PeterPark Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 (edited) Did you know that when ebay assesses a final value charge, they not only include cost of the item plus shipping, but then add the tax that they charge and hold, and then take the final value fee from that inflated total? Not to mention that they add tax to USPS services which are not taxed... For those that do the global shipping program, which I no longer due because they opened my packages, repacked them poorly, and damaged them, I do not know if they include the amount that they charge the buyer (which is a lot of money) in final value fees but if they do, this a large upcharge to buyer and seller. Edited February 3, 2023 by PeterPark Dr. Balls, theCapraAegagrus, RockMyAmadeus and 1 other 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tnexus Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 i just assume my Ebay sale is final value minus 15%. Makes it easier when deciding to sell. rexinnih 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lightning55 Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 Ebay has been charging its final value fee (fvf) on shipping for over a decade. That's because people would sell a $20 item for $1 plus $19 shipping. EBay finally figured out they were only getting the fee based on the $1, which was about 9 cents at the time. While for someone charging $20 for the same item including free shipping, they were collecting $1.80. So they changed their system to collect fees on the total amount paid. The pitiful thing is that it took them 15-20 years to figure out that they were losing income this way. As far as collecting fees on sales tax, they do. But when sales tax became universally collected on marketplace platforms, eBay reduced the fvf to compensate for the sales tax load. They called it a "simplified rate", instead of creating a more complicated formula to arrive at the fvf. I don't think that part is working for them on a marketing level, but the fees paid have not changed due to sales tax. Unless you ship to high sales tax states constantly. But there are also low sales tax states out there, and zero sales tax states. I checked my figures over a 2 month period when they made the change. I paid about the same in fees due to the rate being lower, actually $2 less over a sales period of $20,000. As far as charging fees on the sales tax collected on USPS services, some states require tax collected on shipping, most don't. The reduced fvf due to any sales tax collected supposedly covers that, but it would be hard to check. Not a significant amount in the big picture. RockMyAmadeus, Vixom and Withering Wind 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Balls Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 On 2/3/2023 at 11:05 AM, PeterPark said: Did you know that when ebay assesses a final value charge, they not only include cost of the item plus shipping, but then add the tax that they charge and hold, and then take the final value fee from that inflated total? Not to mention that they add tax to USPS services which are not taxed... For those that do the global shipping program, which I no longer due because they opened my packages, repacked them poorly, and damaged them, I do not know if they include the amount that they charge the buyer (which is a lot of money) in final value fees but if they do, this a large upcharge to buyer and seller. Even cooler, Ebay collects tax on my sales and charges me for it, which I am not legally required to do - because I live in Montana (no sales tax here). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadroch Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 On 2/3/2023 at 12:55 PM, Dr. Balls said: Even cooler, Ebay collects tax on my sales and charges me for it, which I am not legally required to do - because I live in Montana (no sales tax here). It's not where you live, it's where the buyer lives. jimjum12 and ttfitz 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan_W Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 People used to charge 99 cents for an item and them a hundred bucks or whatever for shipping to get around paying Ebay fees. The current system that charges fees on shipping is a direct result of that. PeterPark and Lightning55 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterPark Posted February 3, 2023 Author Share Posted February 3, 2023 (edited) I was not talking about final value fees on shipping. Taxes on shipping is another thing altogether. In terms of the global shipping program though, the buyer pays some high rate for international shipping (maybe $30 and up?) and I was wondering if that amount, charged by and received by ebay, is part of the final value fee calculation, in the same way they include sales tax. Because of the ineptitude of that program, I no longer ship as part of ebay's global shipping program. I guess when you send something to Erlanger, KY, someone opens your package, discards your shipping materials, and puts it in to something different, so they don't have to spend a lot to send it. It gets to where it is going in some kind of shape. One of the things I sent had a tape pull on the front cover and some dirty fingerprints . Thanks for opening the bag and board ebay! They also charge the buyer a lot of money for this. It's not a good look to get a low-quality product and a high price with my reputation on the line. But, if the fees are based on what the buyer pays, does that mean if I was still using it, I would be in for an additional 13.25% of that extra shipping price? Without receiving $0.01 beyond what it cost me to get to Erlanger? Edited February 3, 2023 by PeterPark RockMyAmadeus 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lightning55 Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 (edited) With any international shipment, eBay charges fees based on the domestic shipping amount that you have associated with the item. So if you have shipping set at $8, but it goes to Germany at $50 shipping, eBay will only charge a fee based on the domestic $8. Always been that way. Edited February 3, 2023 by Lightning55 PeterPark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Balls Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 (edited) On 2/3/2023 at 1:05 PM, shadroch said: It's not where you live, it's where the buyer lives. Under the Marketplace Fairness law, retailers need only collect and remit sales tax for states in which they have a "physical presence." and have sales tax Online retailers that do not have a "physical presence" in the state that has sales tax are not required to collect and remit sales tax to that state. Businesses with less than $1 million in total gross remote sales in a calendar year will not fall under the purview of the MFA, and will not be required to comply. Not sure if this is the current law as it stands, but I am not required to collect sales tax when selling anything to anyone. Now Ebay might have to - I don't even care about them collecting sales tax, that's their business - what I find annoying is that they charge me a percentage to do it. Edited February 3, 2023 by Dr. Balls PeterPark, RockMyAmadeus, Larryw7 and 1 other 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lightning55 Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 On 2/3/2023 at 3:09 PM, Stefan_W said: People used to charge 99 cents for an item and them a hundred bucks or whatever for shipping to get around paying Ebay fees. The current system that charges fees on shipping is a direct result of that. Exactly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterPark Posted February 3, 2023 Author Share Posted February 3, 2023 On 2/3/2023 at 3:38 PM, Lightning55 said: Exactly But this was never an issue in this thread. It's not new and I think everyone understands why the change was made (a long time ago). Lightning55 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lightning55 Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 (edited) On 2/3/2023 at 3:36 PM, Dr. Balls said: Under the Marketplace Fairness law, retailers need only collect and remit sales tax for states in which they have a "physical presence." and have sales tax Online retailers that do not have a "physical presence" in the state that has sales tax are not required to collect and remit sales tax to that state. Businesses with less than $1 million in total gross remote sales in a calendar year will not fall under the purview of the MFA, and will not be required to comply. Not sure if this is the current law as it stands, but I am not required to collect sales tax. I don't even care about them collecting sales tax, that's their business - what I find annoying is that they charge me a percentage to do it. The Marketplace is deemed to have a physical presence in ALL states, so sales tax is charged according to where the item is shipped. If you sell direct to the consumer, the nexus laws would apply, or not apply, depending on your presence in a state. As far as paying a fee on sales tax, I mentioned above that they reduced the fees to compensate at the time the law went in. So technically you do not pay a charge on sales tax. Edited February 3, 2023 by Lightning55 Dr. Balls and PeterPark 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the blob Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 On 2/3/2023 at 3:40 PM, Lightning55 said: The Marketplace is deemed to have a physical presence in ALL states, so sales tax is charged according to where the item is shipped. If you sell direct to the consumer, the nexus laws would apply, or not apply, depending on your presence in a state. As far as paying a fee on sales tax, I mentioned above that they reduced the fees to compensate at the time the law went in. So technically you do not pay a charge on sales tax. Yeah, I guess the theory is that ebay is in every state, and while they are not the "seller," they are sufficiently enough involved in the process. Does Amazon do the same? Etsy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Jesse-Lee Posted February 4, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted February 4, 2023 The fees aren't great, but according to eBay, I sold $1,000 worth of stuff in the past 30 days (including what I charge for shipping) - I paid out $155 in shipping labels (which I don't count because I basically break even) and I paid out $157 in eBay fees (between ad fees and final value fees). So I basically made $689 on $845 worth of stuff, which I don't think I could have sold elsewhere based on interested eyes (I've tried selling here and gotten crickets). 82% of a watermelon is better than 100% of a grape - especially since the stuff I sold cost me about $250 or so all-in. Kramerica, PeterPark, faster friends and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NP_Gresham Posted February 5, 2023 Share Posted February 5, 2023 Anything a business requires bookkeeping. The governrment has reporting requirements that can result in large costs. Companies can recover and do recover costs from the consumer. I think that is the whole point of running a business. My own employer a not for-profit. They charge administrative fees for the 401k. They charge fees if I have a payroll deduction for charitable giving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Shepherd Posted February 5, 2023 Share Posted February 5, 2023 Speaking of shipping, I found out when you use UPS or FedEx, eBay will wait to deduct the shipping cost from your debit/credit card or bank account after the item is delivered. That part was confusing because at first glance it appeared that shipping was already deducted in the final payout, but that’s only the case when you select USPS for shipping. Maybe I missed that part in the fine print, I’m still not sure why that is. I had to ship a 17 pound box that would have cost $80 (after eBay discount) to ship with USPS, it was only $20 for UPS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjpb Posted February 6, 2023 Share Posted February 6, 2023 Ebay charging a FVF on sales tax they collect is a bit annoying, as it can mean a 1.3% difference in the amount you receive depending on the sales tax rate or lack of sales tax in the state you are sending to, but all you do is chalk it up to the cost of business, much like the difference in shipping costs depending on how far the package has to go. One thing that is nice if you sometimes sell more expensive books. and have a store, is ebay caps the full value fee as applicable to the first $2500, and only charges the payment processing fee on the balance. I use ebay intl. shipping, but not global shipping, and add a small surcharge (roughly 2% of price) to international shipping to cover the added processing fees and fees on higher shipping costs. PeterPark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjpb Posted February 6, 2023 Share Posted February 6, 2023 On 2/3/2023 at 7:36 PM, Jesse-Lee said: The fees aren't great, but according to eBay, I sold $1,000 worth of stuff in the past 30 days (including what I charge for shipping) - I paid out $155 in shipping labels (which I don't count because I basically break even) and I paid out $157 in eBay fees (between ad fees and final value fees). So I basically made $689 on $845 worth of stuff, which I don't think I could have sold elsewhere based on interested eyes (I've tried selling here and gotten crickets). 82% of a watermelon is better than 100% of a grape - especially since the stuff I sold cost me about $250 or so all-in. Yep, I sell on the boards and IG as well, but ebay still accounts for over half my volume, and is probably the best place to sell obscure esoteric items worth under $100. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyingDonut Posted February 6, 2023 Share Posted February 6, 2023 On 2/3/2023 at 1:05 PM, PeterPark said: Did you know that when ebay assesses a final value charge, they not only include cost of the item plus shipping, but then add the tax that they charge and hold, and then take the final value fee from that inflated total? Not to mention that they add tax to USPS services which are not taxed... For those that do the global shipping program, which I no longer due because they opened my packages, repacked them poorly, and damaged them, I do not know if they include the amount that they charge the buyer (which is a lot of money) in final value fees but if they do, this a large upcharge to buyer and seller. In other news, man walked on the Moon. The things you are complaining about have been eBay policy for at least a decade. Maybe longer. RockMyAmadeus and PeterPark 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyingDonut Posted February 6, 2023 Share Posted February 6, 2023 On 2/3/2023 at 2:55 PM, Dr. Balls said: Even cooler, Ebay collects tax on my sales and charges me for it, which I am not legally required to do - because I live in Montana (no sales tax here). Your statement is incorrect. The sales tax is based on where the buyer is, not where you are. You can thank the good people of South Dakota for this. MAR1979 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
