Post your Promise Collection wins! 16 16

[Terry JSA]

25 minutes ago, Crowzilla said:

You might have read the certificate incorrectly, but it wouldn't surprise me one bit if the consignors got a deal like this.

I’ve realized that. 

Edited June 25, 2021 by Terry_JSA

[szav]

3 hours ago, lou_fine said:

I've won books from Heritage before and have not received one of these certificates for any of my winnings to date yet.  

Maybe it's only for bigger dollar books where they figured they've made big money on them already and they can hopefully do it again.  

Pretty sure that certificate is a nice but meaningless token anyway, as HA only takes 10% from the total when you resell winnings through the make offer to owner feature.

Edited June 25, 2021 by szav

[MasterChief]

21 hours ago, GreatCaesarsGhost said:

I ain’t no detective, but I think I’ve deduced Heritage’s plan to catch the secondary market. So when the first wave of buyers sell, why wouldn’t they go back thru Heritage?

 

I got a certificate from this auction, too. However, it was for a Mile High copy not a Promise copy, with different wording.

Anyone care to explain the difference in the two?

[GreatCaesarsGhost]

21 minutes ago, MasterChief said:

I got a certificate from this auction, too. However, it was for a Mile High copy not a Promise copy, with different wording.

Anyone care to explain the difference in the two?

 

[GreatCaesarsGhost]

Seriously. I know BP is 20%. What is the sellers premium again?  
 

it sounds like you save yourself the sellers premium, but your walk away money is only 80% of what the buyer pays. Heritage pockets the full 20% BP.

I think the Promise deal will net the seller 90% because not only do you not pay sellers fee, the BP must additionally get split 50 50 between the seller and Heritage 

interesting. Not sure what to make of the disparity in offer. Could this be a marketing technique to attract more interest in the Promise Collection? If so, you’d think they would have informed us of this before bidding.  Right now, I only think the buyers of the first wave of Promise Collection books are privy to this information, so if it’s a marketing technique, it’s one I don’t understand.

could Heritage be thinking there’s still upward lift to these books such that subsequent sales will bring more money? Not sure why else heritage would be willing to leave money on the table like that

Edited June 25, 2021 by GreatCaesarsGhost

[Pantodude]

In prior years, I've received these auction certificates for big books.  So it's not new or unusual for big books.  

[adamstrange]

55 minutes ago, MasterChief said:

I got a certificate from this auction, too. However, it was for a Mile High copy not a Promise copy, with different wording.

Anyone care to explain the difference in the two?

Sweet book!!! 

[lou_fine]

9 hours ago, MasterChief said:

Anyone care to explain the difference in the two?

Sounds as though the difference between the 2 certificates is simply nothing more than Heritage's take, with the Promise Mitch's Mile High certificate clearly netting them more.  

9 hours ago, GreatCaesarsGhost said:

Seriously. I know BP is 20%. What is the sellers premium again?  

 

it sounds like you save yourself the sellers premium, but your walk away money is only 80% of what the buyer pays. Heritage pockets the full 20% BP.

I think the Promise deal will net the seller 90% because not only do you not pay sellers fee, the BP must additionally get split 50 50 between the seller and Heritage 

I believe if you are just a regular consignor without the ability to negotiate anything at all with Heritage, the standard SP is probably 15%.  

So for example, if a book hammers for $1K, then this means that with the 20% BP, the final result which we all see is $1,200.  This means that if the seller has the Promise Certificate for this $1,200 sale, they would end up netting $1,080 or 90% of the final total price including the BP.  If they had Mitch's Mile High Ceritifcate instead, this means that although they will not be charged the SP, they will have to forgo the 20% BP to Heritage and thereby net only $1,000 or 83.33% of the final total price including the BP, giving Heritage 16.67% of the final total price.  

Of course, if you are an absolute nobody and buy relatively insignificant books and do not receive one of these certificates and unable to negotiate anything at all with Heritage, that means you will end up paying both the 20% BP of the hmmer price and the standard say 15% of the hammer price.  So if we use the same example with a book hammering for $1K, this means the final result will be the same $1,200 with the 20% BP.  The biggest difference being that the consignor will also have to forgo the 15% SP or $150 which means they will net only $850 or 70.83% of the final total price including BP, with Heritage taking a whopping 29.17% of the final total price.  

So, unless you are offered a special deal by Heritage based upon the dollar value of your consignment or a skilled negotiator, all of a sudden, either CC or CL looks like a much better deal at only 10% or possibly even slightly less, if you believe they can give you the same final auction results or thereabouts.   

Edited June 26, 2021 by lou_fine

[GreatCaesarsGhost]

11 minutes ago, lou_fine said:

Sounds as though the difference between the 2 certificates is simply nothing more than Heritage's take, with the Promise one netting them more.  

I believe if you are just a regular consignor without the ability to negotiate anything at all with Heritage, the standard SP is probably 15%.  

So for example, if a book hammers for $1K, then this means that with the 20% BP, the final result which we all see is $1,200.  This means that if the seller has the Promise Certificate for this $1,200 sale, they would end up netting $1,080 or 90% of the final total price including the BP.  If they had Mitch's Mile High Ceritifcate instead, this means that although they will not be charged the SP, they will have to forgo the 20% BP to Heritage and thereby net only $1,000 or 83.33% of the final total price including the BP, giving Heritage 16.67% of the final total price.  

Of course, if you are an absolute nobody and buy relatively insignificant books and do not receive one of these certificates and unable to negotiate anything at all with Heritage, that means you will end up paying both the 20% BP of the hmmer price and the standard say 15% of the hammer price.  So if we use the same example with a book hammering for $1K, this means the final result will be the same $1,200 with the 20% BP.  The biggest difference being that the consignor will also have to forgo the 15% SP or $150 which means they will net only $850 or 70.83% of the final total price including BP, with Heritage taking a whopping 29.17% of the final total price.  

So, unless you are offered a special deal by Heritage based upon the dollar value of your consignment or a skilled negotiator, all of a sudden, either CC or CL looks like a much better deal at only 10% or possibly even slightly less, if you believe they can give you the same final auction results or thereabouts.   

right.  Which leads me to think this is a marketing technique to insure that when these Promise books return to the market, either tomorrow or 50 years from tomorrow, that they go thru Heritage instead of CC or CL.

Edited June 25, 2021 by GreatCaesarsGhost

[Mmehdy]

2 hours ago, GreatCaesarsGhost said:

right.  Which leads me to think this is a marketing technique to insure that when these Promise books return to the market, either tomorrow or 50 years from tomorrow, that they go thru Heritage instead of CC or CL.

I agree, but it also the the confidence in future increased  value to make an offer like this. Yes they get 10% but Ha is counting on increased value to make their 10% even greater. Ha is showing exceptional business savy in trying to keep the Promise collection in house with this offer. Their confidence in this collection is being shown by this certificate.

[tth2]

12 hours ago, cheetah said:

I have gotten similar certificates in the past.  I can't remember what the books were but I have the certs at home still.

The certificates I've received in the past were just waivers of the seller's commission, which was no big deal because they're always waived by Heritage anyways.

This is the first time I've seen Heritage publicly offer a rebate on BP.  

[tth2]

7 hours ago, szav said:

11 hours ago, lou_fine said:

I've won books from Heritage before and have not received one of these certificates for any of my winnings to date yet.  

Maybe it's only for bigger dollar books where they figured they've made big money on them already and they can hopefully do it again.  

Pretty sure that certificate is a nice but meaningless token anyway, as HA only takes 10% from the total when you resell winnings through the make offer to owner feature.

It's a pretty significant offer, actually, because getting 90% of total sale price of an auction item, inclusive of BP, is something that Heritage usually reserves for top consignors.

[tth2]

7 hours ago, MasterChief said:

I got a certificate from this auction, too. However, it was for a Mile High copy not a Promise copy, with different wording.

Anyone care to explain the difference in the two?

Mitch, this is the standard certificate that Heritage normally provides with some books.  It just means that Heritage will waive their normal 10% seller's commission, which is no big deal because Heritage almost always waives that anyways, often times without the consignor even asking for it.

But it means that without any further negotiation, Heritage keeps all of the BP.  So a book hammers for $1000, total price is $1200 inclusive of BP, and the consignor takes home $1000 and Heritage keeps $200.

Under the certificate with the Promise book, the consignor gets 90% of the total price inclusive of BP.  So under the same auction result above, the consignor now gets $1080 rather than $1000, and Heritage gets $120 instead of $200.  

It basically levels the playing field with CC and CL (in terms of auction fees) for anyone thinking about reselling a Promise book.

By the way, the Wild West was my consignment, so thanks for winning it! It's a beauty! 

[tth2]

6 hours ago, lou_fine said:

7 hours ago, MasterChief said:

Anyone care to explain the difference in the two?

Sounds as though the difference between the 2 certificates is simply nothing more than Heritage's take, with the Promise one netting them more.  

How do you arrive at that conclusion?  The Promise certificate means the consignor keeps more of the total proceeds, and Heritages nets less. 

[tth2]

6 hours ago, lou_fine said:

I believe if you are just a regular consignor without the ability to negotiate anything at all with Heritage, the standard SP is probably 15%.  

So for example, if a book hammers for $1K, then this means that with the 20% BP, the final result which we all see is $1,200.  This means that if the seller has the Promise Certificate for this $1,200 sale, they would end up netting $1,080 or 90% of the final total price including the BP.  If they had Mitch's Mile High Ceritifcate instead, this means that although they will not be charged the SP, they will have to forgo the 20% BP to Heritage and thereby net only $1,000 or 83.33% of the final total price including the BP, giving Heritage 16.67% of the final total price.  

Actually, you explain it perfectly here and seem to totally get it, so now I'm really confused why you say that Heritage nets more with the Promise book. 

[tth2]

6 hours ago, lou_fine said:

Of course, if you are an absolute nobody and buy relatively insignificant books and do not receive one of these certificates and unable to negotiate anything at all with Heritage, that means you will end up paying both the 20% BP of the hmmer price and the standard say 15% of the hammer price. 

I doubt there is anyone on the planet who consigns to Heritage and actually pays full boat.  As I mentioned, Heritage usually offer to drop the seller's commission without even being asked!

 

[GreatCaesarsGhost]

15 minutes ago, tth2 said:

By the way, the Wild West was my consignment, so thanks for winning it! It's a beauty! 

Small world!

[szav]

2 hours ago, tth2 said:

It's a pretty significant offer, actually, because getting 90% of total sale price of an auction item, inclusive of BP, is something that Heritage usually reserves for top consignors.

I don’t think it’s any different.  If I won an item on heritage and someone made an offer to me for $1000 on that item and I accepted, I would get 900$. At least that’s how an HA employee explained it to me.

I have acquired a few items through the MOTO.  There’s no buyers premium.  You pay what you offer.  You used to be able to make offers just about 20% above the original winning price.  It wouldn’t have made any sense to allow those offers unless the HAs cut on them was well under 20% (unless they think I people like taking losses ... which they generally don’t).

Looks like the new default initial offer is 50% over the original winning price, but the owner can  manually lower that.

Edited June 26, 2021 by szav

[lou_fine]

2 hours ago, tth2 said:

8 hours ago, lou_fine said:

9 hours ago, MasterChief said:

Anyone care to explain the difference in the two?

Sounds as though the difference between the 2 certificates is simply nothing more than Heritage's take, with the Promise Mitch's Mile High certificate clearly netting them more.  

How do you arrive at that conclusion?  The Promise certificate means the consignor keeps more of the total proceeds, and Heritages nets less.

Clearly my bad as in my rush to reply I made the usual typo which I have now corrected in my original post, as noted above.  

[tth2]

3 hours ago, szav said:

5 hours ago, tth2 said:

It's a pretty significant offer, actually, because getting 90% of total sale price of an auction item, inclusive of BP, is something that Heritage usually reserves for top consignors.

I don’t think it’s any different.  If I won an item on heritage and someone made an offer to me for $1000 on that item and I accepted, I would get 900$. At least that’s how an HA employee explained it to me.

Heritage has to do more work on an auction listing.  They've got to get the book, do the scan/pic, write up the description, put it in the catalog if it's for a Signature auction, do marketing, run the actual auction, etc.

The Make Offer process is much more passive.  There's no work done by Heritage, as it seems to be a completely automated system that automatically takes sold books and attaches the Make Offer link to them unless the owner opts out.  The only work Heritage does once an offer is accepted is to receive the book and ship it out, and collect payment and pay the seller.  So it makes sense that Heritage takes much less of a cut.