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The Future of Golden Age comic book collecting post 2021: Blackstone, Promise and Beyond: The great unknown.
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147 posts in this topic

31 minutes ago, tth2 said:

(thumbsu

Although, Daryl Morey is a nerd (MIT grad), so he could be a comic book fan.

Well, that could be true for any of these new investors as they could all be closet nerdy comic book collectors like the rest of us here.  :bigsmile:

Although I get the feeling he was invited to join into the group due to his connections as being the current President of the Philadelpia 76ers.  (thumbsu

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On 7/4/2021 at 3:15 PM, lou_fine said:

Of course I do as do so many of us here as these apparent conflicts of inteest have been voiced many times before in the past here already. :(

Not only apparent conflicts of interest bewtween a grading company and an auction house, but also with their other services such as when CCG brout out Matt's Classics Incorporated business and turned it into CCS.  Definite conflict of interest when CGC graded Jon Berk's collection for a competing auction house, and yet at the time, some boardies stated that it only made business sense for CGC to have undergraded Jon's books.  I giess that's also the same rationale for making business sense for CGC to overgrade the Promise Colletion of books as they are all being consigned through their indirect linked Heritage Auction house.  :devil:

Yeah, conflicts of interest all over the place, but as long as you are aware of the game being played on you and be sure to place your bids accordingly.  hm

A grading company owning an auction house takes it to the next level. No longer an apparent conflict of interest. Simply is a conflict of interest. Also lays the groundwork for the grading company owned auction house to bid on books. Caveat Emptor as a principle is inapplicable to this scenario and also ineffective because it’s not a market. 

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20 hours ago, 50YrsCollctngCmcs said:

yes but all relatively high grade Disney books are seeing strong results

Probably as they should be. High grade is high grade and tough. Mid-low grade copies of books like these can be had for very reasonable if not cheap prices. You want bragging rights, you pay the man. You want to read and enjoy it, there are plenty of less expensive options around. 

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5 hours ago, Robot Man said:

Probably as they should be. High grade is high grade and tough. Mid-low grade copies of books like these can be had for very reasonable if not cheap prices. You want bragging rights, you pay the man. You want to read and enjoy it, there are plenty of less expensive options around. 

And if you are a reader you can read Disney and Dell all day long and not break the bank with the giant print runs!

 

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On 7/5/2021 at 5:45 PM, lou_fine said:

Well, that could be true for any of these new investors as they could all be closet nerdy comic book collectors like the rest of us here.  :bigsmile:(thumbsu

Matt Nelson speaks about Blackstone, Ponsetti, Ciccone, E. Gerber, Matt Nelson, Baltimore con onsite grading, rampant hiring of folks that know the basics about comics, etc.

 

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On 7/20/2021 at 11:17 AM, aardvark88 said:

At about the 1 hour 15 minute point of above interview, President M. Nelson declares trimmed pulp covers will garner the Cgc Blue label, not PLOD, as trimming is so common and 'accepted by the pulp hobby.'

Well, that pretty much killed off any interest I might've ever had in collecting CGC slabbed pulps.

But in the meantime, I'm buying stock in companies that manufacture:

Dahle 533 Professional Guillotine Cutter (13.375")

and 

For 80 Years, X-Acto Has Been on the Cutting Edge of Edge Cutting | Arts &  Culture | Smithsonian Magazine

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On 7/20/2021 at 5:43 AM, tth2 said:

Well, that pretty much killed off any interest I might've ever had in collecting CGC slabbed pulps.

But in the meantime, I'm buying stock in companies that manufacture:

Dahle 533 Professional Guillotine Cutter (13.375")

and 

For 80 Years, X-Acto Has Been on the Cutting Edge of Edge Cutting | Arts &  Culture | Smithsonian Magazine

 

On 7/19/2021 at 8:17 PM, aardvark88 said:

At about the 1 hour 15 minute point of above interview, President M. Nelson declares trimmed pulp covers will garner the Cgc Blue label, not PLOD, as trimming is so common and 'accepted by the pulp hobby.'

Well trimming isn’t really “accepted” by the hobby but it is tolerated somewhat since trimmed books particularly high demand ones still sell  but with the trimming factored in over a untrimmed copy in price. He did say any trimming would be factored into the grading. Even without any trimming overhangs regularly will tear or break off with handling and so it probably makes more sense with overhangs to just factor the condition of the overhang into the grading. I’ll give them a benefit of a doubt with this position for now since the whole how could you ever grade pulps to begin with including lengthy discussions on overhangs and storing them has happened over the years here and now in our own pulp section. I think anyone approaching the grading of pulps with an eye to grade them exactly like comics will fail and anyone collecting them and thinking of their grading the same as comics isn’t in tune with pulp collectors over the past decades of collecting. They will be a tough nut to crack for slabs due to their special format requirements…

Edited by N e r V
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On 7/19/2021 at 8:17 PM, aardvark88 said:

At about the 1 hour 15 minute point of above interview, President M. Nelson declares trimmed pulp covers will garner the Cgc Blue label, not PLOD, as trimming is so common and 'accepted by the pulp hobby.'

I think pulps, which I have collected since the 1970's are a different animal when it comes to overhang, etc so triming no big, they will make a grade adjustment. It is not like color touch or glue and I agree. This is a very significant announcement in which the value of graded pulps, especially high grade are going to explode. You have to give HA credit for starting the "pulp" auctions, I believe they have had two different ones already. Then CC followed the leader with their latest  big pulp auction which is happening now, Other auction houses will also follow the leader. But this is a game changer for pulps and pulp collecting in the future. Why...quick answer is now there will be access from investors or newbie collectors who can rely on CGC to grade and place a floor on pulp values. This is huge move, a game changer. So, do not be surprised to see a number of pulps which have been sitting for years in dealer inventories to get bought up or prices raised. I just go a e-mial today from CC which indicates they will be attending "pulpfest" convention. The "big" boys are coming. Look for a large number of board members or dealers begin accumulating stock and seeking out very high grade examples of the classic pulp pedigrees which exist out there, especially for sellers who are unaware of the impeding CGC entry into the pulp market. You need to act now, as the word will get out the first minute a slab is placed on the internet. . A few years ago I raved about the Captain Future complete set of 17 issues with some pedigree copies among them. A board member picked them up and man he is looking really good right now with this announcement.

 Pulps are growing up now, and congratulations  welcome to the "big" time of  collectable  graded acknowledgement world!

Edited by Mmehdy
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On 7/20/2021 at 11:58 AM, Mmehdy said:

I think pulps, which I have collected since the 1970's are a different animal when it comes to overhang, etc so triming no big, they will make a grade adjustment. It is not like color touch or glue and I agree. This is a very significant announcement in which the value of graded pulps, especially high grade are going to explode. You have to give HA credit for starting the "pulp" auctions, I believe they have had two different ones already. Then CC followed the leader with their latest  big pulp auction which is happening now, Other auction houses will also follow the leader. But this is a game changer for pulps and pulp collecting in the future. Why...quick answer is now there will be access from investors or newbie collectors who can rely on CGC to grade and place a floor on pulp values. This is huge move, a game changer. So, do not be surprised to see a number of pulps which have been sitting for years in dealer inventories to get bought up or prices raised. I just go a e-mial today from CC which indicates they will be attending "pulpfest" convention. The "big" boys are coming. Look for a large number of board members or dealers begin accumulating stock and seeking out very high grade examples of the classic pulp pedigrees which exist out there, especially for sellers who are unaware of the impeding CGC entry into the pulp market. You need to act now, as the word will get out the first minute a slab is placed on the internet. . A few years ago I raved about the Captain Future complete set of 17 issues with some pedigree copies among them. A board member picked them up and man he is looking really good right now with this announcement.

 Pulps are growing up now, and congratulations  welcome to the "big" time of  collectable  graded acknowledgement world!

Yeah, this will be interesting.  I have quite a few pulps ...not that many notorious crime/horror/sexually-explicit covers... but some rare older classics of the SF genre, including bedsheet (magazine) size Gernsback era Amazings & Astoundings.  Grading is going to be interesting due to those with overhang and how to assess trimming where present, as well as PQ, since pulps often suffer worse PQ issues than comics, but the market's clearly booming. (thumbsu

:tink:

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On 7/20/2021 at 11:17 AM, Cat-Man_America said:

Yeah, this will be interesting.  I have quite a few pulps ...not that many notorious crime/horror/sexually-explicit covers... but some rare older classics of the SF genre, including bedsheet (magazine) size Gernsback era Amazings & Astoundings.  Grading is going to be interesting due to those with overhang and how to assess trimming where present, as well as PQ, since pulps often suffer worse PQ issues than comics, but the market's clearly booming. (thumbsu

:tink:

The next thing that will explode as a result of CGC entry will be Pulp original art...especially covers....that is a great long term play right now before the CGC pulp grading market is created.

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On 7/20/2021 at 1:31 PM, Mmehdy said:

The next thing that will explode as a result of CGC entry will be Pulp original art...especially covers....that is a great long term play right now before the CGC pulp grading market is created.

In some cases pulp art prices have already seen phenomenal growth ...especially cover art based on popular characters,   A lot depends on the quality of art and subject matter, but there is plenty of room for growth.  Certain artists will always be in high demand.

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On 7/20/2021 at 2:07 PM, Robot Man said:

Pulps are pulps NOT comic books. They need a different grading standard. I have said that about perfect bound comic book annuals and Giants for years. 

Many were made with overhangs. Like it or not. They also had squared, glued bindings. If you allow trimming, what about pressing which might or might not press out with damage? Glue might dry out or crack. Not to mention pulp paper is even cheaper than comic paper. Heat is not kind to old cheap paper. 

Any “work” done on them is alteration and should be graded as such. If we allow trimming, how many beautiful pulps will be destroyed just as comics were when we all allowed tape? 

We have a clean slate with pulps. Let’s get it right the first time and respect the integrity of the pulp as it is. 

But when the big greenbacks come out, I suspect many blind eyes will come out as well. 

Obviously, there will have to be holders designed to take overhangs into consideration. 

:sumo:

I won’t take issue with any of this, but a nuanced argument could be made for HOW that grading is conducted and recorded on labels.  Personally, I think the purple label is a bad idea except where pages are missing or poorly conducted amateur restoration has clearly damaged books, but that’s just my perspective, OMMV..

The grading itself can be adjusted downward for trimming overhang or other minor repairs done to preserve books.  There may even be room for the reapplication of glue to spines which have separated from stapled interiors provided an appropriate period friendly glue is applied.  This might not even fall under the restoration category unless it repairs damage to fragile paper.

These are just random thoughts.  I’m sure that there are good arguments on the other side of the ledger. 

:tink:

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On 7/20/2021 at 12:20 PM, Robot Man said:

Oh boy, it’s not bad enough that the good folks at HA and the “big guys” are quickly pricing most average collectors out of the hobby, but now pulps will be joining the club. We all knew it was coming and maybe rightly so but hopefully it will be a little slower. 

Don’t get me wrong, insane prices are great for us “old timers” if we want to sell. I laugh all the way to the bank. I just miss being able to actually collect comics for myself. 

I hear collecting matchbooks is still affordable...

We as old timers and other advanced collectors still have time to buy, especially on E-bay etc as we are still ahead of the curve, however that widow is  closing...

Edited by Mmehdy
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On 7/20/2021 at 1:55 PM, Mmehdy said:

We as old timers and other advanced collectors still have time to buy, especially on E-bay etc as we are still ahead of the curve, however that widow is  closing...

Nah, it's already been too late for pulps since a few years ago as they have slowly been creeping into the comic book auctions over time. 

If you really want to get ahead of the curve here, you need to load up on the rare and HTF BLB's in grade before they start to wake up from their almost century long slumber.  :gossip:

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On 7/19/2021 at 8:17 PM, aardvark88 said:

At about the 1 hour 15 minute point of above interview, President M. Nelson declares trimmed pulp covers will garner the Cgc Blue label, not PLOD, as trimming is so common and 'accepted by the pulp hobby.'

Too late with this  :news:  as I was down at the Loonie Store yesterday and apparently there wasalready  a big run on all of the scissors, as collectors were apparently running down to the store as fast their their little feet could take them and looking for the sharpest pair of scissors to buy.  lol

Edited by lou_fine
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On 7/20/2021 at 5:37 PM, lou_fine said:

Nah, it's already been too late for pulps since a few years ago as they have slowly been creeping into the comic book auctions over time. 

If you really want to get ahead of the curve here, you need to load up on the rare and HTF BLB's in grade before they start to wake up from their almost century long slumber.  :gossip:

Kidding aside, one could look to the “silver age” of the pulps, the men’s adventure (“sweat”) magazines.

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