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80s X-men discussion
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84 posts in this topic

When I went back and read the classic Byrne 129-143 and then the Brood saga, I wondered why they couldn't come up with that kind of magic.

Byrne left, and Claremont's ADD had the run of the place.

 

I do not think that most people realize the amount of influence to the story that Byrne actually contributed.

(thumbs u

 

Byrne was instrumental in shaping and directing the story lines. He took that excellence over to FF. After that, Claremont continued to come up with fantastic concepts and stories, but they became more and more disorganized, with plot threads and subplots left to dangle.

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The run of stories that Romita worked on was pretty darn good reading.

 

I felt that his solo work was very different tonally, readable enough at times, occasionally far too wordy, as with the Avengers Annual, but not at the level of his collaborations with Byrne. And, far better than his late 90s X-Men material, which I found to be practically unreadable.

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X-Men in the 80's was a disaster. After Byrne left, Claremont lost his ability to write coherent storylines.

 

Yes, I have no doubt that it thrilled 7-13 year old boys with no critical thinking skills, but as literature, it's a mess.

 

The last coherent, completed, excellent storyline in X-Men was Days of Future Past. Everything after that is a jumble of endlessly unresolved plot threads, confusing motivations, illogical behavior, and gaping inconsistencies.

 

Anyone ever red Avengers Annual #10...?

 

Tell me...what happened in that book?

 

Not the "action", that's easy to describe.

 

What was the PLOT of that book...?

 

:popcorn:

 

That book crystallizes everything that was wrong with the X-Men in the 80's.

 

Meanwhile, over at DC, Alan Moore was turning the world upside down with Swamp Thing, and Miller was breathtaking on DD, Ronin, and Dark Knight,

 

:

 

 

I wonder if anyone red this post...

 

hm

 

:D

 

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When I went back and read the classic Byrne 129-143 and then the Brood saga, I wondered why they couldn't come up with that kind of magic.

Byrne left, and Claremont's ADD had the run of the place.

 

I do not think that most people realize the amount of influence to the story that Byrne actually contributed.

(thumbs u

 

Byrne was instrumental in shaping and directing the story lines. He took that excellence over to FF. After that, Claremont continued to come up with fantastic concepts and stories, but they became more and more disorganized, with plot threads and subplots left to dangle.

 

 

I've said this before, but as a big picture guy, Claremont had some really, really good ideas. X-Men #105-108 is EXCELLENT, probably the best story published in comics at that time.

 

As a specific plot and dialogue guy...not so much.

 

And, with no one to rein him in, he just went to hell.

 

Anyone who says that X-Men #144 up compares with the best being produced on the market at the time is high, or suffering from rose-colored nostalgic myopia (and believe me, no one is entirely immune to THAT seductress.)

 

 

 

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When I went back and read the classic Byrne 129-143 and then the Brood saga, I wondered why they couldn't come up with that kind of magic.

Byrne left, and Claremont's ADD had the run of the place.

 

I do not think that most people realize the amount of influence to the story that Byrne actually contributed.

 

I think they finally did after they realized Claremont couldn't capture the magic again without him.

 

Same thing happened to Byrne years later as well I think.

 

 

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When I went back and read the classic Byrne 129-143 and then the Brood saga, I wondered why they couldn't come up with that kind of magic.

Byrne left, and Claremont's ADD had the run of the place.

 

I do not think that most people realize the amount of influence to the story that Byrne actually contributed.

 

whatever the case, I agree that everything after byrne stunk terribly.

 

Most overrated series of all time.

 

I think that's a little harsh. Was it as good? No not close, but there were several stories in there that kept my attention during that period.

 

I actually like the 2nd Brood saga better then the 1st I think. Add mutants to it made it more interesting.

 

I thought the overlaying tone of Mutant hatred in the 180s thru 210s kept me interested. I didn't care for Life Death, but loved some of the Peter/Kitty moments.

 

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The run of stories that Romita worked on was pretty darn good reading.

 

I felt that his solo work was very different tonally, readable enough at times, occasionally far too wordy, as with the Avengers Annual, but not at the level of his collaborations with Byrne. And, far better than his late 90s X-Men material, which I found to be practically unreadable.

 

Agreed

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When I went back and read the classic Byrne 129-143 and then the Brood saga, I wondered why they couldn't come up with that kind of magic.

Byrne left, and Claremont's ADD had the run of the place.

 

I do not think that most people realize the amount of influence to the story that Byrne actually contributed.

(thumbs u

 

Byrne was instrumental in shaping and directing the story lines. He took that excellence over to FF. After that, Claremont continued to come up with fantastic concepts and stories, but they became more and more disorganized, with plot threads and subplots left to dangle.

 

Yes he started to leave plot lines dangling even to a teenager at the time I was confused. The whole Mystique/Nightcrawler angle was never fully explained. (Years later it was, but I doubt that was his plan.) The morlocks and marauders as well just weren't tied up well.

 

I did like Rachel though. That retelling of her future is still chilling to me especially since went back and ready 141-142 because of it at the time. That image of Xavier being blown away was shocking back then.

 

Edited by Fastballspecial
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Seemed like it was changed a few times.

I thought it was Bishop.

But also Xavier when he became Onslaught.

 

 

I loved Nimrod. I know they've used him somewhat recently. But it seemed like a character they should have used more throughout the years. Frankly could have been the evolution of the Sentinels.

 

Patrick

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After Byrne, everything felt like a low budget sequel. I liked a few things here and there, but overall there were far better stuff happing elsewhere.

 

(Edit I liked Nimrod also)

Edited by Rip
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Did Claremont ever reveal who betrayed the X-men in the future?

It seemed to have been left hanging along with mysteries.

 

As part of which plot/subplot?

 

The whole reason Bishop came back from the future was he was chasing Fitzroy. Then it was revealed that he knew the X men were killed and betrayed by one of their own, with a message from Jean Grey left in the mansion archives.

 

During the Onslaught story arc, that same message was left by Jean Grey, as she exclaimed to Xavier, now Onslaught, on the message he was the betrayer of the Xmen.

 

Onslaught came about when Xavier wiped Magneto's mind after his attack on Wolverine, pulling his adamantium off his skeleton and through his wounds. A part of Magneto manifested itself in Xaviers mind, hence how Onslaught made his physical appearance like Magneto's.

 

Onslaught's first victim was none other than Juggernaut, a resolution to petty revenge from Xavier being bullied by Cain Marko when they were young.

 

Supposedly

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these were the books I looked forward too the most each month. the 2 issue arc with the avengers with colossus and vision on one of the covers were great. like I said,top of the pile for sure...until secret wars came out..

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We take it way too damn serious.

Tons of people clearly enjoy X-men for a prolonged period of time.

 

I personally enjoyed the Siege Perilous story. I know people disliked it. But I loved the Fall of the Mutants, Inferno, etc.

 

Patrick

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We take it way too damn serious.

Tons of people clearly enjoy X-men for a prolonged period of time.

 

I personally enjoyed the Siege Perilous story. I know people disliked it. But I loved the Fall of the Mutants, Inferno, etc.

 

Patrick

 

I made it to right before Bishop before I stopped each month. Around 275 I had enough and when Lee left that was pretty much it.

 

I tried several times since and the book just doesn't resonate with me anymore. I often wonder if my age has something to do with it now. X-men still sells today even though Marvel is spitting all over them.

 

I feel for teenagers looking for comics today to help them identify and enjoy.

We had Teen Titans and X-men among others. Each dealt with social issues while addressing larger seems of ignorance and prejudice. Where do they find that today?

 

 

Edited by Fastballspecial
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We take it way too damn serious.

Tons of people clearly enjoy X-men for a prolonged period of time.

 

I personally enjoyed the Siege Perilous story. I know people disliked it. But I loved the Fall of the Mutants, Inferno, etc.

 

Patrick

 

 

Describe the plot to Siege Perilous. How it came about, and what were the results.

 

I dare you.

 

:D

 

 

 

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We take it way too damn serious.

Tons of people clearly enjoy X-men for a prolonged period of time.

 

I personally enjoyed the Siege Perilous story. I know people disliked it. But I loved the Fall of the Mutants, Inferno, etc.

 

Patrick

 

 

Describe the plot to Siege Perilous. How it came about, and what were the results.

 

I dare you.

 

:D

 

 

 

The X-Men jumped into a magic mirror and Psylocke turned into an Asian ninja lady. And Jubilee. :cool:

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