Mile High Copy of Superman 1 CGC 8.0 Sells For $5.3 Million 4 4

[VintageComics]

On 4/15/2022 at 8:55 PM, Buzzetta said:

Completely disagree with you on this one. 

 

Just because you can't envision something doesn't mean nobody can.

You're basically saying a seller and buyer shouldn't be able to agree on a price.

You couldn't price a skyscraper. But some people can. 

You can disagree all you want, but the buyer and seller disagree with you. 

On 4/16/2022 at 1:13 AM, Randall Dowling said:

I'm sorry, I think you misunderstood my post.  I'm not saying that a Superman 1 isn't worth more than an 8.0 of a CA 1 or an AF15.  My comparison was meant between highest graded copies of those books.  To make it even more clear for you.  If you could choose a Captain America 1 in CGC 9.6 or an Amazing Fantasy 15 in CGC 9.6 or a Superman 1 in CGC 8.0, which one would you take. 

But I think everything you wrote is debatable. otherwise.  YMMV.

You're stuck on the CGC grade. Some books don't exist in some grades. 

The Captain Marvel Adventures #1 in the GA forum is a great discussion point. That book doesn't exist above 5.0 due to brittle cover stock. CGC 5.0 is the known ceiling for that book. 

Is it comparable to a 9.6? We'll never know...because it doesn't' exist. So if you want the highest graded copy you have to settle for a 5.0

Motion Pictures Weekly #1, there are only 10 or so copies and DOES NOT exist without Brittle pages unless it's been restored. 

Should it compare to other books with White pages or unrestored copies? You don't have a choice. 

There are limitations to certain books and in this case, the Church is the best graded copy. For Superman #1, generally regarded as the 3rd best book in the hobby. It's the equivalent to a 9.6 AF #15 or a 9.2 Tec #27 or a Captain Marvel Adventures #1 CGC 5.0

Are you going to argue that because the Tec #27 is only a 9.2 it's not as desirable as a 9.6 or a 9.8 copy of a SA book? Probably not. 

The hierarchy is based on what's available, not absolute grades. 

[VintageComics]

On 4/14/2022 at 9:40 PM, THE_BEYONDER said:

Auctioned today....what do you think it goes for?

That's proprietary information in this day and age. 

Let's just say it goes for MOAR!

[Crowzilla]

On 4/16/2022 at 2:38 AM, VintageComics said:

Motion Pictures Weekly #1, there are only 10 or so copies and DOES NOT exist without Brittle pages unless it's been restored.

You're forgetting the Pay Copy - but you're nailing it with everything else in your post.

And congrats!

[VintageComics]

On 4/16/2022 at 3:14 AM, Crowzilla said:

You're forgetting the Pay Copy 

Apologies...but it's 'only' a 9.0 

On 4/16/2022 at 3:14 AM, Crowzilla said:

- but you're nailing it with everything else in your post.

It's basic logic.

Another thought crossed my mind. People have some mythical association with auctions as though FMV can only truly be found at auction. Like auction bidders tap into some power that magically determines FMV. 

In reality at least TWO people have to agree to what the end price is going to be, so that would be two people willing to pay prices that some might think is an outlier. Rest assured most people think long and hard what they're willing to bid at auction. 

Also, you never know if the high bidder would have been willing to pay far more than an auction realized price if the under bidder had bid higher.

If the under bidder bids low, it's just as possible to under pay at auction as it is to overpay due to an overzealous bidder, compared to a private sale.

Just ask Bob Storms. 

The reality is that only an actual bidder / buyer knows how they get to that number and whether it's an auction number or a direct sale, that is the FMB.

Everything else is just speculation. 

On 4/16/2022 at 3:14 AM, Crowzilla said:

And congrats!

Thank you! 

Edited April 16, 2022 by VintageComics

[Prince Namor]

On 4/15/2022 at 11:30 PM, KCOComics said:

With that said, if I was in a position to buy a book of this magnitude,  I wouldn't want to go through an auction house... I would do exactly what this buyer did. Contact established people in the industry I trust and work out a price we are both comfortable with. 

Without a doubt. Both came away happy with the agreed upon price, there you have it. The market determined it.

Edited April 16, 2022 by Prince Namor

[Buzzetta]

On 4/16/2022 at 2:38 AM, VintageComics said:

Just because you can't envision something doesn't mean nobody can.

You're basically saying a seller and buyer shouldn't be able to agree on a price.

You couldn't price a skyscraper. But some people can. 

You can disagree all you want, but the buyer and seller disagree with you. 

 

Again, 

The book is an anomaly in higher grade and with the background that surrounds it.   I am curious about the means to which a price was obtained for a higher grade Superman 1 where it becomes the highest price paid for a comic book.   Unlike a skyscraper which relies on tangible and measurable factors, such as labor, supplies, taxes, estimated time of completion based on similar projects and the like, a comic book is comparable to previous sales or books that are similar. 

Is this book similar or comparable to a 9.0 Action 1 even though those sales were recorded years ago... and by auction... and with multiple people competing against each other?  That is why I am asking.

There is no reason for you to be insufferable.

But... persist...  

 

 

[october]

The Church Superman 1 isn't completely without reasonable comps. A 7.0 blue label sold at the end of 2021 for 2.6 million at auction. I am not sure you need a whole lot more data points than that to ballpark out a one point better pedigree copy five months after. 

[Cat]

I wonder how future collectors will view this period of time. Like how we find old CBG ads and marvel at the miraculously cheap prices for heavy hitter books today. What will the reaction be when doing that in the future looking at this period? The same, cheap nostalgia, horror at what we were paying, shock over what we were buying, or something else entirely I haven't thought of. 

Your thoughts? 

[Buzzetta]

On 4/16/2022 at 10:12 AM, october said:

The Church Superman 1 isn't completely without reasonable comps. A 7.0 blue label sold at the end of 2021 for 2.6 million at auction. I am not sure you need a whole lot more data points than that to ballpark out a one point better pedigree copy five months after. 

Thanks 

[october]

On 4/16/2022 at 9:38 AM, Buzzetta said:

Thanks 

Yeah. 

The AF 9.6 is apples to oranges...kinda...but also provides a top of the hobby benchmark. Is the Church 8.0 Superman 1 cooler than a 9.6 AF 15? If so, by what percentage? You can also look to the Action 1 "Rocket Copy" that sold in 6.0 blue for ~$3.2 million last year. How much more expensive should one of the top Superman 1's be than a nice, but not a top copy, Action 1? 2x? 1.5x?

For what it's worth, and it's worth nothing since I don't even come within binoculars distance of that side of the hobby, the Superman 1 sale doesn't seem crazy price-wise. 

Edited April 16, 2022 by october

[mtracy64]

The 9.6 AF15 sale was difficult to interpret at the time - many believed it meant that AF15 was moving up relative the big GA books. It seems clear in the light of subsequent sales that the pecking order is more or less the same as it had been, just with significantly larger numbers attached to all the biggest books. It will be interesting to see what the 6.5 Tec 27 brings in Goldin's next auction.

[rob_react]

On 4/15/2022 at 9:31 PM, chrisco37 said:

Anomaly?  It’s Superman 1, which has always been a Top 5 (at worst) book.  It’s a tough book in any grade and notoriously rare in higher grades.  This is one of the best copies in existence. And it’s a Church to boot.  
If any book was going to break the 5M barrier, this  was one of them.  

I was going to write a post where I discussed the value of the best copy of Superman #1 and I was going to argue, that, under certain circumstances (it being a 9.2) it would be the third most valuable comic. Right now, after this result, I'm almost convinced that would be the case.

[VintageComics]

On 4/16/2022 at 7:57 AM, Buzzetta said:

Again, 

The book is an anomaly in higher grade and with the background that surrounds it.   I am curious about the means to which a price was obtained for a higher grade Superman 1 where it becomes the highest price paid for a comic book.   Unlike a skyscraper which relies on tangible and measurable factors, such as labor, supplies, taxes, estimated time of completion based on similar projects and the like, a comic book is comparable to previous sales or books that are similar. 

Is this book similar or comparable to a 9.0 Action 1 even though those sales were recorded years ago... and by auction... and with multiple people competing against each other?  That is why I am asking.

There is no reason for you to be insufferable.

But... persist...  

 

 

And there are no tangible factors involved in pricing a comic book? There are plenty but they're not always out in the open. 

When you want something special that someone else owns, you basically need to pry it from the owner's hands by making an offer they can't refuse. How do you put a price on that?

I'm trying to explain something that some may not understand and if that makes me in sufferable, so be it. 

[COI]

On 4/16/2022 at 1:13 AM, Randall Dowling said:

I'm sorry, I think you misunderstood my post.  I'm not saying that a Superman 1 isn't worth more than an 8.0 of a CA 1 or an AF15.  My comparison was meant between highest graded copies of those books.  To make it even more clear for you.  If you could choose a Captain America 1 in CGC 9.6 or an Amazing Fantasy 15 in CGC 9.6 or a Superman 1 in CGC 8.0, which one would you take. 

But I think everything you wrote is debatable. otherwise.  YMMV.

I understand what you're trying to say.

I think the logic you're using here works for the vast majority of books. But at this level, where the pool of books and buyers is as small as it is, there are a host of other factors at play that are more important than the number on the label. Factors such as who the buyers are and how they perceive the buying opportunity. Maybe they have those other books; maybe they're betting that this is going to be their only shot at a high grade Superman 1; who knows? We can compare labels and data points all day, but again, with such a small pool of buyers and available books at this level, individual whim is just as big of a factor.

You could also take the 9.6 vs 8.0 out of the question and ask, would you rather have a high grade Superman 1 or a high grade AF 15? How many chances will you likely get at the former vs the latter, if you are someone in the market for these types of books? 

[Axe Elf]

On 4/16/2022 at 9:18 AM, Mecha_Fantastic said:

I wonder how future collectors will view this period of time. Like how we find old CBG ads and marvel at the miraculously cheap prices for heavy hitter books today. What will the reaction be when doing that in the future looking at this period? The same, cheap nostalgia, horror at what we were paying, shock over what we were buying, or something else entirely I haven't thought of. 

Your thoughts? 

I hope that I will look back with fondness at these days in which you can still get nice-looking Warren magazines for under $100 each.

[Buzzetta]

On 4/16/2022 at 1:20 PM, VintageComics said:

And there are no tangible factors involved in pricing a comic book? There are plenty but they're not always out in the open. 

When you want something special that someone else owns, you basically need to pry it from the owner's hands by making an offer they can't refuse. How do you put a price on that?

I'm trying to explain something that some may not understand and if that makes me in sufferable, so be it. 

So be it. 

Edited April 16, 2022 by Buzzetta

[THE_BEYONDER]

[Kevin76]

On 4/16/2022 at 10:12 AM, october said:

The Church Superman 1 isn't completely without reasonable comps. A 7.0 blue label sold at the end of 2021 for 2.6 million at auction. I am not sure you need a whole lot more data points than that to ballpark out a one point better pedigree copy five months after. 

Since the 7.0 went for 2.6m and now a buyer wants the 8.0 copy with no previous sales data, Doubling the last sale for a one of a kind 8.0 is a good place to start at least. I just bought a one of a kind pre code horror book in a 8.5, previous sale was $1650 for a 6.5,  I offered double that price, seller said it was a fair offer but wanted another 1K since he wasn't in a big hurry to seller it...didn't think twice..here you go!   

If I was rich, with an opportunity to buy the Mile High Supes 1, I'd pay almost whatever it took to get it.     

[DC#]

Sort of off-topic but sort of on the topic....I put together a list of all the "six figure" books that sold since this boom started in 2020.   I will apologize in advance to the Gold collectors if I have left GA titles off the list.   As someone said above - not sure the pecking order has changed much - just more commas and zeros.  

 

Action Comics #1 8.5 -  $3.25M April 2021   Previous $2.052 in 2018

Action Comics #1 6.0 (Rocket Copy) - $3.18M Jan 2022  Previous $317k March 2009

Action Comics #1 3.0. - $1.638M Dec 2021.   Previous $499k 2016

 

Superman #1 8.0 (Mile High) - $5.3M  April 2022

Superman #1 7.0 - $2.60M Dec 2021

Superman #1 5.0 - $360k. July 2020   Previous $456k 2019

Superman #1 4.5 - $348k  Sept 2020.   Previous $336k 2019

Superman #1 3.5 - $288k. March 2020.     Previous $111k 2013

Superman #1 3.0 - $310k  Dec 2020.   Previous $40k 2009

Superman #1 1.0 - $141k. March 2022.   Previous $138k 2021

 

Detective Comics #27 7.0 - $1.5M Nov 2020.   Previous $493k 2010

Detective Comics #27 5.0. - $1.125M June 2021.  Previous $569K in 2018

Detective Comics #27 4.5 - $1.14M. Jan 2022     

 

Detective Comics #29 5.5 - $102k Sept 2020 

Detective Comics #29 4.5 - $110k Feb 2022 (Clink)    

 

Detective Comics #31 5.0 - $132k Nov 2020.  Previous $131k in 2017     

 

Detective Comics #33 8.0 - $192k Apr 2022.  Previous $167k in 2017     

 

Batman #1 9.4 - $2.22M Jan 2021

Batman #1 8.0 - $1.48M Sept 2021.   Previous $1.21M. Apr 2021

Batman #1 6.5 - $576k Sept 2021.   Previous $42k 2007

Batman #1 5.0 - $360k  April 2021.  Previous $240k in 2019

Batman #1 4.0 - $110k May 2020.    Down from prior year peak of $150k

Batman #1 3.0 - $230k Feb 2022 (Clink).  Previous $192k April 2021

Batman #1 2.5 - $270k Mar 2022.      Previous $133k 2020

Batman #1 2.0 (Promise) - $240k Nov 2021.   Previous $222k in 2021

Batman #1 1.8 - $180k April 2022.   Previous $28k in 2013

 

Suspense Comics #39 6.5 - $280k Feb 2022 (Clink)

 

Sensation Comics #1 8.5 - $160k Feb 2021 (Clink).  Previous $132k in Nov 2019

 

Captain America Comics #1 9.4 (San Francisco) - $3.12M April 2022.  Previous $915k in 2019

Captain America Comics #1 8.5 - $384k Jan 2021.  Previous $96k in 2009

Captain America Comics #1 8.0 - $395k Feb 2021 (Clink).   Previous $288k in 2016

Captain America Comics #1 7.0 - $340k Mar 2022.   Previous $186k in 2020

Captain America Comics #1 5.5 - $183k Dec 2020 (Clink).  Previous $156k in 2019

Captain America Comics #1 5.0 - $170k Feb 2022 (Clink).   Previous $78k in 2014

Captain America Comics #1 4.0 - $180k in Sep 2021.   Previous $3k in 2004

Captain America Comics #1 3.5 (Promise) - $240k in Nov 2021.    Previous $90k in 2020

 

Marvel Comics #1 9.2 (Pay Copy) - $2.43M Mar 2022.    

Marvel Comics #1 6.0 (Nic Cage Collection) - $280k Aug 2020 (Clink)

Marvel Comics #1 4.5 - $360k Jan 2022.   Previous $33.5k in 2009

Marvel Comics #1 2.5 - $364k  Mar 2022.  Previous $22k in 2003

 

Marvel Mystery Comics #4 7.5 - $160k Feb 2022 (Clink)

 

Amazing Fantasy #15 9.6 - $3.6M  Sept 2021.   Previous $1.1M in 2011

Amazing Fantasy #15 9.4 - $795k  Mar 2020.    Previous $705k in 2017

Amazing Fantasy #15 9.0 - $566k Feb 2021 (Clink)

Amazing Fantasy #15 8.5 – $707k Sept 2021.    Previous $155k in 2017

Amazing Fantasy #15 8.0 - $520k  Mar 2022.   Down from peak in prior year $560k

Amazing Fantasy #15 7.5 - $450k April 2022.    Previous $300k in April 2022

Amazing Fantasy #15 7.0 - $222k April 2022.    Down from 2022 peak of $252k

Amazing Fantasy #15 6.5 - $225k March 2022.   Previous $72k in 2020

Amazing Fantasy #15 5.5 - $102k March 2022.   Down from 2022 peak of $120k

 

Spider-Man #1 9.4 - $241k Sept 2021.    Previous $150k in 2017

Spider-Man #1 9.2 - $168k Nov 2021.    Previous $53k in 2013

 

Spider-Man #2 9.6 (Twin Cities) - $168k Sep 2021.    Previous $66k in 2011

 

Spider-Man #3 9.6 - $148k Sep 2021.    Previous $48k in 2021

 

Spider-Man #4 9.6 (Twin Cities) - $174k Sep 2021.    Previous $78k in 2011

 

Spider-Man #9 9.8 - $132k Sep 2021.    Previous $26k in 2015

 

Spider-Man #14 9.8 - $210k Sep 2021.    Previous $55k in 2015

 

Fantastic Four #1 9.2 - $1.5M Apr 2022.   

Fantastic Four #1 (CBCS 9.4) - $985k in April 2022 (Clink Exchange)

Fantastic Four #1 9.0 - $264k Apr 2021.   Previous $161k in 2017

Fantastic Four #1 8.5 - $350k Apr 2022 (Clink Exchange).   Previous $132k in 2021

Fantastic Four #1 7.5 - $168k Apr 2022.   Previous $69k in 2020

 

Fantastic Four #5 9.4 - $138k Apr 2021.   Previous $85k in 2020

Fantastic Four #5 9.2 - $150k Apr 2022/$160k Feb 2022 (Clink).   Previous $117k in 2021

 

Fantastic Four #48 9.8 - $108k Jun 2021.   Previous $37k in 2021

 

X-Men #1 9.6 - $807k Jun 2021.    Previous $250k in 2013

X-Men #1 9.4 - $215k Nov 2020.    Previous $153k in 2018

X-Men #1 9.2 - $276k April 2022.    Down from peak of $305k in 2022

X-Men #1 9.0 - $185k Dec 2021.    Previous $95k in 2021

X-Men #1 8.5 - $132k March 2022.    Down from peak of $158k in 2021

X-Men #1 8.0 - $102k April 2022.    Previous $90k in 2021; Clink $147k in June 2021

 

Avengers #1 9.6 - $369K Sep 2021.   Previous $194k in 2018

 

Incredible Hulk #1 8.5 - $245k Mar 2022 /Clink $270k Jan 2022.    Previous $93k in 2019 (peak of $132k in 2016)

Incredible Hulk #1 8.0 - $188k Dec 2021.    Previous $140k in 2021

Incredible Hulk #1 7.5 - $106k March 2022.    Previous $42k in 2020 (peak of $70k in 2019)

 

Daredevil #1 9.8 - $250K Mar 2021.    

Daredevil #1 9.6 - $150K Apr 2021.   Previous $102k in 2021

 

Journey into Mystery #83 9.4 - $432k April 2022.  Previous $320k in 2021

 

Tales of Suspense #39 9.2 - $144k Sept 2021.  Previous $65k in 2017 (peak $72k in 2011)

Tales of Suspense #38 8.5 - $120k Nov 2021 (Clink).

Edited April 16, 2022 by DC#

[Laszlo the Mudjar]

@DC# You need to start a patreon account so we can send a tip your way for all your hard work.  Really great to see the numbers presented like that.  I really thought 2022 would see a substantial pullback given the movement in the stock market, but such is not the case for the most coveted comics.