Should I buy new comic books? 1 1

[Nathan81]

From an investment standpoint, is it a good idea to buy new comic books? I've been buying new comics recently, and have wondered if I should just buy old books, and focus on quality over quantity. Although I enjoy speculating that something might become valuable, and the idea of getting something at cover price that might be worth hundreds someday, I don't want to through money away though. Most of my collection is from the first half of the 90's, and if I was to try to sell them, I don't think I could even get cover price back for most of them, and those are 25 years old. Most of the books that I bought as a teenager that are valuable now, I purchased after they already had some value, not new. I used to think that with enough time, everything would become valuable, but sadly that doesn't seem to be the case. I was a teenager then and I think I have a better eye now. If I don't buy new comic books, I could miss out on something that becomes valuable. I've bought some sets of more recent books on eBay, and maybe that is the way to go, because the sets are usually less that cover price per book. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Edited October 22, 2017 by Nathan81

[Mercury Man]

2 hours ago, Nathan81 said:

From an investment standpoint, is it a good idea to buy new comic books? I've been buying new comics recently, and have wondered if I should just buy old books, and focus on quality over quantity. Although I enjoy speculating that something might become valuable, and the idea of getting something at cover price that might be worth hundreds someday, I don't want to through money away though. Most of my collection is from the first half of the 90's, and if I was to try to sell them, I don't think I could even get cover price back for most of them, and those are 25 years old. Most of the books that I bought as a teenager that are valuable now, I purchased after they already had some value, not new. I used to think that with enough time, everything would become valuable, but sadly that doesn't seem to be the case. I was a teenager then and I think I have a better eye now. If I don't buy new comic books, I could miss out on something that becomes valuable. I've bought some sets of more recent books on eBay, and maybe that is the way to go, because the sets are usually less that cover price per book. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

You are probably going to get a mix of responses, but from an investment standpoint, new comic books are for the most part, going to let you down.  You will hear stories from people about how they flipped books for hundreds of dollars, and how some own an ultra rare variant that nobody has ever seen on the market, and how it can be done,  but  that is just speculators selling to speculators.   Eventually somebody gets left holding the bag, and that will thin out the hobby like it did in the early 90's.   The dollar boxes are filled with 'Investment' books from 20-30 years ago.  Filled to the tune of millions.  Buy new comics because you like the character, artwork or stories.  If for some reason what you have goes up in value, that's a bonus.  Quality over Quantity is always the smart collectibles play. 

Edited October 22, 2017 by Mercury Man

[Nathan81]

1 hour ago, Mercury Man said:

You are probably going to get a mix of responses, but from an investment standpoint, new comic books are for the most part, going to let you down.  You will hear stories from people about how they flipped books for hundreds of dollars, and how some own an ultra rare variant that nobody has ever seen on the market, and how it can be done,  but  that is just speculators selling to speculators.   Eventually somebody gets left holding the bag, and that will thin out the hobby like it did in the early 90's.   The dollar boxes are filled with 'Investment' books from 20-30 years ago.  Filled to the tune of millions.  Buy new comics because you like the character, artwork or stories.  If for some reason what you have goes up in value, that's a bonus.  Quality over Quantity is always the smart collectibles play. 

Thanks Mercury. I think I’ll still buy some new comics, but try to limit that and save money for older books. Older Marvel books seem like a safe choice.

On the other hand there seems to me to be better titles out now than in the past, plus smaller print runs could equal this being a better time to collect new books than the 90’s. Like the stuff image is doing now seems more sophisticated or more tasteful than things from the 90’s.

You’re right about “investment” books. I bought books in the 90’s that were hot at the time, like Gen 13 and Shi, that probably aren’t worth as much now as I paid then. Not that all hot titles will sink in value like those.

Edited October 23, 2017 by Nathan81

[oakman29]

2 hours ago, Mercury Man said:

You are probably going to get a mix of responses, but from an investment standpoint, new comic books are for the most part, going to let you down.  You will hear stories from people about how they flipped books for hundreds of dollars, and how some own an ultra rare variant that nobody has ever seen on the market, and how it can be done,  but  that is just speculators selling to speculators.   Eventually somebody gets left holding the bag, and that will thin out the hobby like it did in the early 90's.   The dollar boxes are filled with 'Investment' books from 20-30 years ago.  Filled to the tune of millions.  Buy new comics because you like the character, artwork or stories.  If for some reason what you have goes up in value, that's a bonus.  Quality over Quantity is always the smart collectibles play. 

Wiser words could not be said.

[Yoshi]

5 hours ago, Nathan81 said:

From an investment standpoint, is it a good idea to buy new comic books? I've been buying new comics recently, and have wondered if I should just buy old books, and focus on quality over quantity. Although I enjoy speculating that something might become valuable, and the idea of getting something at cover price that might be worth hundreds someday, I don't want to through money away though. Most of my collection is from the first half of the 90's, and if I was to try to sell them, I don't think I could even get cover price back for most of them, and those are 25 years old. Most of the books that I bought as a teenager that are valuable now, I purchased after they already had some value, not new. I used to think that with enough time, everything would become valuable, but sadly that doesn't seem to be the case. I was a teenager then and I think I have a better eye now. If I don't buy new comic books, I could miss out on something that becomes valuable. I've bought some sets of more recent books on eBay, and maybe that is the way to go, because the sets are usually less that cover price per book. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

You know, Mercury Man isn't wrong. But, I'll toss in my two cents.

These days comics come out with 3, 5, 20 damn covers an issue. The ultra rare, hard-to-get-your-hands-on, you'll never find it in the wild covers I think can be a solid investment. I could talk about this point more, but that's the quick and dirty version. 

The other thing I might suggest is Blank Covers. I might be biased here because I love these damn things, but hear me out. Black covers allow for artists to create a unique image on them. These can be a solid investment and, for me at least, has made comic book collecting fun again. Again, I could talk about this forever, but this is just the quick and dirty thoughts.

[Nathan81]

53 minutes ago, Yoshi said:

You know, Mercury Man isn't wrong. But, I'll toss in my two cents.

These days comics come out with 3, 5, 20 damn covers an issue. The ultra rare, hard-to-get-your-hands-on, you'll never find it in the wild covers I think can be a solid investment. I could talk about this point more, but that's the quick and dirty version. 

The other thing I might suggest is Blank Covers. I might be biased here because I love these damn things, but hear me out. Black covers allow for artists to create a unique image on them. These can be a solid investment and, for me at least, has made comic book collecting fun again. Again, I could talk about this forever, but this is just the quick and dirty thoughts.

So you take the blank covers to a convention to see if the artist will do a quick sketch on it?

[Mercury Man]

34 minutes ago, Nathan81 said:

So you take the blank covers to a convention to see if the artist will do a quick sketch on it?

Typically 'pay for it', but yes, artist does a sketch on it.   I agree with Yoshi, in that it opens up another avenue, instead of getting a sketch on a piece of paper, you get a sketch on an actual cover of a comic.  A pretty nifty idea when it was created by the publishers. 

[rjpb]

You're buying those sets on ebay for less than what the original purchaser paid for them, which should tell you something about the investment potential of modern books in general.

[Westy Steve]

I think buying moderns as an "investment" is VERY similar to buying lottery tickets as an "investment".   On average, they are worth less than you pay (neglecting the entertainment value), but once in a while, just like a lottery ticket, you get a winner that won't quite win you enough to justify your ticket-scratching habit.  So from an investment standpoint, buying new books isn't a great idea, but then again, there is no profit in eating a fine meal, or going to the movies or generally doing something that makes your life worth living.  Buy new books, but buy them because you like them.  The reality is that the best new books will give you a better than average return anyway.

 

All that being said, you can split the difference.  There are comics that came out years ago, dropped in value to practically nothing, bottomed out, and are now on the way up.  Yet you can still buy runs, or near complete runs for less than the cost of modern books.  I can't see the point of reading the new Iron Fist comics when I haven't read the old ones yet, and the few I did read were really good.  I'd rather have those old ones...they can only go up from here and I can find nice ones cheap enough.   Oh, and with the money I save buying those cheap classics, I can buy a real investment book here and there.

Edited October 23, 2017 by Westy Steve

[Yoshi]

2 hours ago, Nathan81 said:

So you take the blank covers to a convention to see if the artist will do a quick sketch on it?

Yes. I also like to just contact artists and mail out requests. I have a few videos on the topic on my youtube channel if you care to look into more. Had a few artists chat with me about it which was/is cool.

2 hours ago, Mercury Man said:

Typically 'pay for it', but yes, artist does a sketch on it.   I agree with Yoshi, in that it opens up another avenue, instead of getting a sketch on a piece of paper, you get a sketch on an actual cover of a comic.  A pretty nifty idea when it was created by the publishers. 

Word.

[AJD]

Buy trade paperbacks to read modern comics. They are cheaper than buying the floppies, and you can read the story arc in one go. Use the money you save to buy quality back issues.

[H0RR0RSH0W]

19 hours ago, Nathan81 said:

From an investment standpoint, is it a good idea to buy new comic books? I've been buying new comics recently, and have wondered if I should just buy old books, and focus on quality over quantity. Although I enjoy speculating that something might become valuable, and the idea of getting something at cover price that might be worth hundreds someday, I don't want to through money away though. Most of my collection is from the first half of the 90's, and if I was to try to sell them, I don't think I could even get cover price back for most of them, and those are 25 years old. Most of the books that I bought as a teenager that are valuable now, I purchased after they already had some value, not new. I used to think that with enough time, everything would become valuable, but sadly that doesn't seem to be the case. I was a teenager then and I think I have a better eye now. If I don't buy new comic books, I could miss out on something that becomes valuable. I've bought some sets of more recent books on eBay, and maybe that is the way to go, because the sets are usually less that cover price per book. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

I just see no potential for new books. Someone is always left holding the bag with the rampant speculation that is going on. Although "the older the better" is not always true either. New comics are really a different breed than their fore goers but I think that is a different conversation. The money in new comics does not seem to be in quality but quantity. What I mean by that is that comics have more widespread interest now ( even in the properties themselves) and as a side-effect a very large populace of readers.

For an "investment" try to buy the best you can afford, but none the less follow the golden rule of buy what you love and love what you buy. It may be you left holding those books someday and it not so pleasant to be forced to hold onto books you dislike.

Myself, I really enjoy buying new books for my reading part of the hobby I enjoy. So in regards to that I will use myself as the example: You will never find me buying a new book for 3 figures although I do indeed spend 3 figures in a year on books to read.If that makes sense.

 

Edited October 23, 2017 by H0RR0RSH0W
splling

[Nathan81]

5 hours ago, H0RR0RSH0W said:

I just see no potential for new books. Someone is always left holding the bag with the rampant speculation that is going on. Although "the older the better" is not always true either. New comics are really a different breed than their fore goers but I think that is a different conversation. The money in new comics does not seem to be in quality but quantity. What I mean by that is that comics have more widespread interest now ( even in the properties themselves) and as a side-effect a very large populace of readers.

For an "investment" try to buy the best you can afford, but none the less follow the golden rule of buy what you love and love what you buy. It may be you left holding those books someday and it not so pleasant to be forced to hold onto books you dislike.

Myself, I really enjoy buying new books for my reading part of the hobby I enjoy. So in regards to that I will use myself as the example: You will never find me buying a new book for 3 figures although I do indeed spend 3 figures in a year on books to read.If that makes sense.

 

So even in 50 years, you don’t think current books will be valuable? What about books like Y: The Last Man or Saga? I can’t believe that nothing will be valuable. 

You mentioned “buy the best you can afford.” So if I wanted to spend $1000, would I be better off buying one 9.8 book or two 9.6 books (from what I’ve seen a 9.8 seems to be double the value of a 9.6)? Or something older in lower grade?

I recently purchased a slabbed Saga 1 first print. Would it be advisable to resell it now, wait and see if the value increases, or hold onto it for the long haul?

I was thinking about a Next Men 21, or Usagi Yojimbo first appearance or first fantagraphics issue. Would those be good or should I just focus on old DC or Marvel?

[Mercury Man]

43 minutes ago, Nathan81 said:

So even in 50 years, you don’t think current books will be valuable? What about books like Y: The Last Man or Saga? I can’t believe that nothing will be valuable

Well nobody in the early 1960's knew that AF 15 or FF 1 or X-Men 1 would be valuable (that's about 50 years).   Those books transcended pop culture so to speak.  So is there something being put on the shelf today that is going to be worth some money in 50 years?  Who knows.   Look at The Walking Dead #1, hot book.  Nobody saw that one coming.  Now when the show is off the air, do you think it continues?  Do you think people 50 years from now will be looking in attics and garage sales for a Walking Dead #1?  Or will the interest die down, as the series fades from memory.   Do we even know if comic books will be a collectible 50 years from now?  Again, read moderns, enjoy them, if they go up in value, bonus.  If not, welcome to the 99%.   

[H0RR0RSH0W]

Just now, Nathan81 said:

So even in 50 years, you don’t think current books will be valuable? What about books like Y: The Last Man or Saga? I can’t believe that nothing will be valuable. 

No certainly not. But let me put it this way : I think your thinking may be wrong in regards to new comics in that it seems you are looking at every comic purchase as an investment. If all it took was money to invest in comics anyone could do it right? It is the understanding that comes from being involved in comics as a hobby and being able to decide for yourself from the knowledge you gain that may enable a person to make a profit from their collecting. So as far as valuable goes I do not personally know what will be worth a lot 50 years from now. Certainly most of what you buy will be worth something, but I do believe most if not all of what the average Joe comic collector is able to come across will not be worth much of anything , no.

As you mentioned in your first post your collection from 25 years ago has not seen a significant increase in value. You would not be the first to have this realization . So then why would the next 25 years or even the next suddenly cause these books value to exponentiate? There has to be a cause and effect. 

There is a mentality out there that sort of says "hey I've got old comics- I must be rich". In order to enjoy collecting one should avoid this trap.

Just now, Nathan81 said:

I recently purchased a slabbed Saga 1 first print. Would it be advisable to resell it now, wait and see if the value increases, or hold onto it for the long haul?

I was thinking about a Next Men 21, or Usagi Yojimbo first appearance or first fantagraphics issue. Would those be good or should I just focus on old DC or Marvel?

 I admit I know nothing about these books other than Saga 1 is hot and I would hold onto that for the long haul if I were you.

Just now, Nathan81 said:

You mentioned “buy the best you can afford.” So if I wanted to spend $1000, would I be better off buying one 9.8 book or two 9.6 books (from what I’ve seen a 9.8 seems to be double the value of a 9.6)? Or something older in lower grade?

It depends on the books really. It is not a general equation that you can just look at and sum it all up. For moderns the 9.8 - 9.6 grade point is really the sweet spot .

We could look at a book like ASM #300 over the last couple of years as an example. Recently 9.8 have seen well over $1000 dollars for a sales. This having been reached from the high 3 figures to the low $1000's about a year ago . Now to look at 9.6s's of the same book the prices went from around $350 to around $800 over the last year.So it is for the most part the same . Just a matter of how you want to spend the money. This has actually been a topic discussed on the boards and is itself a ratherbroad discussion. I personally look at the 9.8 as  a little more risky. 

Edited October 23, 2017 by H0RR0RSH0W
e spot

[Nathan81]

3 hours ago, H0RR0RSH0W said:

No certainly not. But let me put it this way : I think your thinking may be wrong in regards to new comics in that it seems you are looking at every comic purchase as an investment. If all it took was money to invest in comics anyone could do it right? It is the understanding that comes from being involved in comics as a hobby and being able to decide for yourself from the knowledge you gain that may enable a person to make a profit from their collecting. So as far as valuable goes I do not personally know what will be worth a lot 50 years from now. Certainly most of what you buy will be worth something, but I do believe most if not all of what the average Joe comic collector is able to come across will not be worth much of anything , no.

As you mentioned in your first post your collection from 25 years ago has not seen a significant increase in value. You would not be the first to have this realization . So then why would the next 25 years or even the next suddenly cause these books value to exponentiate? There has to be a cause and effect. 

There is a mentality out there that sort of says "hey I've got old comics- I must be rich". In order to enjoy collecting one should avoid this trap.

 I admit I know nothing about these books other than Saga 1 is hot and I would hold onto that for the long haul if I were you.

It depends on the books really. It is not a general equation that you can just look at and sum it all up. For moderns the 9.8 - 9.6 grade point is really the sweet spot .

We could look at a book like ASM #300 over the last couple of years as an example. Recently 9.8 have seen well over $1000 dollars for a sales. This having been reached from the high 3 figures to the low $1000's about a year ago . Now to look at 9.6s's of the same book the prices went from around $350 to around $800 over the last year.So it is for the most part the same . Just a matter of how you want to spend the money. This has actually been a topic discussed on the boards and is itself a ratherbroad discussion. I personally look at the 9.8 as  a little more risky. 

I don’t think every book has potential value. But if someone has a good eye for books with good art and storytelling, then I’d think those have potential. 

The next 25 years could possibly increase value of those 90’s comics in the same way the second 25 years increased the value of 60’s books, albeit to a much lesser degree.

Why would 9.8 be more risky? Because people might come to their senses and realize there is only a minuscule difference between 9.8 and 9.6 and not want to pay almost double in some cases?

I’m thinking the real reason it would be risky is because if the book drops a grade to 9.6, then a lot of money is lost, whereas 9.6 is closer to 9.4 and so on.

Edited October 24, 2017 by Nathan81

[Nathan81]

1 hour ago, Mercury Man said:

Well nobody in the early 1960's knew that AF 15 or FF 1 or X-Men 1 would be valuable (that's about 50 years).   Those books transcended pop culture so to speak.  So is there something being put on the shelf today that is going to be worth some money in 50 years?  Who knows.   Look at The Walking Dead #1, hot book.  Nobody saw that one coming.  Now when the show is off the air, do you think it continues?  Do you think people 50 years from now will be looking in attics and garage sales for a Walking Dead #1?  Or will the interest die down, as the series fades from memory.   Do we even know if comic books will be a collectible 50 years from now?  Again, read moderns, enjoy them, if they go up in value, bonus.  If not, welcome to the 99%.   

Good question. Who knows if something like walking dead 1 will be collected in 50 years. Although, in the comic book world 50 years doesn’t seem long enough to forget something entirely.

Edited October 24, 2017 by Nathan81

[H0RR0RSH0W]

11 hours ago, Nathan81 said:

Why would 9.8 be more risky? Because people might come to their senses and realize there is only a minuscule difference between 9.8 and 9.6 and not want to pay almost double in some cases?

 

To answer your question 9.8 is potentially more risky because lets say that 9.8 is the highest graded copy. Now lets say that another 9.8 comes a long, it now drops your single highest graded to 1 of 2 and therefore you will see the value drop greatly. This is not my opinion but rather an actual occurrence within the hobby.  Although using a copper or modern book as an example is perhaps a little weak in that the census is rife with uber high grades for moderns . All in all it likely cost you more to invest in as well.

 

11 hours ago, Nathan81 said:

I’m thinking the real reason it would be risky is because if the book drops a grade to 9.6, then a lot of money is lost, whereas 9.6 is closer to 9.4 and so on.

Yes, in this vein a grade drop would be another reason or even a change in page quality could be another or damage from handling etc. but I feel that just reinforces my point. 

If someone has a good eye for modern books and keeps their ear to the ground about the art and storytelling there is nothing prohibiting them from using new books as an investment other than their own judgement and personal knowledge database.

[revat]

18 hours ago, Nathan81 said:

So even in 50 years, you don’t think current books will be valuable? What about books like Y: The Last Man or Saga? I can’t believe that nothing will be valuable. 

You mentioned “buy the best you can afford.” So if I wanted to spend $1000, would I be better off buying one 9.8 book or two 9.6 books (from what I’ve seen a 9.8 seems to be double the value of a 9.6)? Or something older in lower grade?

I recently purchased a slabbed Saga 1 first print. Would it be advisable to resell it now, wait and see if the value increases, or hold onto it for the long haul?

I was thinking about a Next Men 21, or Usagi Yojimbo first appearance or first fantagraphics issue. Would those be good or should I just focus on old DC or Marvel?

Regarding the Saga 1, just like any other comic, it depends at least somewhat on what you bought it for.  If your ROI currently is 1000% then maybe you don't get a lot of value from waiting another 20 years for the price to double your current PROFIT.  You might be satisfied with the huge profit. But if your current ROI is 20% (still a nice profit), because your current profit margin relatively smaller its also relatively easier to double the ROI, so it might be waiting another 2-5 years.  And some people fight feel literally the exact opposite about it.  They think that since they're already up 1000% they're playing with house money so they can roll on, and since they only made 20% on this they should just cash out and get to something riskier.

So much of it depends on one's personal risk preferences.

 If you personally are informed and knowledgeable about any potential investment short term or long term, then run your knowledge up against your financial situation and your risk preferences, and see what you get. 

Certainly some books will be valuable in fifty years, but how confident are you in your ability to spot those books?  How well do you understand the market as whole (or specific parts)? How much time are you wiling to spend to understand the market?  How much are you willing to spend?  What type of return do you expect to make it worth the investment?  How does your return line up with anticipated inflation or economic effects?  How equipped are you to understand inflation or other economic effects?  What about storage and/or moving and/or weather in your area?  Are you sure your money wouldn't be better invested in the S&P 500 or a mutual fund? 

If you're doing it for fun or just as an excuse to keep buy more comics that you enjoy, then cool, do whatever.  But if you really see them as a long term investment, then you should treat them objectively the way you would any other long term investment.

[Nathan81]

8 hours ago, revat said:

Regarding the Saga 1, just like any other comic, it depends at least somewhat on what you bought it for.  If your ROI currently is 1000% then maybe you don't get a lot of value from waiting another 20 years for the price to double your current PROFIT.  You might be satisfied with the huge profit. But if your current ROI is 20% (still a nice profit), because your current profit margin relatively smaller its also relatively easier to double the ROI, so it might be waiting another 2-5 years.  And some people fight feel literally the exact opposite about it.  They think that since they're already up 1000% they're playing with house money so they can roll on, and since they only made 20% on this they should just cash out and get to something riskier.

So much of it depends on one's personal risk preferences.

 If you personally are informed and knowledgeable about any potential investment short term or long term, then run your knowledge up against your financial situation and your risk preferences, and see what you get. 

Certainly some books will be valuable in fifty years, but how confident are you in your ability to spot those books?  How well do you understand the market as whole (or specific parts)? How much time are you wiling to spend to understand the market?  How much are you willing to spend?  What type of return do you expect to make it worth the investment?  How does your return line up with anticipated inflation or economic effects?  How equipped are you to understand inflation or other economic effects?  What about storage and/or moving and/or weather in your area?  Are you sure your money wouldn't be better invested in the S&P 500 or a mutual fund? 

If you're doing it for fun or just as an excuse to keep buy more comics that you enjoy, then cool, do whatever.  But if you really see them as a long term investment, then you should treat them objectively the way you would any other long term investment.

To be honest, I don’t understand investing to that degree. I just know if I can sell something in the future for more than I paid, then I’ve made a profit. Storage cost for books is minimal. I don’t expect huge returns on something I bought at cover price. 

I could and maybe should just put money in 401k, but collecting is more interesting and fun, to have a book in hand I can look at and appreciate.

Maybe I’ve misunderstood, but the consensus seems to be that most modern or current books that are valuable now won’t retain there value long term, while an older book (80’s and earlier) is more likely to. Is that right?

I mentioned earlier in this thread that print runs are lower now, as well as there being in my opinion better content than in the 90’s. Scarcity is a factor in value, so I’d think that would lead to a higher number of modern books retaining their value.