Should I expect my cards back in 5 years? 2 2

[geraldfordfan69]

1 hour ago, Yeahiwasder4dat said:

The cost of the cards themselves + grading fees being tied up indefinitely is outweighing whatever increase in value the cards initially would've gained through grading. As most people don't like floating a company money for 6+ months I'm beginning to wonder if it isn't in violation of the FTC 30-day rule. 

I've seen that picture a few times now. Almost 400% increase isn't close. So to be fair most of the complaining is justifiable to some degree. It's subjective to an extent such as one day compared to four but I'm not sure any reasonable person would consider 30 business days close to 111.

 

ting on people for being frustrated isn't really much better than reading about their frustration when it's justifiable. Everyone isn't financially in the same place, we don't know what everyone else's motives for grading may be so a massive increase may be fine for some and not for others. So seeing it from each other's perspectives would go a long way.

 

I would think limiting submissions might be the key here until they get a handle on it.

If your relying on bulk submissions to make money, then that is a personal problem since its not CGC's responsibility to make people money. People agreed to have cards put in a plastic container and get a a professional grade. Thats really it. .Grading is just one part of my business. Its not the only way I generate income and if people were reling on flipping cards to make money, well then thats a bigger issue on its own. Some people need to be honest with themselves that them going all in on grading cards is just a crappy idea. Most of these cards shouldnt be worth what they are even selling for in the first place since its just shiny cardboard that has no real application. In a perfect world, this stuff should be worthless.

I used bulk and economy services for cheap older cards and when I open new cards and want to recuperate money on them. At this point, Ill just stick to whats old and valuable while selling product sealed. Its just that simple of a solution. Increased TAT's dont really bother me and shouldnt bother 90 something percent of people. The people who are getting mad are the people who are pissed that the easy money is gone. Yeah, god forbid you have to make an effort now to make money off cards sides cracking packs and sending them off. Life is tough.

Yes, its MIDLY annoying that bulk is taking forever, Every day I look at my received I get slightly irritated. And then I take a step back and think "if this is my biggest problem in life, then im doing pretty good". But like I said on another thread, the bulk is overloaded by people sending in way too many newer cards. I seen lots of posts of people sending in $3 shinys from shining fates. And again, people can submit whatever, I dont care what people want to do with their lives. But theres consequences to it. Its not like you can send these people infinite cards and think that has zero impact since it does.

[Yeahiwasder4dat]

36 minutes ago, mattyzeepgam said:

If your relying on bulk submissions to make money, then that is a personal problem since its not CGC's responsibility to make people money. People agreed to have cards put in a plastic container and get a a professional grade. Thats really it. .Grading is just one part of my business. Its not the only way I generate income and if people were reling on flipping cards to make money, well then thats a bigger issue on its own. Some people need to be honest with themselves that them going all in on grading cards is just a crappy idea. Most of these cards shouldnt be worth what they are even selling for in the first place since its just shiny cardboard that has no real application. In a perfect world, this stuff should be worthless.

I used bulk and economy services for cheap older cards and when I open new cards and want to recuperate money on them. At this point, Ill just stick to whats old and valuable while selling product sealed. Its just that simple of a solution. Increased TAT's dont really bother me and shouldnt bother 90 something percent of people. The people who are getting mad are the people who are pissed that the easy money is gone. Yeah, god forbid you have to make an effort now to make money off cards sides cracking packs and sending them off. Life is tough.

Yes, its MIDLY annoying that bulk is taking forever, Every day I look at my received I get slightly irritated. And then I take a step back and think "if this is my biggest problem in life, then im doing pretty good". But like I said on another thread, the bulk is overloaded by people sending in way too many newer cards. I seen lots of posts of people sending in $3 shinys from shining fates. And again, people can submit whatever, I dont care what people want to do with their lives. But theres consequences to it. Its not like you can send these people infinite cards and think that has zero impact since it does.

I don't think anyone is relying on bulk to make money as a get rich quick scheme, but every time it's pushed back I become a little more aggravated at being charged up front and having money tied up for much longer than anticipated. Pokemon is nothing compared to Optic or Hoops in regards to return on sales for sealed product. Generally speaking pokemon has become an afterthought but I definitely get where people are coming from with the submissions that are already paid for that keep getting extended where as others aren't out of pocket on the fees. Yes, I see plenty of things when looking for realized prices on raw cards that I think to myself, "What Bozo sent this in."

[geraldfordfan69]

32 minutes ago, Yeahiwasder4dat said:

I don't think anyone is relying on bulk to make money as a get rich quick scheme, but every time it's pushed back I become a little more aggravated at being charged up front and having money tied up for much longer than anticipated. Pokemon is nothing compared to Optic or Hoops in regards to return on sales for sealed product. Generally speaking pokemon has become an afterthought but I definitely get where people are coming from with the submissions that are already paid for that keep getting extended where as others aren't out of pocket on the fees. Yes, I see plenty of things when looking for realized prices on raw cards that I think to myself, "What Bozo sent this in."

Where do you think a surge of bulk is coming from then? Do you really think that a majority of these bulk orders are just the end consumer or do you think its people who see easy money on the internet and dont know what they are doing? From what Ive seen over the internet, yeah its just people who dont really have a clue on how to make the most money off grading. People jamming the system up with tons of modern cards that are barely worth anything. If a bunch of people in 2020 thought buying out stores of toilet paper made any sense, then it wouldnt put it pass me if the majority of bulk submissions are just modern sub par cards.

Just live and learn that stay away from bulk and economy. If people wanna rant and say how CGC is robbing them and how this is the worse thing that ever happened to them in their life, then they can do that. Ill just be sure to stay away from those people lol. We live in a world to where nobody cares what anyone thinks. At least when it comes to mindless complaints that dont benefit anyone.

Edited March 13, 2021 by mattyzeepgam

[Yeahiwasder4dat]

44 minutes ago, mattyzeepgam said:

Where do you think a surge of bulk is coming from then? Do you really think that a majority of these bulk orders are just the end consumer or do you think its people who see easy money on the internet and dont know what they are doing? From what Ive seen over the internet, yeah its just people who dont really have a clue on how to make the most money off grading. People jamming the system up with tons of modern cards that are barely worth anything. If a bunch of people in 2020 thought buying out stores of toilet paper made any sense, then it wouldnt put it pass me if the majority of bulk submissions are just modern sub par cards.

Just live and learn that stay away from bulk and economy. If people wanna rant and say how CGC is robbing them and how this is the worse thing that ever happened to them in their life, then they can do that. Ill just be sure to stay away from those people lol. We live in a world to where nobody cares what anyone thinks. At least when it comes to mindless complaints that dont benefit anyone.

Extra money. People are most likely seeing the TAT on Bulk and sending it through Standard or above forcing the existing bulk orders into a never ending loop of getting pushed back. At this point I don't think they're getting slammed with Bulk so much as everything else and it's getting put on the back burner. Bulk/Econ to me is just icing on the cake. Most of the ones I buy with the intention of sending Standard+ and reselling quickly for decent money are Base set zards or some other higher dollar card I can get at a cheap price. IE 

 

Other things I might send through Econ/Standard if the TAT is decent and I'm willing to wait longer for for the price/time. From this point forward, yes it's become apparent Bulk/Econ are doo on TAT. If it said Econ with 30 TAT I'd be sending these in that tier. If I know Econ is 8 months out, no I'm not going to I'll use Standard if I think I can still make enough or not grade at all. Obviously that's out of the question now but an estimated time of a 1 1/2 or 2 at $15 a card makes sense at the time of submission.

 

On the same note, I wouldn't necessarily want to have the cards and money tied up unexpectedly for an extended period. End of the world? No. Annoying? Yes.

Edited March 13, 2021 by Yeahiwasder4dat

[geraldfordfan69]

13 minutes ago, Yeahiwasder4dat said:

Extra money. People are most likely seeing the TAT on Bulk and sending it through Standard or above forcing the existing bulk orders into a never ending loop of getting pushed back. At this point I don't think they're getting slammed with Bulk so much as everything else and it's getting put on the back burner. Bulk/Econ to me is just icing on the cake. Most of the ones I buy with the intention of sending Standard+ and reselling quickly for decent money are Base set zards or some other higher dollar card I can get at a cheap price. IE 

 

Other things I might send through Econ/Standard if the TAT is decent and I'm willing to wait longer for for the price/time. From this point forward, yes it's become apparent Bulk/Econ are doo on TAT. If it said Econ with 30 TAT I'd be sending these in that tier. If I know Econ is 8 months out, no I'm not going to I'll use Standard if I think I can still make enough or not grade at all. Obviously that's out of the question now but an estimated time of a 1 1/2 or 2 at $15 a card makes sense at the time of submission.

 

On the same note, I wouldn't necessarily want to have the cards and money tied up unexpectedly for an extended period. End of the world? No. Annoying? Yes.

Bulk takes way longer to grade. Most people arent sending in 100s of cards through standard since its not really worth it at 20 something a pop. You also have to keep in mind that people are not as savvy as people like yourself. Lots of people mindlessly watch the internet and anything with a Pokemon label on it gets submitted in. Modern cards are kind of a problem. Especially with the hidden fates, shining fates, champions path, even vivid voltage, all these newer sets just have tons of gimmicky cards that people think are worth grading but arent. Shining Fates was hands down the most overhyped Pokemon product of all time. Cards are tanking since the set sucks. Most if it is forgettable Sword & Shield stuff sprinkled with some Kanto ones and all that stuff is being sent to grading. Cards that are not even a month old are being sent in stacks to grading companies. That is a pretty big problem since all this new stuff is brand new. Its not like old stuff that has had attriion and the minty stuff is hard to find. The market is flooded with modern mint cards and now the grading companies are flooded with them too.

Looking at your stuff you seem to have the right ideas. Id probably wouldnt bother submitting the unlimited rocket cards unless you feel like waiting through bulk. Not sure if I think grading a Charizard VMAX with standard makes it worth it either unless you got it out of a pack. I been seeing the sales on those be kind of janky unless it hits a 9.5. 

[Yeahiwasder4dat]

6 minutes ago, mattyzeepgam said:

Bulk takes way longer to grade. Most people arent sending in 100s of cards through standard since its not really worth it at 20 something a pop. You also have to keep in mind that people are not as savvy as people like yourself. Lots of people mindlessly watch the internet and anything with a Pokemon label on it gets submitted in. Modern cards are kind of a problem. Especially with the hidden fates, shining fates, champions path, even vivid voltage, all these newer sets just have tons of gimmicky cards that people think are worth grading but arent. Shining Fates was hands down the most overhyped Pokemon product of all time. Cards are tanking since the set sucks. Most if it is forgettable Sword & Shield stuff sprinkled with some Kanto ones and all that stuff is being sent to grading. Cards that are not even a month old are being sent in stacks to grading companies. That is a pretty big problem since all this new stuff is brand new. Its not like old stuff that has had attriion and the minty stuff is hard to find. The market is flooded with modern mint cards and now the grading companies are flooded with them too.

Looking at your stuff you seem to have the right ideas. Id probably wouldnt bother submitting the unlimited rocket cards unless you feel like waiting through bulk. Not sure if I think grading a Charizard VMAX with standard makes it worth it either unless you got it out of a pack. I been seeing the sales on those be kind of janky unless it hits a 9.5. 

Eh, got the Vmax for like $65. It looks like a good contender, centering decent, nothing obvious that jumps out at me under 2x magnifying lamp. Willing to gamble on it.

Rockets are all NM with a common set in same condition. Was going to sell set with holos graded, same with 1st ed rocket set/heros/challenge. Figured if set doesn't sell that way just part them out. Either way got it all at a decent price.

I'm cool with waiting 6 months and being charged at the time of grading. It's old stuff, price shouldn't swing much. My issue is paying initially just to have it forced back endlessly. Have a finite amount of money and a stack of about 250 more cards like those that I would like to get done. Most of my money now is through sealed products and sports cards, but the money is better served elsewhere in the mean time on other product. I'm just saying if someone sent 2-300 through bulk and have thousands tied up in limbo I most certainly can understand the frustration.

[ShiningCollectibles]

1 minute ago, Yeahiwasder4dat said:

Eh, got the Vmax for like $65. It looks like a good contender, centering decent, nothing obvious that jumps out at me under 2x magnifying lamp. Willing to gamble on it.

Rockets are all NM with a common set in same condition. Was going to sell set with holos graded, same with 1st ed rocket set/heros/challenge. Figured if set doesn't sell that way just part them out. Either way got it all at a decent price.

I'm cool with waiting 6 months and being charged at the time of grading. It's old stuff, price shouldn't swing much. My issue is paying initially just to have it forced back endlessly. Have a finite amount of money and a stack of about 250 more cards like those that I would like to get done. Most of my money now is through sealed products and sports cards, but the money is better served elsewhere in the mean time on other product. I'm just saying if someone sent 2-300 through bulk and have thousands tied up in limbo I most certainly can understand the frustration.

I just can't stand the lieing. I feel like I am being scammed and I'm sure many others feel this way too. Mine as well not even has a TAT. And just say your cards might come back in infinite and beyond.

Edited March 13, 2021 by ShiningCollectibles

[Ron Churches]

2 minutes ago, ShiningCollectibles said:

I just can't stand the lieing. I feel like I am being scammed and I'm sure many others feel this way too. Mine as well not even has a TAT. And just say your cards might come back in infinite and beyond.

I guess the problem is that folks see this as 'lying'. What would be their motivation to do that? It's completely asinine. They are raising TaT because they cannot push through the cards at the previously estimated timeframe. Card graders would fail the marshmallow test, I guess. 

[Yeahiwasder4dat]

2 minutes ago, ShiningCollectibles said:

I just can't stand the lieing. I feel like I am being scammed and I'm sure many others feel this way too. Mine as well not even has a TAT. And just say your cards might come back in infinite and beyond.

I don't think they're necessarily lying, it's just as other shorter turn around time submissions come in they have to keep pushing it back to maintain the decent TAT on the higher tiers. Just without a limit on submissions I'm not sure they'll ever catch up.

[geraldfordfan69]

1 minute ago, Yeahiwasder4dat said:

Eh, got the Vmax for like $65. It looks like a good contender, centering decent, nothing obvious that jumps out at me under 2x magnifying lamp. Willing to gamble on it.

Rockets are all NM with a common set in same condition. Was going to sell set with holos graded, same with 1st ed rocket set/heros/challenge. Figured if set doesn't sell that way just part them out. Either way got it all at a decent price.

I'm cool with waiting 6 months and being charged at the time of grading. It's old stuff, price shouldn't swing much. My issue is paying initially just to have it forced back endlessly. Have a finite amount of money and a stack of about 250 more cards like those that I would like to get done. Most of my money now is through sealed products and sports cards, but the money is better served elsewhere in the mean time on other product. I'm just saying if someone sent 2-300 through bulk and have thousands tied up in limbo I most certainly can understand the frustration.

Yeah I mean its annoying that the bulk is being forced back, im not saying your complete wrong. Its just the people who flip out about it, its just getting hillarious . I personally didnt mind paying upfront since at some point the money would be due and its kind of nice not worrying about it. But CGC now waiting to charge is probably causing more submissions since if you dont have to pay for it right away, then people will sit there and dump 1000s of modern cards at their doorstep.

The new facilities and workers should speed things up. I just dont see TATs going up forever since its not realistically possible. They dropped standard and higher services, but then they went back up again. Also with the vaccines coming out soon, I do see these cards dropping a bit in value. Once people are out and about again, I do see a good part of the world forgetting like Pokemon like its 2001-2002 all over again. Ive always warned people the dangers of Pokemon's current fad status and that not everything will go up forever. There will be some corrections across the board and some increase in value in tournament cards again. Im sitting on Crobat and Zacian Vs since their days are coming lol.

[geraldfordfan69]

2 minutes ago, Ron Churches said:

I guess the problem is that folks see this as 'lying'. What would be their motivation to do that? It's completely asinine. They are raising TaT because they cannot push through the cards at the previously estimated timeframe. Card graders would fail the marshmallow test, I guess. 

Of course its asinine. Dont take the bait lol. The guy thinks it takes forever to get back a 1st ed charizard. It was hurting my brain just reading some of these peoples responses and now anyone who sounds a little out of it, I just ignore. 

[Yeahiwasder4dat]

I would think the best course of action is to impose a restrictive cap on submissions now, eat at the backlog and then ease up until they find The Sweet spot of submissions coming in and going out.

They will never be able to get it exact but they could probably get it within a 10-day window in either direction.

Edited March 13, 2021 by Yeahiwasder4dat

[geraldfordfan69]

5 minutes ago, Yeahiwasder4dat said:

I would think the best course of action is to impose a restrictive cap on submissions now, eat at the backlog and then ease up until they find The Sweet spot of submissions coming in and going out.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

They kind of are doing that though. Telling people there is a 100 day wait is basically saying that. And they are going to have more staff and space at some point. 

Heres the thing. This company has been the leader in grading comics forever. They didnt get there by being stupid. And Im trusting their decisions on the cards since they didnt get this big by accident.

Could they be making dumb decisions and someone could be doing a better job? Maybe. But Im going to go with my gut and think that they have the best judgment in this situation. I could be wrong and maybe the people in charge with this stuff are making bad decisions, who knows  but considering that my standard stuff is coming back each month and the work being done is very good, I just dont have any reason to second guess them. And some people need to realize that the people making these decisions, they arent just doing them for no reason or have no idea what they are doing. There is a small percentage that people on here could be right, but I havent seen any evidence to make me think different.

Edited March 13, 2021 by mattyzeepgam

[Ron Churches]

4 minutes ago, Yeahiwasder4dat said:

I would think the best course of action is to impose a restrictive cap on submissions now, eat at the backlog and then ease up until they find The Sweet spot of submissions coming in and going out.

They will never be able to get it exact but they could probably get it within a 10-day window in either direction.

I think so long as competitors are facing the same situation we wouldn't see this happen. Maybe nixing a tier, but not across the board submissions. PSA did that and I don't think it really squashed demand, just moved it around. Price might be the only lever that really makes a difference, as margins are just too damn high on the secondary market to knock down the demand for grading the cards. 

[Yeahiwasder4dat]

8 minutes ago, Ron Churches said:

I think so long as competitors are facing the same situation we wouldn't see this happen. Maybe nixing a tier, but not across the board submissions. PSA did that and I don't think it really squashed demand, just moved it around. Price might be the only lever that really makes a difference, as margins are just too damn high on the secondary market to knock down the demand for grading the cards. 

I mean a hard cap on each account per month for a few months until the backlog gets mostly cleared through, realistically speaking unless you're a dealer there's no reason people need to spam absurd amounts of cards through the system and can't wait. I turn down work all the time if I'm slammed. Then slowly ease up on the cap until they can figure out their throughput vs subs. Really the info should already be there.

Edited March 13, 2021 by Yeahiwasder4dat

[geraldfordfan69]

1 minute ago, Yeahiwasder4dat said:

I mean a hard cap on each account per month for a few months until the backlog gets mostly cleared through, realistically speaking unless you're a dealer there's no reason people need to spam absurd amounts of cards through the system and can't wait. I turn down work all the time if I'm slammed.

I dont think the CEO sees it that way lol. At the end of the day, all the grading companies want as much business as possible. And with accounts, its very easy to open multiples and bypass loopholes. Do you realistically think if you were in charge of CGC that you would do something like your saying? I think what Ron says makes the most sense in that they have to just charge more money to cut out all the modern junk. Make it to where grading these Amazing Rares or $10 hyper rares isnt really profitable. There probably is way too many people who just want to flip newer cards that are submitting and this is probably one of the better solutions that doesnt limit business.

[Yeahiwasder4dat]

7 minutes ago, mattyzeepgam said:

I dont think the CEO sees it that way lol. At the end of the day, all the grading companies want as much business as possible. And with accounts, its very easy to open multiples and bypass loopholes. Do you realistically think if you were in charge of CGC that you would do something like your saying? I think what Ron says makes the most sense in that they have to just charge more money to cut out all the modern junk. Make it to where grading these Amazing Rares or $10 hyper rares isnt really profitable. There probably is way too many people who just want to flip newer cards that are submitting and this is probably one of the better solutions that doesnt limit business.

As it stands not charging until grading they aren't getting paid for work they aren't doing anyways. It's always worked fine for me now it may not scale exactly the same onto a business of this size without having to go far more in-depth obviously. But I could see them cutting out bulk and limiting submissions so that you're completing orders from 10 people at 20 cards instead of one guy at 200 and forcing everybody else to wait and having a bunch of livid customers who have outstanding orders for 8 months.

At least in my line of work very rarely does keeping one person with big jobs happy exceed the money that I make from smaller jobs with multiple people

Edited March 13, 2021 by Yeahiwasder4dat

[geraldfordfan69]

10 minutes ago, Yeahiwasder4dat said:

As it stands not charging until grading they aren't getting paid for work they aren't doing anyways. It's always worked fine for me now it may not scale exactly the same onto a business of this size without having to go far more in-depth obviously. But I could see them cutting out bulk and limiting submissions so that you're completing orders from 10 people at 20 cards instead of one guy at 200 and forcing everybody else to wait and having a bunch of livid customers who have outstanding orders for 8 months.

At least in my line of work very rarely does keeping one person with big jobs happy exceed the money that I make from smaller jobs with multiple people

The thing is we dont know the impact of added staff and expanded facilities will have. There is alot of info that is probably kept internal that they cant tell us. The days given out are probably conservative since in the past, they always have been conservative. Ive gotten standard orders back before 30 days before they switched it back down to 22. Before the huge wave of grading, everything came back way earlier than what was listed. And with current bulk and economy from early december, its been around 60 something days with turn around times. This means that January orders will be probably 70-80. If more staff comes along, it could start dropping.

I assume they are aware of the people they have backlogged before making these decisions. I guess we will just have to see how things play out. 

[Yeahiwasder4dat]

4 minutes ago, mattyzeepgam said:

The thing is we dont know the impact of added staff and expanded facilities will have. There is alot of info that is probably kept internal that they cant tell us. The days given out are probably conservative since in the past, they always have been conservative. Ive gotten standard orders back before 30 days before they switched it back down to 22. Before the huge wave of grading, everything came back way earlier than what was listed. And with current bulk and economy from early december, its been around 60 something days with turn around times. This means that January orders will be probably 70-80. If more staff comes along, it could start dropping.

I assume they are aware of the people they have backlogged before making these decisions. I guess we will just have to see how things play out. 

I'm sure it will help a lot I just feel like this is one of those situations where an ounce of prevention was worth a pound of cure

[ShiningCollectibles]

What you aren't understanding is that 111 submission date right now is really like 800 days because by the time it gets to that 111 it's going to be 800+. Things need to be changed.