Comic Art Live - anyone buying? 3 3

[dirtymartini1]

CAF live makes Coollines pages look like a bargain.

[The Voord]

On 11/13/2022 at 4:06 PM, Michael Browning said:

Last year, I put up some very nice Marvel and DC pages for $100 each and couldn't get anyone to buy (except a guy who wanted to make payments on a $50 page ... at a few dollars a month...).

[malvin]

Ok, finally done looking at the new Sunday listings.  Everyone done and anyone buy anything? I saw a couple that I thought about but trying to be more disciplined so did not buy anything.

I also got 4 purchase requests so I'm happy with that (assuming all the sales go through)

I just noticed that some were Saturday postings re-uploaded at a lower price. I just lowered my prices, I might do that next time! 

Malvin

[Michael Browning]

On 11/13/2022 at 11:51 AM, t3quila said:

Yes, won't someone think of the poor dealers 

I’m not defending them, just stating the truth. Their business model hasn’t changed much over the years and people aren’t selling/trading as much to them nowadays as the auction houses bring in more views and more money.

I’m not sure how they can still compete with Heritage and C-Link and the results those auction houses get. I’m not a dealer, but I know just about all of them and most are just struggling to get good art in. To do that, they are having to pay the higher prices and that makes them have to charge higher prices.

I’m not defending them, but I also won’t get on here and bash them the way so many do.

[Michael Browning]

On 11/13/2022 at 12:49 PM, malvin said:

Ok, finally done looking at the new Sunday listings.  Everyone done and anyone buy anything? I saw a couple that I thought about but trying to be more disciplined so did not buy anything.

I also got 4 purchase requests so I'm happy with that (assuming all the sales go through)

I just noticed that some were Saturday postings re-uploaded at a lower price. I just lowered my prices, I might do that next time! 

Malvin

You are truly one of the good guys in this hobby, Malvin!

[Aahz]

I appreciate the ASM #300 cover's pricing.  I can point to my wife and say, can you believe what comic art is bringing now!!! :-) 

Bough one piece from a book that I had been looking for (for a while now).  Very reasonable.

[artdealer]

On 11/13/2022 at 12:59 PM, Michael Browning said:

I’m not defending them, just stating the truth. Their business model hasn’t changed much over the years and people aren’t selling/trading as much to them nowadays as the auction houses bring in more views and more money.

I’m not sure how they can still compete with Heritage and C-Link and the results those auction houses get. I’m not a dealer, but I know just about all of them and most are just struggling to get good art in. To do that, they are having to pay the higher prices and that makes them have to charge higher prices.

I’m not defending them, but I also won’t get on here and bash them the way so many do.

Michael, you forget that a couple dealers take most of their inventory on consignment, myself included.

I'm betting that if they had to buy their stock, what with most of it not selling, they would be in serious financial trouble.

To speak of only myself, at 66, I’m certainly not paying prices to have to try to resell at a much higher price, cause I’d be taking to my grave.

Sales show that collectors would rather pay the high prices from auctions than dealers who have either had their pieces for years, or super-over aggressively price their art, effectively “phishing” for a price/sale.

[artdealer]

On 11/13/2022 at 1:19 PM, Heidjer Staecker said:

I appreciate the ASM #300 cover's pricing.  I can point to my wife and say, can you believe what comic art is bringing now!!! :-) 

Bough one piece from a book that I had been looking for (for a while now).  Very reasonable.

Heidjer, it’s only “bringing” if it sells. Otherwise, it doesn’t mean anything but a number  

[Michael Browning]

On 11/13/2022 at 1:45 PM, artdealer said:

Heidjer, it’s only “bringing” if it sells. Otherwise, it doesn’t mean anything but a number  

Hypothetical dollars.

[Michael Browning]

On 11/13/2022 at 1:43 PM, artdealer said:

Michael, you forget that a couple dealers take most of their inventory on consignment, myself included.

I'm betting that if they had to buy their stock, what with most of it not selling, they would be in serious financial trouble.

To speak of only myself, at 66, I’m certainly not paying prices to have to try to resell at a much higher price, cause I’d be taking to my grave.

Sales show that collectors would rather pay the high prices from auctions than dealers who have either had their pieces for years, or super-over aggressively price their art, effectively “phishing” for a price/sale.

You are correct, Mitch.

Some dealers are having to pull art from their own collections to refresh their websites.

I do think auctions cause FOMO bidding, whereas dealer website art is thought of as “ah, it will still be there in a month, IF I still want it.”

[artdealer]

On 11/13/2022 at 1:50 PM, Michael Browning said:

Hypothetical dollars.

But 0+0 still equals 0

It’s not like you can use the McFarlane as a comp, if it doesn’t sell 

[artdealer]

On 11/13/2022 at 1:54 PM, Michael Browning said:

You are correct, Mitch.

Some dealers are having to pull art from their own collections to refresh their websites.

I do think auctions cause FOMO bidding, whereas dealer website art is thought of as “ah, it will still be there in a month, IF I still want it.”

The dealers that receive art on consignment from collectors are mostly told by those collectors what to price their art at.

Hence the extreme prices. When consigned art doesn’t sell, you’ll see posts offering the art at a discount. When it doesn’t sell then, it goes to auction.

[The Voord]

On 11/13/2022 at 6:43 PM, artdealer said:

Michael, you forget that a couple dealers take most of their inventory on consignment, myself included.

I'm betting that if they had to buy their stock, what with most of it not selling, they would be in serious financial trouble.

To speak of only myself, at 66, I’m certainly not paying prices to have to try to resell at a much higher price, cause I’d be taking to my grave.

Sales show that collectors would rather pay the high prices from auctions than dealers who have either had their pieces for years, or super-over aggressively price their art, effectively “phishing” for a price/sale.

Agreed.  Nowadays, collectors prefer the buzz of competing for their fixes on auction sites.

[Lago32]

It's the constant "pushing" of prices that irks me. Always been there, always will be I suppose.

Edited November 13, 2022 by Lago32

[Michael Browning]

On 11/13/2022 at 2:31 PM, Lago32 said:

Obviously, anyone can offer OA at whatever price they want and all the power to them if they get it.....and while I hate the constant "pushing" of prices, what really rubs me the wrong way is the hypocrisy....guys publicly shaming/lamenting this exponential growth in OA prices but then in situations like this CAF Live Event, they price their offerings at 2-3x recent comp's or 2-3x what they paid in VERY recent public/known transactions...like pieces that were purchased within the last 2 months from ebay or HA/Clink/etc. but are now being offered at 2-3x that during this event. 

It all stems from everyone in this hobby being afraid of leaving cash on the table.

[Aahz]

On 11/13/2022 at 12:45 PM, artdealer said:

Heidjer, it’s only “bringing” if it sells. Otherwise, it doesn’t mean anything but a number  

True, but considering that I have only parted with a small number of pieces over the years, its more of a fictional understanding with a wink and a nod ... "Oh, it's an investment!  (But I know it's not)".  :-)

[Aahz]

On 11/13/2022 at 1:31 PM, Lago32 said:

It's the constant "pushing" of prices that irks me. Always been there, always will be I suppose.

Way back when I first had the opportunity to buy comics more as a collectible, I came to the understanding that dealers generally mark up 50% from their purchase price in order to make their margins.  Now, when it's a $5 book, it doesn't seem that bad, but it's much more noticeable when the 000's start being added to the pieces.  Realistically, things haven't changed though ... just pieces are more in demand now.  If the price is too high, people won't buy.

[jjonahjameson11]

On 11/13/2022 at 1:54 PM, Michael Browning said:

You are correct, Mitch.

Some dealers are having to pull art from their own collections to refresh their websites.

I do think auctions cause FOMO bidding, whereas dealer website art is thought of as “ah, it will still be there in a month, IF I still want it.”

Perhaps, but if there is art that I want on a dealer website, and the dealer is a D-O-U-C-H-E, then I will let that art sit and rot with the dealer, no matter how much I want the piece.

[skrilla1212]

I took the ASM 300 listing and price to be a bit tongue in cheek. Listed super high, not really trying to sell. But it’s kinda fun to see a $5M item for sale (whether it’s worth $5M or not).

I love to see what type of  pieces people want to offer who aren’t dealers. Yes, 90%+ is same/priced not to sell/not my cup of tea, but I find at least 15-20 pages that I consider fair priced and unique offers.

An X-men 25 page for $10K that would have been more at HA, a Tom Strong 1 page, 2 early Porter JLA pages, an early Bachalo GenX page, are a few example of the types of pages I thought fit that bill.

First year I didn’t buy anything, but that’s just down to my personal budget at the moment.

I commend folks for making things available outside of auctions and consignments. Hope it keeps going.

Edited November 13, 2022 by skrilla1212

[cstojano]

On 11/13/2022 at 11:54 AM, Michael Browning said:

You are correct, Mitch.

Some dealers are having to pull art from their own collections to refresh their websites.

I do think auctions cause FOMO bidding, whereas dealer website art is thought of as “ah, it will still be there in a month, IF I still want it.”

For casuals like me I think there are two camps. The first rushes in and buys with limited knowledge. Dealers and auction love these people. The second tries to not get taken too much. For the latter group you develop a sense of which listings are really over the top. Whether professional dealer or collector/flipper, you mentally make a list of who is simply overpriced. Because I often don't really know a FMV for many of these pieces, I take one insane asking price and apply it across the board. I can think of several collectors on CAF who appear on the flipping thread and from their just assume their prices are too high, whether its 100 or 10,000 dollars. For this reason I buy only at auction or only from artists directly, with the latter you know you are likely paying that premium.

Edited November 13, 2022 by cstojano