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Where in the world was the Quality Control at CGC???
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Started by Wally's Comics,

5,190 posts in this topic

comicwiz

comicwiz

Posted
Posted
Someone had mentioned the label could not be swapped because it was enclosed within the seam of the sealed well.

 

If this was a case of tampering, and I think it is, there is a scenario where the label doesn't have to be removed. The consignor has two slabs, one is an 8.0 and the other is a 5.0 (the problem book). He gently removes the inner well of the 8.0, leaving the label intact. He deslabs the 5.0 but leaves it in the inner well. He then places the 5.0 into the 8.0 slab. You now have an 8.0 slab, label intact and never touched, with a 5.0 book in the inner well. Trust me, you can crack open a slab and remove the inner well with minimal evidence of tampering. I think CGC will find that the hairline crack an inch below the top corner is the evidence.

 

The only thing is that the serial number on this book matches an 8.0 grade. In order for a label swap scheme to work in this scenario, the label swapping would require a donor that actually got that grade. I'm not completely eliminating the possibility that this is one of the biggest gift grades I've seen in a slab to date, but if it is a case of tampering (and I've mentioned the things I see off about about slab, but 100% certainty is impossible from scans alone) then the more likely scenario is a label swap. You'd need at least one well style with an open top sleeve to remove and reseat the label to pull this off.

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VintageComics

VintageComics

Posted
Posted
How hard would it be to etch the serial on the slab say on the back at the very bottom of the slab.

Course this would add to cost.

 

But how would that help? The issue isn't making sure the label aligns with the outer slab, it's making sure the label aligns with the comic.

 

Easy to access grading notes sounds like an excellent theft deterrent. Probably the best one.

 

 

 

 

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comicwiz

comicwiz

Posted
Posted
How hard would it be to etch the serial on the slab say on the back at the very bottom of the slab.

Course this would add to cost.

 

But how would that help? The issue isn't making sure the label aligns with the outer slab, it's making sure the label aligns with the comic.

 

Yeah, this is why I think they haven't done anything to engineer a solution that at least helps them track potential tampering without needing books submitted for review in every case. But it doesn't mean they don't need to start doing something. Letter stamp/etching some system of coding the outer shell and well in a way that could be ID'd from a listing could help immensely in situations where the owner blows off recommendations to send the book in for review, and could possibly fast track tampering claims to help buyers get their refunds, or to help CGC pursue incidents of outright fraud.

 

When I found the fake AFA 90 Star Wars 21 Back Boba Fett (linked to earlier in this thread), Chad had mentioned they established contact with the seller. In this case, the seller was even boasting about his AFA "reproduction" in the listing. While it made for a listing description that would not cause him trouble from a buyer claiming he was passing off a fake for real, the situation made it a bit awkward for recovery. I think the seller blew AFA off, and ended-up selling the piece to a guy in Winnipeg, who turned around and tried to sell it on Facebook for $4K.

 

It's still out there, and I guess my point in explaining this is with CGC having so many different style wells and outer shells, some naming convention or letter coding for each style could help ID and track mismatched slabs in the wild. This situation worked out better than most because MCS were the consignor, and responded well to ensure any doubt is removed by having CGC inspect it. But we also saw the case of non-compliance with Wilson and the RSR comics Mark Zaid had requested be submitted for review.

 

This is definitely an area of vigilance and patrolling I would have like to see with more teeth as I have yet to see a situation play out where the owner of the slab needs to comply by law, or can excuse himself out of landing themselves in legal hot water by saying they bought the book like that. Interestingly enough, I've caught several reproduction carded figures on eBay where the seller had no idea they were fakes/counterfeits, and almost every one of them were dumped or sold to them at a convention/show.

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rjpb

rjpb

Posted
Posted

My first reaction was no worse than 4.5. While it has obvious corner wear and spine ticks, it's actually a pretty solid copy, and it would be an acceptable 5.0, and based on some GA grades I've seen, it's not inconceivable that it could get a 6.0 from CGC on the right day. Much above that, if it's not a substitution it would have to qualify as an embarrassingly lax grade, the kind that makes buying raw off of ebay seem less a risk for overgrading.

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MrBedrock

MrBedrock

Posted
Posted
How hard would it be to etch the serial on the slab say on the back at the very bottom of the slab.

Course this would add to cost.

 

But how would that help? The issue isn't making sure the label aligns with the outer slab, it's making sure the label aligns with the comic.

 

Yeah, this is why I think they haven't done anything to engineer a solution that at least helps them track potential tampering without needing books submitted for review in every case.

They could etch the serial number into the cover of the comic.

Or maybe brand the outer cover with a big hot branding iron.

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RockMyAmadeus

RockMyAmadeus

Posted
Posted
How hard would it be to etch the serial on the slab say on the back at the very bottom of the slab.

Course this would add to cost.

 

But how would that help? The issue isn't making sure the label aligns with the outer slab, it's making sure the label aligns with the comic.

 

Yeah, this is why I think they haven't done anything to engineer a solution that at least helps them track potential tampering without needing books submitted for review in every case.

They could etch the serial number into the cover of the comic.

Or maybe brand the outer cover with a big hot branding iron.

 

It would be just like Sig Series!

 

:idea:

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comicwiz

comicwiz

Posted
Posted
First time looking at this thread. I'd grade the book F/VF (5.0) based on what I see. (I haven't looked at the grade yet.)

 

Have enough to drink to give you beer goggles, see double, and that's almost what the final grade on the label adds up to.

 

Just make sure to close your browser if PayPal shows up on your screen, because the beer is making the comic look that good.

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comicwiz

comicwiz

Posted
Posted
How hard would it be to etch the serial on the slab say on the back at the very bottom of the slab.

Course this would add to cost.

 

But how would that help? The issue isn't making sure the label aligns with the outer slab, it's making sure the label aligns with the comic.

 

Yeah, this is why I think they haven't done anything to engineer a solution that at least helps them track potential tampering without needing books submitted for review in every case.

They could etch the serial number into the cover of the comic.

Or maybe brand the outer cover with a big hot branding iron.

 

It would be just like Sig Series!

 

:idea:

 

image.jpg

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telerites

telerites

Posted
Posted
How hard would it be to etch the serial on the slab say on the back at the very bottom of the slab.

Course this would add to cost.

 

But how would that help? The issue isn't making sure the label aligns with the outer slab, it's making sure the label aligns with the comic.

 

Yeah, this is why I think they haven't done anything to engineer a solution that at least helps them track potential tampering without needing books submitted for review in every case.

They could etch the serial number into the cover of the comic.

Or maybe brand the outer cover with a big hot branding iron.

 

It would be just like Sig Series!

 

:idea:

 

Probably not too farfetched. After all there is CSV, which I think is an absurd waste.

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Cat-Man_America

Cat-Man_America

Posted
Posted
How hard would it be to etch the serial on the slab say on the back at the very bottom of the slab.

Course this would add to cost.

 

But how would that help? The issue isn't making sure the label aligns with the outer slab, it's making sure the label aligns with the comic.

 

Yeah, this is why I think they haven't done anything to engineer a solution that at least helps them track potential tampering without needing books submitted for review in every case.

They could etch the serial number into the cover of the comic.

Or maybe brand the outer cover with a big hot branding iron.

 

qdraw.gif A bodacious solution that would work especially well with COW interiors. cow.gif

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mdean2437

mdean2437

Posted
Posted (edited)

Just imagine if the seller of this paid 8.0 money for it. Man that would suck. Can you imagine his surprise when the auction house informs him they had CGC regrade his book to a 4-5.0. Man that is a tough spot to be in from everybody's perspective.

Edited by mdean2437
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