 

See the poll from last Thursday and Friday at Comic Book Resources (thousands voted):

 

CBR - Favorite Female X-Man

 

CBR - Least Favorite Female X-man

 

It's old 1983 Kitty Bashing Paul - and I am sorry :foryou: But all of a sudden the X-Men wasn't about Proteus, the Hellfire Club or the Wendigo. It was about "Professor Xavier is a Jerk!" and "Kitty's Fairy Tale"

 

It ruined the efficiency of the team every time they went out to battle. Everyone else had to worry about Kitten not getting killed when they allow her to go up against anything outside the Danger Room - where she should have remained until she graduated whining.

 

Praise the Marvel Gods that Be that Claremont was given the New Mutants to excercise his desire to write The Facts of Life and Growing Pains

 

NOW, having said that I think Kitty is one of my top 5 favorite X-Men right now in Wolverine and the X-Men which is probably my favorite comic going. The way she has been written for the last 10 years has been great and this last 2 years in W&TXM has been the best she's ever been written. I think her and Bobby dating will make for some good stories.

 

Ah Mark, I understand. Yes, Kitty has grown up. W&TXM is one of my favorite reads right now as well. I'm really looking forward to see how Wood handles her in X-Men Now.

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