So looks like gocollect is using Youtube strike system to silence critics on Youtube 1 1

[Ares]

There is a youtuber I watch "Comic Book investments"

He did a  video on how gocollect is using invalid or fake date in sales figure.

Now it turns that gocollect has made a copyright infringement claim against his video to make him take it down.

 

Edited July 2, 2022 by Ares

[Tnexus]

Not surprised. A lot of their writers simply use it as a platform to pump their own stuff to sell on Ebay as well.

Edited July 2, 2022 by Tnexus

[Cat]

Well that doesn't make them look dodgy and like they have something to hide at all. 

Glad they're so above board and honest! What a bunch of swell guys and gals at Go Collect, abusing the Copyright Takedown system. Hope that video certainly doesn't circulate amongst collectors. 

Edited July 2, 2022 by Cat

[kav]

On 7/1/2022 at 5:03 PM, Ares said:

There is a youtuber I watch "Comic Book investments"

He did a  video on how gocollect is using invalid or fake date in sales figure.

Now it turns that gocollect has made a copyright infringement claim against his video to make him take it down.

 

isnt it fair use tho?
@jaybuck43 @Buzzetta

[Upgrayedd2]

This does not look good. Now I really want to see the video.

[Upgrayedd2]

Having watched the video, I can see where the word "fake" implies gocollect intentionally used incorrect sales figures. I've been using gocollect for a long time and I come across auction sales that never make it into their registry. The author of the video provides clear examples of gocollect using incorrect sales figures. However, there is no example of gocollect intentionally doing this. But, executing a copyright infringement, pretty weak. It's OK to make mistakes, It's what you do to remedy the mistake that people will remember.

 

Never mind, it's still available: 

 

Edited July 2, 2022 by Upgrayedd2
Added full comments

[Gaard]

On 7/2/2022 at 2:10 AM, Upgrayedd2 said:

The author of the video provides clear examples of gocollect using incorrect sales figures. However, there is no example of gocollect intentionally doing this.

Not sure how one would show this.

[Pantodude]

Technically, from YT’s perspective, the problem is not the vid’s suggestion (if not outright accusation) of fake data from GoCollect.  The copyright issue appears to stem from his use of actual screenshots of GoCollect's pages, which are normally available only to paying subscribers.  There should be another way to disclose GoC’s faulty sales data w/o screenshots.  If GoC’s errors are limited to eBay results (e.g., by reporting BIN’s and not the actual final price after offer accepted), citing GPA (w/o using a screenshot of GPA!) should help with that.  Then if viewers care enough, they can confirm any error for themselves. 

Edited July 2, 2022 by Pantodude

[Cat]

On 7/2/2022 at 8:42 PM, Pantodude said:

Technically, from YT’s perspective, the problem is not the vid’s suggestion (if not outright accusation) of fake data from GoCollect.  The copyright issue appears to stem from his use of actual screenshots of GoCollect's pages, which are normally available only to paying subscribers.  There should be another way to disclose GoC’s faulty sales data w/o screenshots.  If GoC’s errors are limited to eBay results (e.g., by reporting BIN’s and not the actual final price after offer accepted), citing GPA (w/o using a screenshot of GPA!) should help with that.    

Wouldn't that arguably fall under fair use, for purposes of criticism? Depending on what he said, of course. 

[Pantodude]

Dunno enough to say.  One would hope so (that something would allow this kind of informative video).  There’s certainly a public interest element, too, in looking out for the unwary.  

[shadroch]

When you go after someones livlihood, you'd best expect some pushback. 

[jaybuck43]

On 7/1/2022 at 11:33 PM, kav said:

isnt it fair use tho?
@jaybuck43 @Buzzetta

Technically no. I can’t watch this guy the whole way through because he’s just, yea beating a dead horse. But the video has got to go. Has nothing to do with what he says. He can claim go collect is using fake data all he wants. But he has a 15 minute video where…. He just shows go collects data for 15 minutes.  “Critique” is a valid use for the fair use defense, but the important term there is “fair”. Showing their data for say 1 minute out of a 15 minute video? Probably fair use. Strengthened by the fact that that one minute usage is just pointing out examples of issues “ok go collect shows last sale of hulk 181 was June 19th for $xxxx.xx but that sale doesn’t exist on heritage” or something to that extent. I can’t just play 15 minutes straight of dr strange and the multiverse of madness on my YT channel while I discuss it’s shortcomings. But I could play small snippets in a much longer video showing how they ripped off the music fight scene from an independent video game.

[MAR1979]

On 7/2/2022 at 8:21 AM, shadroch said:

When you go after someones livlihood, you'd best expect some pushback. 

and gocollect's bread n' butter livelihood was attractin' rubes during the bubble. Now that its a burstin' they be needin' more than dubious (IMHO) take downs in order to be keepin' their lights on. 

Perhaps they might consider consider offering a quality service with up-to-date accurate factual data without hyperbole, at a price that won't turn away most collectors. Nah that is probably too much work ... <sarcasm on> issuing dubious (IMHO) take downs is likley the superior business model. Next they can begin suing dirt poor welfare moms like the RIAA <sarcasm off>

Edited July 2, 2022 by MAR1979

[shadroch]

On 7/2/2022 at 6:44 AM, MAR1979 said:

and gocollect's bread n' butter livelihood was attractin' rubes during the bubble. Now that its a burstin' they be needin' more than morally and legally dubious take downs in order to be keepin' their lights on.

You say that as if it is a bad thing.

[Aman619]

Watched the video… I use GPA but also subscribe to go collect because it has other data that’s useful in identifying many colics.  I was impressed by their robust pricing guide sections at first.  But saw right away that their math for older books that don’t sell often or in every grade, it was useless as it just fills in the gaps with a simple algorithm.  Essentially creating a simple ladder of values, as the video mentions.

I think the video accurately points out other flaws in data gathering that a use wouldn’t expect.  Like using the list price over the actual best offer.  So a pretty informative video.

but, this guy doesn’t help his case the more he talks.  He also mentions that he has been in touch with GoCollect, speaking with the owner!  And they took his suggestion of adding the graph.  To me a guy with a relationship with a colleague in business should be able to call and discuss this.  So why go,out and burn GoCollect for what amounts to more creative suggestions about their methodology and price scraping?  Then he ta;is about how he spent 40K creating his,own price database but bailed.

iMO, video claims are accurate, GoCollect methods are faulty (GPA has the correct sale prices each time). But there’s more going on behind the scenes, involving this guys cocky sense of mission, his business interests and his relationship with GoCollect…. Coupled with GoCollects obvious pride in the efforts they’ve put into their impressive (but faulty around the edges) system they built and satisfaction that they are as accurate as they can be given their approach.

[Beastfeast]

Separate from the issue at hand, this guy is REALLY disingenuous in his "market trends" videos (and probably most other things).  Very few comic YouTubers are worth paying attention to.  It's like they're in a constant race to the bottom with horrible YouTube Face thumbnails and super click-baity titles.  At least this guy isn't YoUtUbE hYpE'd out - that's the one nice thing I can say about him.   

[greggy]

On 7/2/2022 at 7:47 AM, Beastfeast said:

Separate from the issue at hand, this guy is REALLY disingenuous in his "market trends" videos (and probably most other things).  Very few comic YouTubers are worth paying attention to.  It's like they're in a constant race to the bottom with horrible YouTube Face thumbnails and super click-baity titles.  At least this guy isn't YoUtUbE hYpE'd out - that's the one nice thing I can say about him.   

He's Mark Wilson's son so take that for what it's worth.  

[Aman619]

ouch

[kav]

On 7/2/2022 at 6:22 AM, jaybuck43 said:

Technically no. I can’t watch this guy the whole way through because he’s just, yea beating a dead horse. But the video has got to go. Has nothing to do with what he says. He can claim go collect is using fake data all he wants. But he has a 15 minute video where…. He just shows go collects data for 15 minutes.  “Critique” is a valid use for the fair use defense, but the important term there is “fair”. Showing their data for say 1 minute out of a 15 minute video? Probably fair use. Strengthened by the fact that that one minute usage is just pointing out examples of issues “ok go collect shows last sale of hulk 181 was June 19th for $xxxx.xx but that sale doesn’t exist on heritage” or something to that extent. I can’t just play 15 minutes straight of dr strange and the multiverse of madness on my YT channel while I discuss it’s shortcomings. But I could play small snippets in a much longer video showing how they ripped off the music fight scene from an independent video game.

what about a documentary on say a political figure or corporation that is 100% about that-no fair use?

[Upgrayedd2]

I found another mistake where GoC used the wrong sale price as a reference. See attached. I do not have the capability to see what the comic actually sold for.

(1) 07 July 2022, GoC lists a Strange Tale #138 sale on eBay for $1,050.

(2) 07 July 2022, eBay shows the comic sold for less than $1,049.95.

Unfortunately, it appears GoC accidentally referenced the Buy-It-Now as opposed to the Sold price. And, it included free shipping.