Name this grading system 3 3

[Heronext]

People seem to like conservative grading.  If it's likely a CGC 6.5, call it a 6.0.  If it's an 8.5, call it 8.0.  One or two grades down. Buyers seem to like this.

But for me, conservative grading breaks down in the highest grades.  I would never assume your conservative 9.6 might be a 9.8.  I want you to tell me it's a likely 9.8.  But, I like that you grade an 8.5 as an 8.0.

In the MCS raw grading system for example, the highest grade is NM.  For anyone who has purchased from them, you know NM could mean 9.4, 9.6 or 9.8.  Not accurate enough.

So, my idea of a grading system (as a seller) is, grade 9.6s and 9.8s accurately, but grade everything else conservatively, one grade lower.  In effect, there is no NM.  That's a 9.2.

Is this a dumb idea.  Do you get my drift.  Could this grading method have a name.  Thanks

[Lightning55]

As a Seller, it doesn't matter if you grade accurately. The Buyer will usually tell you it's overgraded.

And if they just pay you without saying anything, it's definitely undergraded. There's no winning, no ideal system. 

[Buzzetta]

On 9/26/2024 at 1:40 AM, Lightning55 said:

As a Seller, it doesn't matter if you grade accurately. The Buyer will usually tell you it's overgraded.

And if they just pay you without saying anything, it's definitely undergraded. There's no winning, no ideal system. 

On top of that, let's be realistic.  Grading trends have changed over time.  Before CGC, grading would be considered by today's standards to have been a bit looser.   If anything though, when it comes to professional / third party grading, there have been different qualifiers which result in different technical grades depending on the grading company as the grading standards for each company is proprietary.  I have seen this between action figure grading companies, AFA and CAS as well as the various card grading companies.   So Company A may consider an item a 7.0 and Company B might consider the same item an 8.0 as the qualifiers might be weighed differently on their respective scales. 

Point is like you said, buy what you like. There is no ideal system.

[Stefan_W]

When I grade raw books I top out at NM. 

If it is flawless based on my eye it is NM, one small tick or something along those lines is NM-, a couple of small ticks is VF/NM, and a more noticeable color breaks tops out at VF-. No one has ever returned a book to me for being overgraded, which is the entire point.

If someone tries to sell me a raw book as 9.6/9.8 (or over, LOL) I just pass unless it is priced as NM or lower. In my eyes those premiums apply when someone shells out the cash for professional and impartial grading. 

[Robot Man]

A million years ago when I first started collecting, a “mint” book might be an 8.0 by today’s standards. And most of us agreed with it.

Then the Church/Mile High books hit the market and completely changed our out look on “mint”…

[KingOfRulers]

I don't believe in purposely under grading books. I don't believe in "conservative" grading. I think grading should be as accurate as possible. If you think a book is a 9.0, then I think you should advertise it as a 9.0.

I don't like the idea of calling it an 8.0 in an effort to make the customer happy. I don't think the grading system should be purposely skewed for customer satisfaction.

In my opinion, you make the customer happy on the pricing side. If you think a book is a 9.0, you should advertise it as a 9.0. If you want to make the buyer extra happy, don't purposely misrepresent the grade in that effort, but rather sell the 9.0 at whatever the FMV is for an 8.0. That will achieve the same customer satisfaction without diminishing the integrity of the grading system.

[Darwination]

I don't get worked up about any of it.  Anybody that collects comics knows that a raw NM on eBay can mean many different things and none of them likely NM.  Look at the pictures and judge whether the price is fair

The stupid premiums people pay for the one or two tick difference between 9.4 9.6 and 9.8 is on them.  Get it in a box if those numbers and "perfection" mean so much.  Then again, from the grading contests we have here, there's an awful lot of murkiness up in that range, too.

The funny thing is a lot of the sus grading on eBay comes from very established sellers (and us buyers know this). 

[lollyclown]

Well, now spine ticks are allowable on slabbed 9.8's, so who knows how to grade properly anymore. If those are acceptable on 9.8, what's a 9.6 allowed now, an 8, a 7? If 9.8 is allowed a new level of damage, shouldn't that mean all grades now could potentially come up? People will be selling raws and saying they are 9.8 and citing CGC's new stance if that catches on, and it will. Anytime someone can make a few more bucks, they can and will, and people will catch on.

Personally, when I sell books on eBay I never give a numerical value to them (or fine/vf/near mint etc) I use ambiguous terms and stress that they look at the photos. If it's a new book still in bag, I'll state it came right out of the case into a bag and board, never touched a shelf and only minimal time on the counter and list it as brand new, because it is. I leave those in the bag unless someone really wants to see a photo of the back cover.

[Lightning55]

On 9/26/2024 at 1:51 PM, lollyclown said:

Personally, when I sell books on eBay I never give a numerical value to them (or fine/vf/near mint etc) I use ambiguous terms and stress that they look at the photos. 

And those are the sellers I (and many other people) avoid.

Photos are not the same as looking at the item in person, never will be. And likely no returns accepted, after receiving the book and seeing all the problems obscured by blurry Photos or strategic photography. 

Just tell us what you see that is wrong with it and let us judge from there. You know, like being honest.

[lollyclown]

On 9/26/2024 at 1:53 PM, Lightning55 said:

And those are the sellers I (and many other people) avoid.

Photos are not the same as looking at the item in person, never will be. And likely no returns accepted, after receiving the book and seeing all the problems obscured by blurry Photos or strategic photography. 

Just tell us what you see that is wrong with it and let us judge from there. You know, like being honest.

Wait, so you are saying sellers who DON'T apply a grade are ones you avoid? I avoid the ones who do apply a grade because I don't know their experience, if it was a grade told to them by the person they got it from etc.

Who should I be telling? I thought the point of putting a grade was used more by shady people so they DON'T have to answer question. PS, if you buy on eBay the no returns thing is not valid. A seller can put that all over the place and eBay will still allow you to return it.

My way is entirely as honest as it gets for selling online if it's not in a slab with a grade on it. Not that those grades are trustworthy at all anymore. I don't take blurry photos, so why accuse me of being dishonest?

[Darwination]

I'd *much* rather buy a comic in an auction from a picker who gives 10 or 12 good photos and no grade than many of the volume dealers that might call a book VF that's two full grades high and only give me a middling front and if you are lucky back cover image.

Given, there are volume dealers whose grades I trust very much (but who still can miss now and then) like MCS.  Even there, there's tendency to undergrade some types of items, so it's not like it's spot on. I get under-grading to keep returns at a minimum. 

How much agency is a seasoned collector willing to give to a dealer instead of trusting their own eyes? For that matter, how much agency are you willing to give CGC?  The mantra around here seems to be buy the book and not the grade which is sound advice.  Personally, I have to have an established relationship to trust a grade and even then I'm using my better judgement.   There are pulp sellers who I really love that consistently are calling books F and VF that are more like VG.  Don't hate em one bit as long as there are sufficient pictures, I just look at the pictures and bid according to my own take on the item.