Latest Scandal! Comic Book Dealer Disbarred As Lawyer!!!!

[chromium]

 

Who is the master now.

 

SHONUFF!!!!!!

 

 

I think we need a chromium photoshop of Chrisco in the Bruce Leroy outfit

 

Chrisco is holding a bunch of my books hostage, so I have to give him a free ride for a while (yeah it sucks I know....)

[FFB]

You decided to out him. You decided to take him to task. And announce his disbarment on a comic book chat board. And to lecture us about it. And to rip him to shreds. I've never seen a single more cold-blooded act on these boards since I've been here.

 

I'm not going to respond to the rest of this post, but on this point it looks like you forgot who started this thread. Aside from sharing the article (which was given to me by someone else), I showed it to a dealer to confirm it was Doug, a few other board lawyers, to you, and to Harry. If you want to be ashamed, direct it elsewhere. Personally, I don't really care whether you're ashamed of me or not because you're an unbelievable hypocrite.

 

 

Scott, you located the link to the the document on the web and disseminated it lightning fast in pms. If you thought it was important, why didn't you just post it yourself? Since it seems fair to put Doug under the harsh light of examination, lets get all the facts out in this one.

 

Wrong. I got the link from someone else, which I believe I've already said.

 

As for why I didn't post it, I wanted to give the matter some thought about whether or not it was really relevant to Doug's practice as a comic dealer before I posted something that would cause this big of a sheetstorm. I knew you and Harry wouldn't use the information to tear him down. I also knew that the few lawyers I told would exercise discretion because they aren't the people who usually act like children around here.

 

Mr. Woogieman read a reference to it in print. You found the link and started to pass it around. What your purpose was I don't know. Those are the facts.

 

Wrong.

 

At least take responsiblity for your actions. You know as well as anyone that once you start passing material along like that, it's going to end up on the boards. Again, if you thought it was important, you should have showed some cahones and just posted it yourself.

 

First of all, you can't have it both ways. You want to attack me for passing along the information, and then you attack me for not having the "cahones" to post it myself. Pick one and we'll address whichever sin it is you think I've committed.

 

Second, I did take "responsibility" for my actions, which included forwarding information that had been forwarded to me to a few people -- none of whom were the ones who posted it on the board. Unless you or Harry gave the information to Shield, then I had nothing to do with this thread being created -- because I know that the few lawyers I told didn't do it. And speaking of my "actions," all of which I've admitted since minute one, I'm not the least bit ashamed of them.

 

You keep trying to blame all of this on me, but sorry, it's not my fault. Not only was I not responsible for starting the thread, but it's Doug's fault for stealing money from his clients. Anyway, why are you attacking just me? I'm hardly the only person who sent the link to another person, nor have I been the most vehement attacker of Doug.

 

I'm ashamed of the boards in general right now. Your particular two-faced actions and your denial of the facts is what I've come to expect of you. If I'm a hypocrite, say why exactly.

 

Among other things, read your paragraph below. You are describing yourself as much as you're describing me. We can also talk about your Olympic-caliber backflipping on various issues. We can also talk about the fact that if this were about anyone but your friend, you'd be on the other side of the argument.

 

I defended a friend who I felt was being pilloried prematurely, before all the facts are in. As the facts continue to accumulate, people aren't in such a rush right now. They are still welcome to make their own decisions about these issues. If that's being a hypocrite, then I'm proud of it. Better than being Zeus on a chatboard who must be getting paid by the word.

 

Brad

 

Brad, you have completely lost it.

[Red Hook]

By the way....I got the link twice. From you and from October. I'm not a lawyer.

[shadroch]

Brad,

Why didn't you email Doug? Evidently you knew about it before the stuff hit the fan?

[FFB]

By the way....I got the link twice. From you and from October. I'm not a lawyer.

 

OK, so Andy forward the link to you. Who knows, he might even have forwarded it to someone else. Are you going to attack him too now?

 

For what it's worth, I have no problem with Andy forwarding the link to anyone. The disbarment is relevant to Doug's business as a consignor. If he didn't want to deal with negative reactions, he shouldn't have stolen money from his clients to buy his comics. He should have just passed on the books like other people do when presented with something they can't afford.

[Foolkiller]

I think we all need to take a step back for a few minutes and just take a deep breath. This is probably more drama than any of us really need, and what one conversation could help clear up.

 

In emailing with Doug recently, I said everything to Doug that I said on the boards with the same tone, and he understood where I was coming from and did not dodge the issues. It gives me real hope that perhaps giving Doug a second chance publicly will be taken advantage of, that while these charges are serious, I have a better understanding of the timeline, and faith that perhaps Doug has grown and will continue to grow from the situation.

[Ze-man]

Here, here BK

Seeing people I consider peers and friends act this way really bothers me and is painful to watch..

(I know, I know..."so then dont watch it Kenny". I get that much, no need to say it)

 

Also, is your post the "something hopefully more substantive and worthwhile" post you spoke about last night in Steve's Defense of a friend thread?

 

If not I will still keep an eye out. Because I was wondering what it was you had to say.

 

Ze-

[Foolkiller]

Yes. I hope to have a very productive conversation with Doug tomorrow. I have spent the free time I have that I can devote to comics on this issue. I am not involved in the JIM 92 thread -- I really don't know enough about it. I have remained silent on the Heritage thread because Heritage is a whole other story in my book, and I certainly have my own opinions which I don't feel like blasting here until I have some more information.

 

Moreover, I have some thoughts that I want to collect and write down about the hobby in general and trying to put our efforts in a positive light while not compromising our ability to speak out when there is clear wrong doing. For some time now though, I've been trying to listen to the concerns and complaints Steve Borock, dealers, and a lot of the members, past and present from the boards, have expressed about what's going on here.

 

Let me be clear: I have not changed my mind that Doug's disbarrment is serious, a black and white issue, and clearly a question of character. But not every criminal I dealt with deserved to go to prison. There were different remedies for different defendants, and each one had to be treated as an individual. I think that I lost sight of that, in my thought the message ought to be clear. I maintain that the message should still be that this is a serious issue, but I think we have, as is apt to happen, allowed many other issues to creep in with this very basic issue, and I have not tried to contribute to what can be done in a positive fashion on this subject. For that, I am to blame.

[Ze-man]

In my opinion these recent thread(s) have brought about such a slew of semi-related topics that are so intertwined it is hard to seperate them anymore.

 

Talk about church and state...Our little hobby now demands that you examine your stance on a myriad of issues before you can truely feel confident in not only where, but with who you are spending your time and money on

Who was it that said "Ignorance is bliss"?... I never really understood it till just now.

A little over 2 years ago I never knew I was getting ripped off, but I was happy.

Now I am vastly more informed, but not very happy.

 

No turning back now though. Hopefully in a few years to come we will look back and see how alot of this recent turmoil brought about positive changes to our hobby. But we gotta take emotion(not passion) outta the equation to really move foward as a group.

 

Ze-

[Sal]

Who was it that said "Ignorance is bliss"?... I never really understood it till just now. A little over 2 years ago I never knew I was getting rippied off, but I was happy.

Now I am vastly more informed, but not very happy.

 

it's more like taking a Band-Aid off, but slowly, to reveal the injury beneath the surface, so we can apply some sort of cream to it. we've got some of it off, but it's catching us by the short hairs, and the smell underneath is seeping out. it would be nice to just yank the thing off, but there are extenuating circumstances.

 

 

lovely analogy, Sal. really well done there

[shadroch]

Just to clarify a point,I never pm'd that link to anyone. I pm'd several people about the situation but they were already aware of it when they got it.

[Mushroom]

it's more like taking a Band-Aid off, but slowly, to reveal the injury beneath the surface, so we can apply some sort of cream to it. we've got some of it off, but it's catching us by the short hairs, and the smell underneath is seeping out. it would be nice to just yank the thing off, but there are extenuating circumstances.

 

You're the first person Sal that I have heard puts a bandaid on his ....

 

I think you are mixing your metaphors a bit....

[Shield]

it's more like taking a Band-Aid off, but slowly, to reveal the injury beneath the surface, so we can apply some sort of cream to it. we've got some of it off, but it's catching us by the short hairs, and the smell underneath is seeping out. it would be nice to just yank the thing off, but there are extenuating circumstances.

 

Your the first person Sal that I have heard puts a bandaid on his ....

 

I think you are mixing your metaphors a bit....

 

[october]

By the way....I got the link twice. From you and from October. I'm not a lawyer.

 

OK, so Andy forward the link to you. Who knows, he might even have forwarded it to someone else. Are you going to attack him too now?

 

For what it's worth, I have no problem with Andy forwarding the link to anyone. The disbarment is relevant to Doug's business as a consignor. If he didn't want to deal with negative reactions, he shouldn't have stolen money from his clients to buy his comics. He should have just passed on the books like other people do when presented with something they can't afford.

 

I can't believe people are arguing about who PMed the information to who, and who posted the link, and who PMed the guy who posted the link, blah, blah, blah, ad nauseum. WHO CARES? The cat's out of the bag and even if it did matter where the info came from, and it doesn't, it certainly looks like neither Scott nor I had anything to do with it getting posted. What difference would it make anyway?

 

Another thing, can we PLEASE can it with the "you didn't email him to get his side of the story" bulll? THERE IS NO OTHER SIDE OF THE STORY. Get that through your heads. If there was, don't you think it would have been presented at the disbarrment hearing? Or maybe he was just saving all the mitigating circumstances and excuses for when it really mattered...on this comic book chatboard.

[Red Hook]

Brad,

Why didn't you email Doug? Evidently you knew about it before the stuff hit the fan?

 

I did when the stuff hit the fan.

[esquirecomics]

I think too much of this has spiraled out of control and off topic. I am tired of arguing semantics and personal opinions which clearly will not change. It is time to allow the situation to defuse. As far as I am concerned, I've said all I need to say and expressed my opinion on the circumstances. Time to step back and refocus on the important things in this hobby, as well as in our own lives.

 

I look forward to Doug talking whatever appropriate steps may be necessary, to include the passage of time, to allow people to regain the level of trust that so many clearly once had in him. I hope he can put these bad times behind him and continue to contribute to this hobby. I certainly have no problems with crediting him for any successful efforts in doing so, and wish him well.

[blowout]

I think too much of this has spiraled out of control and off topic. I am tired of arguing semantics and personal opinions which clearly will not change. It is time to allow the situation to defuse. As far as I am concerned, I've said all I need to say and expressed my opinion on the circumstances. Time to step back and refocus on the important things in this hobby, as well as in our own lives.

 

I look forward to Doug talking whatever appropriate steps may be necessary, to include the passage of time, to allow people to regain the level of trust that so many clearly once had in him. I hope he can put these bad times behind him and continue to contribute to this hobby. I certainly have no problems with crediting him for any successful efforts in doing so, and wish him well.

 

...and with that, this thread is officially dead.

[Illiterati-migration]

I think too much of this has spiraled out of control and off topic. I am tired of arguing semantics and personal opinions which clearly will not change. It is time to allow the situation to defuse. As far as I am concerned, I've said all I need to say and expressed my opinion on the circumstances. Time to step back and refocus on the important things in this hobby, as well as in our own lives.

 

I look forward to Doug talking whatever appropriate steps may be necessary, to include the passage of time, to allow people to regain the level of trust that so many clearly once had in him. I hope he can put these bad times behind him and continue to contribute to this hobby. I certainly have no problems with crediting him for any successful efforts in doing so, and wish him well.

 

...and with that, this thread is officially dead.

 

Next on the docket:

 

Punisher v. Wolverine. Discuss.

[Red Hook]

I think too much of this has spiraled out of control and off topic. I am tired of arguing semantics and personal opinions which clearly will not change. It is time to allow the situation to defuse. As far as I am concerned, I've said all I need to say and expressed my opinion on the circumstances. Time to step back and refocus on the important things in this hobby, as well as in our own lives.

 

I look forward to Doug talking whatever appropriate steps may be necessary, to include the passage of time, to allow people to regain the level of trust that so many clearly once had in him. I hope he can put these bad times behind him and continue to contribute to this hobby. I certainly have no problems with crediting him for any successful efforts in doing so, and wish him well.

 

My final post. Regarding his comic book business, I have exactly the same level of trust in Doug that I had before, and there's no need for him to do a damn thing to regain my confidence. And as far as regaining yours, I suspect he isn't the least bit concerned with that. I'd just make sure you don't take a single misstep in conducting your own consignment business.

 

And I'm glad that you are now willing to go back and refocus on your personal life, after putting him on trial for a second time and debating his life, his career and his character in the most bloodless manner I've ever observed. Carry on Zaid. See you on FOX.

 

Best, Brad

[Foolkiller]

Brad,

 

This is a pretty venomous post and the only reason for my commentary is that I thought this was a fairly good post from Mark, and yet you've responded with a lot of anger which I don't really understand.

 

But to say that your confidence isn't shaken is fine. There's many people, both on and off these boards, who do not share your opinion. I think it's a bit hyperbolic to say that Doug's "raking over the coals" was any worse than the same rhetoric we all espoused and same character attack we all took part in during Ewert.

 

So, as I said to you on the phone, I appreciate your position, and no one should attack you for your opinion, by that same token, I really feel as that this is a very heavy handed response where I'm not sure it's fair.

 

I think too much of this has spiraled out of control and off topic. I am tired of arguing semantics and personal opinions which clearly will not change. It is time to allow the situation to defuse. As far as I am concerned, I've said all I need to say and expressed my opinion on the circumstances. Time to step back and refocus on the important things in this hobby, as well as in our own lives.

 

I look forward to Doug talking whatever appropriate steps may be necessary, to include the passage of time, to allow people to regain the level of trust that so many clearly once had in him. I hope he can put these bad times behind him and continue to contribute to this hobby. I certainly have no problems with crediting him for any successful efforts in doing so, and wish him well.

 

My final post. Regarding his comic book business, I have exactly the same level of trust in Doug that I had before, and there's no need for him to do a damn thing to regain my confidence. And as far as regaining yours, I suspect he isn't the least bit concerned with that. I'd just make sure you don't take a single misstep in conducting your own consignment business.

 

And I'm glad that you are now willing to go back and refocus on your personal life, after putting him on trial for a second time and debating his life, his career and his character in the most bloodless manner I've ever observed. Carry on Zaid. See you on FOX.

 

Best, Brad