CGC Prices and Market Competitiveness 0

[RoLaren]

I am concerned for CGC's future security in the marketplace if they don't lower their prices or offer more competitive deals. Their most recent move has been to increase the price of sub grades. 

BGS is moving in the opposite direction, recently dropped their prices and turnaround times. PSA has been dropping their prices also, although their turnaround times are still bad. Look at the comparison with BGS though: 

BGS Economy tier - $25/card with sub grades, 25-45 day turnaround time
CGC Economy tier - $40/card with sub grades, 20 day turnaround time

BGS Standard tier - $40/card with sub grades, 10-20 day turnaround time
CGC Standard tier - $50/card with sub grades, 10 day turnaround time

CGC is still better in the Express and Walkthrough/Premium tiers, but they are going to lose a ton of business to BGS for customers seeking the cheapest grading options. I am hopeful a price decrease isn't far away.

Thoughts?

[IrishPrince]

PSA has emailed subscribers with a TCG Bulk deal of $15/card, 10-card minimum, $199/max per card. CGC on the other hand, has a 25-card minimum. I'd rather send my cards to CGC, but the 25-card minimum is too high. I'd like to see them match PSA in that regard. 

[RoLaren]

On 10/18/2022 at 12:28 PM, IrishPrince said:

PSA has emailed subscribers with a TCG Bulk deal of $15/card, 10-card minimum, $199/max per card. CGC on the other hand, has a 25-card minimum. I'd rather send my cards to CGC, but the 25-card minimum is too high. I'd like to see them match PSA in that regard. 

Same, I have never used PSA and don't intend to because CGC's slabs are far more attractive IMO. But they need to lower minimums or lower prices to make themselves more attractive, or this division of their business will suffer.

We could quickly realize a "race to the bottom" as far as grading goes heading into 2023, in a dramatic 1-2 year swing from where we've been recently. CGC is still the new kid on the block. I just want them to be okay and survive whatever's coming, and I hope they're making allowances to do that.

[mz1995g]

On 10/17/2022 at 5:33 PM, RoLaren said:

I am concerned for CGC's future security in the marketplace if they don't lower their prices or offer more competitive deals. Their most recent move has been to increase the price of sub grades. 

BGS is moving in the opposite direction, recently dropped their prices and turnaround times. PSA has been dropping their prices also, although their turnaround times are still bad. Look at the comparison with BGS though: 

BGS Economy tier - $25/card with sub grades, 25-45 day turnaround time
CGC Economy tier - $40/card with sub grades, 20 day turnaround time

BGS Standard tier - $40/card with sub grades, 10-20 day turnaround time
CGC Standard tier - $50/card with sub grades, 10 day turnaround time

CGC is still better in the Express and Walkthrough/Premium tiers, but they are going to lose a ton of business to BGS for customers seeking the cheapest grading options. I am hopeful a price decrease isn't far away.

Thoughts?

The turn around time for PSA and BGS is way longer. Most of my CGC orders are done in one week. CGC is also alot more accurate than BGS and PSA most of the time. PSA gameplays too much with grades and BGS has been slacking as of late.

Very unlikely people will go back to BGS since they have been going downhill for a while and its not really worth the time trying to chase a black label that your never going to get.

[IrishPrince]

On 10/18/2022 at 3:52 PM, mz1995g said:

The turn around time for PSA and BGS is way longer. Most of my CGC orders are done in one week. CGC is also alot more accurate than BGS and PSA most of the time. PSA gameplays too much with grades and BGS has been slacking as of late.

Very unlikely people will go back to BGS since they have been going downhill for a while and its not really worth the time trying to chase a black label that your never going to get.

Agree. But in this market, 25-cards is a high bar to hit for $15/card. The next tier is $25/card. That's a steep jump in the TCG world. Prices of slabbed cards are very low right now. Has CGC seen the prices sold on eBay? 

[mz1995g]

On 10/20/2022 at 10:49 AM, IrishPrince said:

Agree. But in this market, 25-cards is a high bar to hit for $15/card. The next tier is $25/card. That's a steep jump in the TCG world. Prices of slabbed cards are very low right now. Has CGC seen the prices sold on eBay? 

Depends on what cards your looking at. Modern being low on 9.5s? Well yeah, they arent rare 9.5s for modern cards. 10s do fine. Same with vintage 9.5s. And anything under depending on what it is does fine. I dont think the price of CGC slabs has been that bad. I sell alot of them myself on a daily basis and dont see that many issues, providing that the cards you have are actually rare. Its not like 2020 anymore to where any card in a slab has any value. You have to have cards that people are really looking for or in the top condition.

As for the 25 card limit, you will just have to put aside a decent amount of cards. Its not hard to hit 25 cards if you just wait on subbing until you hit that amount. It probably takes a bit if your not subbing all the time, but if you want to save money well there you go.

[Yeahiwasder4dat]

On 10/18/2022 at 1:34 PM, RoLaren said:

Same, I have never used PSA and don't intend to because CGC's slabs are far more attractive IMO. But they need to lower minimums or lower prices to make themselves more attractive, or this division of their business will suffer.

We could quickly realize a "race to the bottom" as far as grading goes heading into 2023, in a dramatic 1-2 year swing from where we've been recently. CGC is still the new kid on the block. I just want them to be okay and survive whatever's coming, and I hope they're making allowances to do that.

Definitely becoming a race to the bottom. Everyone has lowered prices. PSA opened bulk then dropped the price shortly there after. Think they may still be doing the $15 for TCG if that was them I saw the email from. The margins on sales are getting hard to overlook. Hard to justify sending to CGC at the moment for selling. I hate PSA with a passion. Feels like they have a dart board in the grading room as a determining factor based off of some of the returns. At least CGC still whooping them on turnaround time though.

Becoming harder to grade cards at the current prices, a 9 is pretty much break even. People probably aren't subbing that much anymore, coming off the heels of card market going wild and all the company's expanding. I foresee prices going lower still and turn around getting faster. Eventually prices have to go low enough to create volume so they can warrant these expansions and not lay off the people they hired last year.

 

[mz1995g]

On 10/23/2022 at 6:30 AM, Yeahiwasder4dat said:

Definitely becoming a race to the bottom. Everyone has lowered prices. PSA opened bulk then dropped the price shortly there after. Think they may still be doing the $15 for TCG if that was them I saw the email from. The margins on sales are getting hard to overlook. Hard to justify sending to CGC at the moment for selling. I hate PSA with a passion. Feels like they have a dart board in the grading room as a determining factor based off of some of the returns. At least CGC still whooping them on turnaround time though.

Becoming harder to grade cards at the current prices, a 9 is pretty much break even. People probably aren't subbing that much anymore, coming off the heels of card market going wild and all the company's expanding. I foresee prices going lower still and turn around getting faster. Eventually prices have to go low enough to create volume so they can warrant these expansions and not lay off the people they hired last year.

 

I think thats a fair analysis. I cant see how low their prices can really go though. 10 bucks a card lol? That would be pretty crazy. Then again they did have 7 a card when they first opened so theres that. Turn around times are already pretty fast so not sure what else they can really offer at this point.

We have hit a point to where grading bulk cards has just become a complete waste of time again, which is normal since it used to be that way even with PSA back in the day. Not really worth sending in any cards sub 30-40 dollars for resale most of the time. Some cards have to hit perfect 10 just to be profitable. But thats kind of norm and we just have finally gotten back to the grading norms of 2018-2019.

[RoLaren]

On 10/24/2022 at 12:57 PM, mz1995g said:

Turn around times are already pretty fast so not sure what else they can really offer at this point.

They can offer lower prices. At some point, when they are starved of work, they will have no choice.

[mz1995g]

On 10/25/2022 at 3:56 PM, RoLaren said:

They can offer lower prices. At some point, when they are starved of work, they will have no choice.

Sure but is 15 dollars verses 10-12 really going to change much? Its not really a deal breaker I feel like. They would have to go down to like 7-8 dollars per card before people really consider sending more cards in and not even sure if the market is even really there anymore in general. Like with most modern pokemon cards its just not really worth it to send in like 90 something percent of them since the centering is so bad on most of them. So that just really leaves modern Japanese Pokemon, a handful of vintage and maybe some other random TCGs.

According to GemRate on twitter, CGC grades 24.7k cards per week. They arent really hurting as it is and not sure how much more business they can really get. The market has just changed alot to where nobody really cares about grading like they did during the pandemic. 

Edited October 25, 2022 by mz1995g