THE BATMAN spoilers thread 2 2

[NewWorldOrder]

On 3/7/2022 at 4:27 PM, Bosco685 said:

I've seen some of his movie reviewes previously for comic book films and was surprised how deep he could go into movie lore.

But this once sent out him off the political deep end for sure. Including inserting references I have no idea how he landed there.

I understand one line from what Catwoman said which I do agree it was kinda dumb it was in the movie, but other than that I think the movie just showed just as most movies show either side can take things too far to psycho levels. 

So while I do enjoy Ben as he loved Spider-man NWH I fundamentally disagree completely on his take about Batman, now he is just being a hater

[eastriver400]

On 3/7/2022 at 6:45 PM, NewWorldOrder said:

I haven't stopped thinking about The Batman (2022) since I saw it last night. 

This really is the first Batman movie where after the movie was over I was thinking about Batman instead of the villains.  I felt like I was in the comic book pages nervous of what was going to happen next.  I could feel the dark tone, the angst, and the vibe of what a real Batman post Neal Adams, Frank Miller, Jeph Loeb truly feels like to me as a kid in the late 80/90's.  Growing up with the first Batman comics I ever read being Death in the Family, Killing Joke, Dark Knight, and the then current Jim Aparo art take on the character always had me thinking Batman was so close to cracking himself to the other side in which he was fighting against. This movie really is The Long Halloween, Year 2, dash of Hush, and a hint of Court of Owls which has me truly believing this is the start of something amazing.  I thought I was spoiled after the Nolan trilogy, but seriously its really only because of Health Ledger I am not saying The Batman (2022) is the best Batman movie I have ever seen!  It's knocking on my top list as #2 trying to push me to put it #1! 

After seeing it for a second time I just might rate this movie 4.9 out of 5 instead of 4.5

100 %. I can’t stop thinking about it.   Is it number 1? Not sure yet. Trying my hardest not to compare it to TDK but I keep thinking about the Jail scenes (Batman / Riddler vs Batman / Joker) in both movies. The TDK scene was so much more intense but like you said, that was all Heath Ledger. 

[NewWorldOrder]

On 3/7/2022 at 5:21 PM, eastriver31400 said:

100 %. I can’t stop thinking about it.   Is it number 1? Not sure yet. Trying my hardest not to compare it to TDK but I keep thinking about the Jail scenes (Batman / Riddler vs Batman / Joker) in both movies. The TDK scene was so much more intense but like you said, that was all Heath Ledger. 

Hopefully soon they are going to release the deleted scene with Batman and Joker in Arkham.  Now I am not sure about the guy they got to plat Joker just yet, but I am waiting to see that deleted scene.

[William-James88]

On 3/7/2022 at 6:45 PM, NewWorldOrder said:

I haven't stopped thinking about The Batman (2022) since I saw it last night. 

This really is the first Batman movie where after the movie was over I was thinking about Batman instead of the villains.  I felt like I was in the comic book pages nervous of what was going to happen next.  I could feel the dark tone, the angst, and the vibe of what a real Batman post Neal Adams, Frank Miller, Jeph Loeb truly feels like to me as a kid in the late 80/90's.  Growing up with the first Batman comics I ever read being Death in the Family, Killing Joke, Dark Knight, and the then current Jim Aparo art take on the character always had me thinking Batman was so close to cracking himself to the other side in which he was fighting against. This movie really is The Long Halloween, Year 2, dash of Hush, and a hint of Court of Owls which has me truly believing this is the start of something amazing.  I thought I was spoiled after the Nolan trilogy, but seriously its really only because of Health Ledger I am not saying The Batman (2022) is the best Batman movie I have ever seen!  It's knocking on my top list as #2 trying to push me to put it #1! 

After seeing it for a second time I just might rate this movie 4.9 out of 5 instead of 4.5

 

On 3/7/2022 at 8:21 PM, eastriver31400 said:

100 %. I can’t stop thinking about it.   Is it number 1? Not sure yet. Trying my hardest not to compare it to TDK but I keep thinking about the Jail scenes (Batman / Riddler vs Batman / Joker) in both movies. The TDK scene was so much more intense but like you said, that was all Heath Ledger. 

Add me to the list. It's all I've been able to think about since warchkng it Thursday. 

And @NewWorldOrder, I adore your review. I too felt really nervous, it was one hell of an emotional ride for a Batman film. I am with you on everything you said. 

You know, we have to admit, while the Batman franchise may have some if the worst superhero films ever, it also has the very best. TDK is an incredible film, so for us to even debate if this one is as good is a hell of a treat.

Edited March 8, 2022 by William-James88

[Artboy99]

saw this with @kimikand another friend.

I am at 6.5-7 range and of the 3 of us I think I liked it the most.

It borrows from The Long Halloween, and heavily from the movie Se7en. This is not a bad thing as I really like the writing of both of those.

This movie is noticeably long and I think it could have ended with the meeting of the Batman and Edward in Arkham and didn't need to go on with all the copycats in the arena.

Where it didn't capture me is in the emotion of Bruce/the Batman. Seeing his parents murdered is what created the person he is now. He is angry and does take his vengeance on the criminals, yet I didn't feel his emotion. It was flat for me and I do not place the blame on Pattinson as an actor I think he was directed to portray the character in that way. He is sullen, brooding and quiet and doesn't make many if any public appearances. Very introverted take on the character of Bruce Wayne.

I liked the Selina Kyle character the best, well done by Zoe Kravitz.

 

[kimik]

@ Artboy99 liked it the most out of the three of us. The other friend and I were not impressed. This is an average film at best. The story and plot were predictable. I was able to call out the lines the actors were going to say at "key" moments before they happened. Our friend was laughing as I went to the washroom (which I do not do at movies I like), came back, and said the next couple of lines without seeing the preceeding scenes. The "falling for you" scenes between Batman and Catwoman were as bad as Anakin and Padme in the Phantom Menace and Attack of the Clones.

That being said, Zoe Kravitz was good as Catwoman and a pleasant surprise. I can't say the same for Pattinson. If you want Batman to only have one look like Zoolander, just use a cardboard cutout for the next film and save $10 million on production costs. Or, maybe get the Peacemaker to provide some facial exercises for him to work on?

As I posted in the other thread, the movie was 30-45 minutes too long, which is just like Reeves' Apes movies.

The Batmobile reveal and car chase was mostly pointless - why rev the engine for what seemed like 15 minutes at the back of the alley before actually starting the chase? And, the rocket booster did not make any sense.

The whole seawall detonation and flooding was pointless. All they had to do was end it with them catching the Riddler and it would have been a better movie. The only thing that might come out of the plodding last half hour is the Batman's use of Venom? That could mean Bane is in the future, I guess.

The Joker's laugh at the end was bad. It made me wish Leto was in the cell as the actor instead, which is not really a positive, is it?

And it is funny to see everyone hyped up about the dark and gritty imagery, yet Snyder got panned for it in BvS and Justice League. Fickle crowd. 

I think our friend summed it up best - we have waited a decade since the Nolan trilogy and this is what we get?

As a Batman fanboy, I am torn on whether I want the movie to be a box office success or not. If it is, we get another half-assed Reeves/Pattinson origin/development retcon flick the next go round.   On the other hand, if it sees a significant drop due to run time and mixed word of mouth, then maybe the new Discovery merged company fires the WB exec team, puts in a creative head with a 10 year plan, and they churn out better movies in a more cohesive series of films going forward. Right now it is a mess with Directors doing what they want regardless of how the films play together. That is why the MCU can turn 2nd and 3rd tier properties into highly profitable franchises while WB/DC has Aquaman and Wonder Woman outdoing their two biggest properties, Batman and Superman, at the box office.

 

 

[theCapraAegagrus]

Shapiro's review is hit/miss, much like the movie itself.

[jsilverjanet]

These are great and funny https://apple.news/AqSbq06GFR56F32_DI8d9jw

[jsilverjanet]

I also have not stopped thinking about why I liked the movie so much but I think I figured it out

its an adult comic book movie with a main super hero 

[Bosco685]

The Heavy Spoilers Show revisits some of the key movie details

 

[Microchip]

On 3/9/2022 at 9:26 AM, Bosco685 said:

The Heavy Spoilers Show revisits some of the key movie details

 

This guy is hilarious!!!   ..and quietly brilliant 

[Bosco685]

On 3/8/2022 at 5:42 PM, Microchip said:

This guy is hilarious!!!   ..and quietly brilliant 

Where both Emergency Awesome and The Heavy Spoilers Show do a lot of research in advance, the latter also adds a heavy dose of comedy to his content as well.

Have really enjoyed that part of his videos.

[aardvark88]

This is not a superhero movie. 'The Batman' is a cinematic masterpiece IMHO. Great directing right down to last 5 mins. with the playful Cat and Bat motorcycles racing then they diverge (career) paths in the fork in the road. More of a serious tone which is why I loved Marvel's 'Logan' western movie also. No 'forced' jokes like 'Avengers' movies and shawarma which does play better to families and their total box office $$.

[piper]

On 3/8/2022 at 6:28 PM, aardvark88 said:

This is not a superhero movie. 'The Batman' is a cinematic masterpiece IMHO. Great directing right down to last 5 mins. with the playful Cat and Bat motorcycles racing then they diverge (career) paths in the fork in the road. More of a serious tone which is why I loved Marvel's 'Logan' western movie also. No 'forced' jokes like 'Avengers' movies and shawarma which does play better to families and their total box office $$.

That motorcycle scene was filmed at the Necropolis in Glasgow.

[Bosco685]

Quote

Comic fans have long understood that Superman is the god who made himself a man and Batman is the man who made himself a god, but that understanding of the character is what the criminals are meant to see. The cruel brute who uses fear as a weapon was never meant to be the full story when it comes to Bruce Wayne and his quest. In fact, said depictions of him are typically only used as a cautionary tale for what can happen if he gets too consumed by his mission.

 

“You don’t have to pay with him. You’ve paid enough.”

Chills ran down my spine as Robert Pattinson’s Batman uttered this very basic sentence to Zoe Kravitz’ Catwoman. With this single line, director Matt Reeves showcases that he understands that it is not the brute strength that makes Batman, but his empathy. In fact, Reeves doesn’t just get it; he made empathy vs. brutality a key theme of his wildly impressive film.

 

Through the ages, Batman’s most powerful stories are the ones where he can tell the difference between an irredeemable monster, like The Batman’s Riddler (Paul Dano), and someone who is simply having a really bad day, like The Batman’s Catwoman, or Batman: The Animated Series’ Harley Quinn.

 

Cinematic representations often do very little to highlight this side of The Bat, with some contemporary iterations ignoring it entirely. Reeves’ Batman, however, seems to have it coursing through his veins for both better and worse. Sometimes, when we get so wrapped up in wanting to solve something that it consumes us, the human response is what boils down to what’s known as toxic empathy. Basically, Bruce over-identifies with the people of Gotham because he so desperately wants to ensure that no one goes through what he went through. In doing so, he makes both great and terrible choices in his vigor, and tries to separate himself from one of his strongest assets.

 

[Bosco685]

On 3/9/2022 at 4:54 AM, Bosco685 said:

 

One example where this writer missed the mark on this being THE FIRST empathetic Bruce Wayne/Batman:

Batman Forever - when Grayson shares he wants to kill Two-Face for the murder of his parents, Bruce Wayne relates but shares the dangers of endless vengeance. And how with each action it never fills the void of loss.

Empathy is built into the character by design in his quest to protect others from the same loss he experienced.

[William-James88]

On 3/9/2022 at 6:38 AM, Bosco685 said:

One example where this writer missed the mark on this being THE FIRST empathetic Bruce Wayne/Batman:

Batman Forever - when Grayson shares he wants to kill Two-Face for the murder of his parents, Bruce Wayne relates but shares the dangers of endless vengeance. And how with each action it never fills the void of loss.

Empathy is built into the character by design in his quest to protect others from the same loss he experienced.

Yeah, that's weird. The whole point is he doesn't want others to suffer the same fate as him. The first Batman comic I read was the Long Halloween and those words are highlighted in the opening pages before the story even starts. But sure, maybe we see it here best, though I think that's just because Batman seeing the kid feel loss is Matt Reeves replacing Batman's origin story with this scene.

Anyways, I don't see this discussed much in either thread but as a reply to those saying this film is humourless, that isn't true. Sure, it's dark and gloomy, but that just makes the humour bits stand out more. The following is not a complete list, just some I wanted to point out where I did chuckle and even laugh out loud.

1. The  whole section when they interrogate the Penguin. From him calling his interrogators "Good Cop and not_in_tune_with_social_norms Cop" to waddling like a penguin at the end.

2. I like that bit at the funeral where Martinez is kind of star struck to see Bruce Wayne and acts overly enthusiastic to see him there, especially given the circumstances of it being a funeral. It contrasts him being cold to batman in the beginning.

3. The "thumb drive" is a dark joke.

4. When Batman and Gordon are acting as 1940s noir characters and being up in eachother's faces to keep appearances to the cops. It's a funny scenario, especially with the camera zooming into the exaggerated facial expressions.

5. These were not in any order, just a list of parts I remember, but I did keep my favourite for last. It's when Batman is looking over evidence at the Riddler's apartment and a cop (I think Martinez) tells Gordon that Batman shouldn't be touching evidence. To which Gordon replies "He's wearing gloves". I laughed real hard at that one. And I don't think it's because it's an overly funny scene, but there had been so much tension up to that point that this little bit of levity felt really welcome.

 

I did also laugh at some of the dialogue being overly dour and basically being what Lego Batman would say but said in a "serious" movie rather than a parody setting. But that was unintentional comedy.

[Bosco685]

[Bosco685]

[Bosco685]