Bigger SA Key: BB 28 or SC 22?

[BarryAllen]

BB28 is the clear winner to date.

 

I wonder how much of this has to do with the boom and bust of SC22...

 

How many on hear got burned on that book in one way or another?

[Bomber-Bob]

I think the story line in SC 22 is superior. The story line in BB28 seemed forced with each superhero getting an obligatory battle scene of a couple pages. The story in SC 22 is almost iconic, who didn't memorize the oath after reading it.

It's a very close call but I gotta go with BB28, a milestone book.

[zosocane]

DC also had Nick Cardy who drew some terrific Aquaman and Teen Titans covers in the 60s (and then some Action covers in the early 70s).

[bronze johnny]

Let's not forget Mike Sekowsky- the artist who drew the cover to BB 28.

[BarryAllen]

Let's not forget Mike Sekowsky- the artist who drew the cover to BB 28.

 

 

(thumbs u

 

[The_Captain]

...... and here I am having to admit I'd rather have an 8.5 copy of Challengers of the Unknown # 1 more than either of them...... what's wrong with me ? GOD BLESS...

 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus) (thumbs u

 

I go with BB28 hands down --- but just for you, JIMBO, one of my favs

 

 

Great book. Love the stamp!

[jimjum12]

...... and here I am having to admit I'd rather have an 8.5 copy of Challengers of the Unknown # 1 more than either of them...... what's wrong with me ? GOD BLESS...

 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus) (thumbs u

 

I go with BB28 hands down --- but just for you, JIMBO, one of my favs

 

 

..... man that is one good read...... I love that comic and I'm betting that copy won't show up in one of your sales threads any time soon. Many of the Showcase premieres were just awesome......and for the record, SC 22 is one of the best efforts...... and is still one of my favorite comics of all time..... better, but not more important than BB 28 .................GOD BLESS...

 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus) (thumbs u

[Ken Aldred]

 

 

 

I think the story line in SC 22 is superior. The story line in BB28 seemed forced with each superhero getting an obligatory battle scene of a couple pages. The story in SC 22 is almost iconic, who didn't memorize the oath after reading it.

 

Gardner Fox lazily reusing the same formula as in his GA JSA / All-Star stories.

[jjonahjameson1]

But are there really people who like silver age DC super-hero books for artistic reasons?

 

I mean, come on now, they are terrible.

 

You've got Infantino and Kane and that's about it.

 

Hey well, Marvel had horrible artists too, like Don Heck, Ayers, and George Tuska. Who'd they have besides Kirby and Ditko that were so awesome? (Wally Wood on DD doesn't count, too short a tenure).

 

DC had Kubert, Murphy Anderson and Neal Adams, Marvel had Gene Colan, John Romita and Bill Everett. Heck and Tuska weren't horrible, just not a good fit for superhero books, Tuska's crime stuff from the forties and fifties and Heck's pre-code output are quite good.

 

As for Ayers, well let's just say he was a decent inker.

 

But the comment was about SA super-heroes books, so for the specific question, "Heck and Tuska weren't horrible, just not a good fit for superhero books," = horrible. Bill Everett? What'd he do, a couple Sub-Mariner issues in the SA? He doesn't count. Not a big JRSR fan unless he's inking Gil Kane (like Swan, JRSR is decent, but too generic), but you reminded who I do like a lot: John Buscema.

 

...Ditko, Steranko, Adams, Severin, Everett (DD#1, Strange Tales, some TTA Subby Stories, Amazing Adventures, Captain America, Subby, etc)

[bronze johnny]

Other ways to distinguish these iconic SA keys:

 

- The Runaway Missile v. Starro, the Starfish

 

- Gil Kane v. Mike Sekowsky

 

- Blue v. Green (colors of covers)

 

- Individual v. Team

 

- 1st SA appearance v. 1st SA Superhero team (or new JSA?)

 

[DamageInc-migration]

Let's not forget Mike Sekowsky- the artist who drew the cover to BB 28.

 

I'd like to forget him, he's not very good. It's his art and later Dillin's art that make the JLA run very hard to collect. I want to buy more JLA, but every time I see that art inside I remember why I don't.

[DamageInc-migration]

But are there really people who like silver age DC super-hero books for artistic reasons?

 

I mean, come on now, they are terrible.

 

You've got Infantino and Kane and that's about it.

 

Hey well, Marvel had horrible artists too, like Don Heck, Ayers, and George Tuska. Who'd they have besides Kirby and Ditko that were so awesome? (Wally Wood on DD doesn't count, too short a tenure).

 

DC had Kubert, Murphy Anderson and Neal Adams, Marvel had Gene Colan, John Romita and Bill Everett. Heck and Tuska weren't horrible, just not a good fit for superhero books, Tuska's crime stuff from the forties and fifties and Heck's pre-code output are quite good.

 

As for Ayers, well let's just say he was a decent inker.

 

But the comment was about SA super-heroes books, so for the specific question, "Heck and Tuska weren't horrible, just not a good fit for superhero books," = horrible. Bill Everett? What'd he do, a couple Sub-Mariner issues in the SA? He doesn't count. Not a big JRSR fan unless he's inking Gil Kane (like Swan, JRSR is decent, but too generic), but you reminded who I do like a lot: John Buscema.

 

...Ditko, Steranko, Adams, Severin, Everett (DD#1, Strange Tales, some TTA Subby Stories, Amazing Adventures, Captain America, Subby, etc)

 

Ditko: I did say "besides Kirby and Ditko". Plus, Ditko did work for DC in the late SA.

Steranko - ok, late SA.

Adams - . If he counts for Marvel, he definitely counts for DC first.

John Severin? He inked a few Hulk books, that does not make him a top superhero artist. (You couldn't have meant Marie, her art is awful, John's is awesome) Same with Everett (I can't believe he even gets a mention in the SA).

 

So, back to chrisware's crazy point, it's really pretty equal. Both sides can say that they had a Top 2 set of awesome artists, then a few good ones after that, and then a bunch of hacks. To try to say that Marvel was vastly superior artistically to DC in the SA is really ridiculous.

[TeddieMercede]

22.

[chrisware]

But are there really people who like silver age DC super-hero books for artistic reasons?

 

I mean, come on now, they are terrible.

 

You've got Infantino and Kane and that's about it.

 

Hey well, Marvel had horrible artists too, like Don Heck, Ayers, and George Tuska. Who'd they have besides Kirby and Ditko that were so awesome? (Wally Wood on DD doesn't count, too short a tenure).

 

They had Steranko, Romita, Buscema, and Colan.

[chrisware]

But are there really people who like silver age DC super-hero books for artistic reasons?

 

I mean, come on now, they are terrible.

 

You've got Infantino and Kane and that's about it.

 

Hey well, Marvel had horrible artists too, like Don Heck, Ayers, and George Tuska. Who'd they have besides Kirby and Ditko that were so awesome? (Wally Wood on DD doesn't count, too short a tenure).

 

DC had Kubert, Murphy Anderson and Neal Adams, Marvel had Gene Colan, John Romita and Bill Everett. Heck and Tuska weren't horrible, just not a good fit for superhero books, Tuska's crime stuff from the forties and fifties and Heck's pre-code output are quite good.

 

As for Ayers, well let's just say he was a decent inker.

 

Kubert's a great artist--but a terrible fit for super-hero stuff. Anderson is about as good as Heck or Tuska--which is not very.

[chrisware]

DC also had Nick Cardy who drew some terrific Aquaman and Teen Titans covers in the 60s (and then some Action covers in the early 70s).

 

Cardy did draw some excellent covers, but his interior art is weak.

[chrisware]

Let's not forget Mike Sekowsky- the artist who drew the cover to BB 28.

 

Sekowsky is horrible.

 

Nothing worse than buying a comic with a Neal Adams cover and opening it up to see Sekowsky "art."

[chrisware]

Let's not forget Mike Sekowsky- the artist who drew the cover to BB 28.

 

I'd like to forget him, he's not very good. It's his art and later Dillin's art that make the JLA run very hard to collect. I want to buy more JLA, but every time I see that art inside I remember why I don't.

 

True dat!

[chrisware]

But are there really people who like silver age DC super-hero books for artistic reasons?

 

I mean, come on now, they are terrible.

 

You've got Infantino and Kane and that's about it.

 

Hey well, Marvel had horrible artists too, like Don Heck, Ayers, and George Tuska. Who'd they have besides Kirby and Ditko that were so awesome? (Wally Wood on DD doesn't count, too short a tenure).

 

DC had Kubert, Murphy Anderson and Neal Adams, Marvel had Gene Colan, John Romita and Bill Everett. Heck and Tuska weren't horrible, just not a good fit for superhero books, Tuska's crime stuff from the forties and fifties and Heck's pre-code output are quite good.

 

As for Ayers, well let's just say he was a decent inker.

 

But the comment was about SA super-heroes books, so for the specific question, "Heck and Tuska weren't horrible, just not a good fit for superhero books," = horrible. Bill Everett? What'd he do, a couple Sub-Mariner issues in the SA? He doesn't count. Not a big JRSR fan unless he's inking Gil Kane (like Swan, JRSR is decent, but too generic), but you reminded who I do like a lot: John Buscema.

 

...Ditko, Steranko, Adams, Severin, Everett (DD#1, Strange Tales, some TTA Subby Stories, Amazing Adventures, Captain America, Subby, etc)

 

Ditko: I did say "besides Kirby and Ditko". Plus, Ditko did work for DC in the late SA.

Steranko - ok, late SA.

Adams - . If he counts for Marvel, he definitely counts for DC first.

John Severin? He inked a few Hulk books, that does not make him a top superhero artist. (You couldn't have meant Marie, her art is awful, John's is awesome) Same with Everett (I can't believe he even gets a mention in the SA).

 

So, back to chrisware's crazy point, it's really pretty equal. Both sides can say that they had a Top 2 set of awesome artists, then a few good ones after that, and then a bunch of hacks. To try to say that Marvel was vastly superior artistically to DC in the SA is really ridiculous.

 

Except that Kirby is worth a dozen Infantinos or Kanes. And he produced 3 books a month, so the number of artists is hardly relevant.

 

Besides, my original point was that the DC books were terrible mostly due to the writing.

 

But let's compare.

 

Marvel:

 

FF, Thor, and Cap by Kirby.

 

First 8 issues of Avengers and first 11 issues of X-men (plus breakdowns on 12-16) by Kirby.

 

First 5 Hulks by Kirby (plus Ditko on the 6).

 

Spider-Man by Ditko and then Romita.

 

Ditko's Dr. Strange.

 

Buscema on the Avengers for a long run.

 

Daredevil by Colan. Also a 30 issue run on Iron Man.

 

Mix in various Steranko stuff and Adams' short X-Men run.

 

DC:

 

Flash--great art, insipid writing.

 

Green Lantern, Atom--ditto.

 

Superman/Action--competent art by Swan mixed with lesser artists and awful stories.

 

Some nice Adams covers. (The vast majority of his interior work is from the 70s.)

 

And then drek.

 

[Ken Aldred]

 

Kubert's a great artist--but a terrible fit for super-hero stuff.

 

Kubert's Hawkman artwork was excellent. Some of my favourite SA super-hero material.