Just Got Back Some Books - VERY Ticked Off 4 4

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 3/18/2022 at 10:41 PM, Shannon Buff said:

I feel you. My last few books I got from CGC has been grossly underrated imo. Usually when you look at a 4.5, the edges and the spine is jacked up. My avengers 70 which I expected to be a 7.0 especially after getting cleaned and pressed came back as a 4.5. 

You guys decide???

Need better pics, but that URC doesn’t look like it belongs on a 7.0

Edited March 19, 2022 by THE_BEYONDER

[Funnybooks]

On 3/18/2022 at 10:41 PM, Shannon Buff said:

I feel you. My last few books I got from CGC has been grossly underrated imo. Usually when you look at a 4.5, the edges and the spine is jacked up. My avengers 70 which I expected to be a 7.0 especially after getting cleaned and pressed came back as a 4.5. 

You guys decide???

there's a fair amount of chipping throughout both wraps that would preclude this copy from approaching any grade close to 7.0. Is that lower staple exhibiting some rust?

[Chuck K]

On 2/28/2022 at 12:05 AM, Mercury Man said:

My opinion, is that CGC is getting inundated with crapola, that shouldn't warrant a grade and entombing in the first place.  They simply can not supply the man power or quality control to grade this variant or that mid-grade non-key silver age book, that shouldn't be sent off in any sane universe.   Save your money, hassle and time, and go get a 2 mil mylar and acid free backing board and be happy.

Okay, so where are you getting this close minded opinion from?  Any, and every book sent in by someone is worthy of encapsulation and grading. One of CGC's  selling points since they began grading is that there service protects the book for long time storage and viewing. So if I have a 2.0 book I can't get it graded to help prolong it life and fragile state without living in an insane world? one man's trash is another man's treasure. We pay for a service, it should not matter what condition the book is in.

[Lazyboy]

On 3/19/2022 at 1:05 PM, Chuck K said:

Okay, so where are you getting this close minded opinion from?  Any, and every book sent in by someone is worthy of encapsulation and grading. One of CGC's  selling points since they began grading is that there service protects the book for long time storage and viewing.

 There are better, easier, and cheaper ways of accomplishing that.

On 3/19/2022 at 1:05 PM, Chuck K said:

So if I have a 2.0 book I can't get it graded to help prolong it life and fragile state without living in an insane world? one man's trash is another man's treasure. We pay for a service, it should not matter what condition the book is in.

If you have more money than brains, it's really not necessary to prove it.

[Chuck K]

Like I said...Close minded. Nuff said.

[Chuck K]

On 3/19/2022 at 2:46 PM, The Velcronomicon said:

It's called being realistic 

LOL, Yea, because we should only grade books that are high quality or expensive.  Tell CGC that and see what they you. What are you, Lazyboys mother? He was doing just fine on his own defending his position. Go back into the woodwork please. 

[Chuck K]

On 3/19/2022 at 3:01 PM, The Velcronomicon said:

Here's your last sale:

 

Not my last sale, far from it.

[ThothAmon]

On 3/19/2022 at 3:01 PM, The Velcronomicon said:

That's a good start...

I find it hilarious that a comic book collector is criticizing what others collect. To itch his own. 

[Chuck K]

I see it now, you are one of those people who just like to hear yourself talk. I'll just leave you to your own childish hijinks .

[ThothAmon]

On 3/19/2022 at 3:15 PM, The Velcronomicon said:

Sorry this one:

Obvious outlier sale. Average price for 9.8 on eBay was about $70 for last 90 days. Sounds like a profit to me. Plus Not so smart seller didn’t make note it was a newsstand.

 

 

[thehumantorch]

On 2/27/2022 at 3:27 PM, PovertyRow said:

Sadly no matter how I angle it I cannot get a good shot showing the NCB dents on the Moon Knight #1. So here is a full scan of a 6.0. Again, no sign of any light stain on back and scanning it just shows a nice white reverse.

NOTE the lower right line on the red dress is a NCB crease that is reflecting light so it looks color breaking. And a lot of that mess next to "Premier Issue" is from NCB creasing within that dent along with the Color Breaking Creasing. Note that the deep breaking creasing there was not present when I sent the book in.  6.0 is very harsh for this. At least they did WP.

 

I’m on my phone so working with a small image but is that a stain to the right of “ expert builder series”?

[The Lions Den]

On 3/19/2022 at 10:11 AM, The Velcronomicon said:

What do the graders' notes say?

The grader notes for the Avengers #70 are: 1) Light creasing to cover. 2) Light fox to cover. 3) Light pieces out to cover. 4) Light wear all edges of cover. 

To be clear, Note #2 is almost certainly referring to foxing and Note #3 is likely referring to Marvel chipping. 

But it is pretty amazing how the CGC holder can disguise certain flaws and make an average book look pretty nice... 

Edited March 20, 2022 by The Lions Den

[Shannon Buff]

On 3/19/2022 at 10:19 AM, Funnybooks said:

there's a fair amount of chipping throughout both wraps that would preclude this copy from approaching any grade close to 7.0. Is that lower staple exhibiting some rust?

Still new to this but I guess chipping is what you call the color on the edges being chipped away. If this is a defect then why does it get beat up that bad by CGC. 

I guess I need to look for that in the future since I grossly overpaid for that book 

[The Lions Den]

On 3/19/2022 at 10:58 PM, Shannon Buff said:

Still new to this but I guess chipping is what you call the color on the edges being chipped away. If this is a defect then why does it get beat up that bad by CGC. 

I guess I need to look for that in the future since I grossly overpaid for that book 

I'm sorry to hear that you grossly overpaid for the book...  

But to be honest, Marvel chipping usually isn't hammered that hard by CGC. The chipping would be in conjunction with the other flaws that were noted. 

There are always differences of opinion on how much you should downgrade for certain flaws, and even the best graders make errors in judgement. Moreover, I consider the area between 4.0 and 7.0 the toughest area of the grading scale. In this area, it can be difficult to separate the wheat from the chaff...    

[Shannon Buff]

On 3/19/2022 at 8:34 PM, The Lions Den said:

The grader notes for the Avengers #70 are: 1) Light creasing to cover. 2) Light fox to cover. 3) Light pieces out to cover. 4) Light wear all edges of cover. 

To be clear, Note #2 is almost certainly referring to foxing and Note #3 is likely referring to Marvel chipping. 

But it is pretty amazing how the CGC holder can disguise certain flaws and make an average book look pretty nice... 

Thanks for pulling up the notes for it. From what I read it seems CGC really bangs up a comic if it has foxing. I didn't noticed it since it was kinda disguised by the color. It looks like it is on the bottom of the front cover. 

[Engr62]

On 3/20/2022 at 1:05 PM, The Lions Den said:

But to be honest, Marvel chipping usually isn't hammered that hard by CGC.

I thought "Marvel chipping" was only on books from the late 50s to the early 60s.  I could be wrong--and I usually am--but I doubt the edge wear on a very late 1969 book would be from Marvel chipping and would just be normal edge wear.

[The Lions Den]

On 3/20/2022 at 5:28 PM, Engr62 said:

I thought "Marvel chipping" was only on books from the late 50s to the early 60s.  I could be wrong--and I usually am--but I doubt the edge wear on a very late 1969 book would be from Marvel chipping and would just be normal edge wear.

Of course, you're right about that time period being the most common period for Marvel chipping. But from what I can see in the posted photos, the book does appear to exhibit the same characteristics I'd expect to see with Marvel chipping. And the grading notes do differentiate between the chipping and normal edge wear.  

One thing is certain: No matter how it happened, unless the book is extremely low grade, that kind of chipping is going to affect the final grade...  

Edited March 20, 2022 by The Lions Den

[Randall Dowling]

On 3/20/2022 at 5:33 PM, The Lions Den said:

Of course, you're right about that time period being the most common period for Marvel chipping. But from what I can see in the posted photos, the book does appear to exhibit the same characteristics I'd expect to see with Marvel chipping.

People that collect Amazing Spider-man 300 would agree with you.  There are books that suffer this phenomenon in almost every age of comics.  It's just far less common than the early Marvel SA books.

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 3/20/2022 at 7:31 PM, Randall Dowling said:

People that collect Amazing Spider-man 300 would agree with you.  There are books that suffer this phenomenon in almost every age of comics.  It's just far less common than the early Marvel SA books.

ASM 300s aren’t chipping though. They are cut that way.

[FFB]

On 2/27/2022 at 1:20 PM, PovertyRow said:

I missed one of the returns:

Marvel Spotlight 32
7.0 WHITE

Grader Notes
bend right top of front cover - NCB and easily pressable. Also easily could have been caused by mishandling at CGC.
multiple crease back cover - again same as above. Easy to press out but looks like heavy finger pressure would have caused this.
small crease right center of front cover breaks color
spine stress lines

Pics of creases back cover and top right bend:

 

I'll go out on a limb and state categorically that, unless your presser just plain didn't work on your books and sent them in straightaway, this damage occurred at CGC.  That top edge bend absolutely would come out with a press job with no difficulty.  

I had this happen to several of my books in years past and now I take multiple images of the book before submitting.  I do believe that CGC is failing to take proper precautions with books during handling, as I've seen way too many stories like this over the years and they seem to be accelerating lately.  

It's a shame that there's such a huge delta between CGC and CBCS values right now, especially with Steve B. and West doing the grading at CBCS.  It's obviously the same grading scale since Steve created the scale at both companies and wouldn't have changed it when he started CBCS, and no one can claim that CGC's graders are "better" than CBCS's graders.