GeeksAreMyPeeps Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 On 11/28/2022 at 9:06 PM, Jaydogrules said: That calculus has changed in the spec age where a characters potential appearance in a movie or TV show and the degree of success/failure of that can completely make or break a book. Miles morales is a spec character and there are loads of copies of the UF 4 variant out there, most auctions seem to have at least one 9.8 copy for sale nowadays including the two copies coming up on heritage, as well as lower grades, not to mention for sale on ebay and instagram every day. It literally is the warehouse book that plenty of people in this forum at one point speculated the ASM 667 Dell'otto "could be". ASM 667 will always be king. -J. You're missing the point. ASM 667 has nothing going for it except rarity. And it's artificial rarity, since it's an incentive book. Not like it's some Golden Age book of which only a few survive because most people didn't treat them like collectibles. UF4 is a first appearance of an important character. Miles graduated from being a "spec character" some time ago. Already the featured character in one major movie, with at least one more on the way. I'm not particularly knowledgable about video games, but it appears that the video game he was the main character in was highly successful as well. Since comic collecting has been a thing, most collectors have consistently sought out the first appearance of characters, especially important characters. Seeking out an alternate, artificially scarce cover of a book is a relatively new phenomenon, and it remains to be seen whether that's just a fad. catch21 and I like pie 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted November 29, 2022 Author Share Posted November 29, 2022 On 11/29/2022 at 8:07 AM, GeeksAreMyPeeps said: You're missing the point. ASM 667 has nothing going for it except rarity. And it's artificial rarity, since it's an incentive book. Not like it's some Golden Age book of which only a few survive because most people didn't treat them like collectibles. UF4 is a first appearance of an important character. Miles graduated from being a "spec character" some time ago. Already the featured character in one major movie, with at least one more on the way. I'm not particularly knowledgable about video games, but it appears that the video game he was the main character in was highly successful as well. Since comic collecting has been a thing, most collectors have consistently sought out the first appearance of characters, especially important characters. Seeking out an alternate, artificially scarce cover of a book is a relatively new phenomenon, and it remains to be seen whether that's just a fad. I vehemently disagree with morales not being a spec chatacter. People weren't allegedly paying those prices for any version of UF 4 based on cartoons and video games , it was on the speculation that morales would somehow be in No Way Home, despite marvel not having the rights, and it's still based on the dream that he will get a solo live action movie at some point in the next decade. My personal opinion is that miles was little more than a pandemic flash in the pan, and beneficiary of a particular political environment that is already waning. As for the 667, I'm not going to rehash for the millionth time what it has "going for it", however sufficeth to say it is much more than the fact that just a couple hundred were printed 12 years ago. There's lots of rare variants out there that sell for little or nothing and many of those (*gasp!) have first appearances. -J. Lazyboy, ygogolak and I like pie 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broke as a Joke Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 The 667 has nothing but rarity going for it. It's not even a great cover compared to other Del'Otto pieces. I'd rather have a UF4 variant long term for sure. Tried and true ASM completists will be the only ones pining for this one (667) in the future and with the overwhelming renumbering and depth of variants out now those types of need it all collectors have been shrinking fast. GeeksAreMyPeeps and I like pie 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted November 29, 2022 Author Share Posted November 29, 2022 On 11/29/2022 at 10:55 AM, Broke as a Joke said: The 667 has nothing but rarity going for it. It's not even a great cover compared to other Del'Otto pieces. I'd rather have a UF4 variant long term for sure. Tried and true ASM completists will be the only ones pining for this one (667) in the future and with the overwhelming renumbering and depth of variants out now those types of need it all collectors have been shrinking fast. Still suffering from ASM 667 Derangement Syndrome I see. You've only been wrong for nearly 10 years now, no need to break the streak now I suppose. -J. I like pie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maloney414 Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 The debate between two great books and which is better… Yes, ASM 667 is rare and there aren’t enough for the ASM collectors who want it. Ultimate Fallout #4 variant at 9.8 isn’t going away either. 1st appearance of a popular character, regular cover doesn’t have him on the cover in costume. A 1:25 book with a black cover. It may dip for awhile, but it’s a tough book to get in 9.8. Miles isn’t going anywhere. He’s all upside in the MCU. It will be interesting to read these posts again in 5 years. 😂 RockMyAmadeus, Sauce Dog and justafan 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeeksAreMyPeeps Posted November 30, 2022 Share Posted November 30, 2022 On 11/29/2022 at 1:38 PM, Jaydogrules said: I vehemently disagree with morales not being a spec chatacter. People weren't allegedly paying those prices for any version of UF 4 based on cartoons and video games , it was on the speculation that morales would somehow be in No Way Home, despite marvel not having the rights, and it's still based on the dream that he will get a solo live action movie at some point in the next decade. My personal opinion is that miles was little more than a pandemic flash in the pan, and beneficiary of a particular political environment that is already waning. As for the 667, I'm not going to rehash for the millionth time what it has "going for it", however sufficeth to say it is much more than the fact that just a couple hundred were printed 12 years ago. There's lots of rare variants out there that sell for little or nothing and many of those (*gasp!) have first appearances. -J. Prices for UF4 started their upward trajectory off when the video game was announced. But by all means, show me another "spec character" whose first appearance sells for anywhere near where UF4 sells. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted November 30, 2022 Author Share Posted November 30, 2022 On 11/29/2022 at 7:05 PM, GeeksAreMyPeeps said: Prices for UF4 started their upward trajectory off when the video game was announced. But by all means, show me another "spec character" whose first appearance sells for anywhere near where UF4 sells. There are none. There are characters that have actually already been in plenty of video games, cartoons, and successful live action movies even that don't sell for that. ....and that's your first red flag. -J. I like pie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeeksAreMyPeeps Posted November 30, 2022 Share Posted November 30, 2022 On 11/29/2022 at 10:20 PM, Jaydogrules said: There are none. There are characters that have actually already been in plenty of video games, cartoons, and successful live action movies even that don't sell for that. ....and that's your first red flag. -J. Yes, they don't sell for that… because they're not the real deal. Thank you for playing. I like pie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted November 30, 2022 Author Share Posted November 30, 2022 On 11/30/2022 at 5:38 AM, GeeksAreMyPeeps said: Yes, they don't sell for that… because they're not the real deal. Thank you for playing. Really? Deadpool , harley Quinn, spider -gwen , X -23, kamala , carnage, etc, are all going nowhere also-rans? Got it. Or.... big red flag. -J. I like pie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeeksAreMyPeeps Posted November 30, 2022 Share Posted November 30, 2022 On 11/30/2022 at 10:49 AM, Jaydogrules said: Really? Deadpool , harley Quinn, spider -gwen , X -23, kamala , carnage, etc, are all going nowhere also-rans? Got it. Or.... big red flag. -J. Not sure what you think you're proving by comparing apples to oranges. Deadpool, Harley, Carnage… all hugely popular, sure. But their first appearances had much bigger print runs than the book in question here, so are much more widely available. I wouldn't put X-23 in the category of the other characters, but even so, same situation regarding availability of 9.8s. Kamala's situation is a little different with so many different books to pick from for key firsts. That leaves Gwen as the most comparable. Very popular; I'd argue not quite as popular as Miles. Has appeared in a movie but not been the title character. The Land variant is approaching 5 figures in 9.8, and there are more than twice as many of them on the census as the UF4 variant. Now, maybe the prices for both of them won't keep up. But I think whatever price correction those may be subjected to in the future will also be reflected in the 667 variant. My long-term pick is still Miles. I like pie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maloney414 Posted November 30, 2022 Share Posted November 30, 2022 On 11/30/2022 at 10:49 AM, Jaydogrules said: Really? Deadpool , harley Quinn, spider -gwen , X -23, kamala , carnage, etc, are all going nowhere also-rans? Got it. Or.... big red flag. -J. None of those books are as rare to get in 9.8 as the UF#4 variant. I wouldn’t compare any of those 1st appearances to UF#4 Variant 9.8… I like pie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted December 1, 2022 Author Share Posted December 1, 2022 On 11/30/2022 at 2:47 PM, maloney414 said: None of those books are as rare to get in 9.8 as the UF#4 variant. I wouldn’t compare any of those 1st appearances to UF#4 Variant 9.8… Oh but wait I thought that rarity didn't matter ? Because I can get a first appearance of morales for $1500. -J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted December 1, 2022 Author Share Posted December 1, 2022 Final results from comiclink auction: ASM 667 Dell'otto - $42k UF 4- $33k The gap widens significantly. -J. I like pie and justafan 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted December 1, 2022 Author Share Posted December 1, 2022 (edited) Other comiclink result - #3 book On the list- Wolverine 1 Campbell- $11k -J. Edited December 1, 2022 by Jaydogrules Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeeksAreMyPeeps Posted December 1, 2022 Share Posted December 1, 2022 On 11/30/2022 at 7:36 PM, Jaydogrules said: Oh but wait I thought that rarity didn't matter ? Because I can get a first appearance of morales for $1500. -J. I don't recall anyone indicating that rarity didn't matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted December 10, 2022 Author Share Posted December 10, 2022 The 17k ebay copy re-listed. We'll see where it ends up this time. https://www.ebay.com/itm/285058528449?hash=item425ecff4c1:g:1hQAAOSw5wVjiBO2&amdata=enc:AQAHAAAAoJVXWzLyGAvUku8U8yn9wDK4VQxAxzrVLaw8hwv8EIhOgxxe40Yknx1+TfP8AZtnKvTp9ocZ3FLKIONQ1zv/WutEYdepwEYAw+YUGGOo+GxtqXaFx8xaQvn/KhSkK4ho/5ii2OHjtARArdWksxSkwFAS+XUcAqG6Av/2IgBCeaAINZe3+IzcINN+5wPPW3gUP8rDxc+KvUx7+Io2fXN/EXQ=|tkp:Bk9SR873sd2fYQ&redirect=mobile -J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laugh at Life Posted December 11, 2022 Share Posted December 11, 2022 On 12/10/2022 at 2:00 PM, Jaydogrules said: The 17k ebay copy re-listed. We'll see where it ends up this time. https://www.ebay.com/itm/285058528449?hash=item425ecff4c1:g:1hQAAOSw5wVjiBO2&amdata=enc:AQAHAAAAoJVXWzLyGAvUku8U8yn9wDK4VQxAxzrVLaw8hwv8EIhOgxxe40Yknx1+TfP8AZtnKvTp9ocZ3FLKIONQ1zv/WutEYdepwEYAw+YUGGOo+GxtqXaFx8xaQvn/KhSkK4ho/5ii2OHjtARArdWksxSkwFAS+XUcAqG6Av/2IgBCeaAINZe3+IzcINN+5wPPW3gUP8rDxc+KvUx7+Io2fXN/EXQ=|tkp:Bk9SR873sd2fYQ&redirect=mobile -J. Same seller, different copy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted December 11, 2022 Author Share Posted December 11, 2022 On 12/10/2022 at 9:51 PM, Laugh at Life said: Same seller, different copy. Is GPA still showing the 17k sale ? -J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laugh at Life Posted December 11, 2022 Share Posted December 11, 2022 On 12/11/2022 at 2:10 AM, Jaydogrules said: Is GPA still showing the 17k sale ? -J. Yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted December 11, 2022 Author Share Posted December 11, 2022 On 12/11/2022 at 6:09 AM, Laugh at Life said: Yes Interesting. We'll see how this one stacks up in a few hours. Thank you ! -J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
