Old Label vs New Label

[Flaming_Telepath]

King of Rulers, sorry buddy but you really are missing the boat. Which is sad because you've got a ton of passion.

 

I recommend you read the scans that Mister-Not-So-Nice posted a few months ago. They were in comic paneled format and were not only hilarious but extrememly educational as to what happened in the past... and what is still happening on a smaller scale.

If I find them I'll post a link.

 

Well, then I'd just venture to say that you missed the boat. Who is right?

 

Yeah, who is right?

 

The one lone voice with four years' collecting experience...

 

Or the ton of guys who have been around for friggin' decades and have seen it all before, have been hip-deep in it in one capacity or another, and happen to agree that it's not quite how four-years-experience guy sees it.

 

And as for your comments about the business being in trouble if this debate is indicative of the state of play....get right off your high horse! Just because somebody took issue with your authorative proclamations, and weren't willing to back down in the face of your genius argument, you think we're all in trouble?

 

Got news for you matey....you simply ain't that important.

[Flaming_Telepath]

An entirely different matter? I'm plugging in a "widgets" argument. If you have a product, any product, and you feed the masses with it because of demand you are doing the same thing that was being done in the 90s with a product. Why does it make a difference whether that product is a collectible or not? Can you explain why in the world of meeting demand that makes any difference? Because it might "hurt" the market?

 

Which leads me to, even if you predicted that the there was an overflood, how would you be able to predict that this would definitively cause some sort of collapse. You are asking the owners to have seen this coming, which is like saying if I knew Enron was going to collapse, I never would have bought their stock and the employees should have known to quit. Well, duh. Don't promote something you know is going to be harmful. Was that really within their ability?

 

And let's say that the owner doesn't make money "now" who's to ensure that they "will" make money later? Why do you think that these comic shops would have survived if "only" they hadn't pandered to those greedy speculators.

 

Basically, I really don't understand your argument. It lacks some basic points of logic, and I think what we need is someone who's actually run a store to come on and explain why this is either correct or flawed, but needs to be done in a much more clear fashion.

 

And can I just add to this excellent argument that dedicated comic shops, in the numbers seen in the late 80s and early 90s, were a relatively new phenomenom. They had not seen 'boom and bust' trends in their business before, had no data available to make their predictions. There was no history to this market sector, a valuable tool that economists use in all of their predictions.

 

With no idea of what might have been around the corner, they had a simple choice....sell as much as possible to the hordes swarming in through the doors....or let the guy up the road sell to them instead.

[KingOfRulers]

 

Yeah, who is right?

 

The one lone voice with four years' collecting experience...

 

Or the ton of guys who have been around for friggin' decades and have seen it all before, have been hip-deep in it in one capacity or another, and happen to agree that it's not quite how four-years-experience guy sees it.

 

Oh, here it goes again. You unreasonable old *spoon* always pull this one out at some point. But you go right on ahead and blindy meet any demand set in front of you. Go ahead.

 

And as for your comments about the business being in trouble if this debate is indicative of the state of play....get right off your high horse! Just because somebody took issue with your authorative proclamations, and weren't willing to back down in the face of your genius argument, you think we're all in trouble?

I think we're in trouble if the industry as a whole embraces views like yours.

 

Got news for you matey....you simply ain't that important.

 

Oooh, aren't you the one in charge?

 

Not only are you an *spoon* who does not understand the most simple of business practices, but your a "flaming *spoon*"....Flame on

[KingOfRulers]

 

An entirely different matter? I'm plugging in a "widgets" argument. If you have a product, any product, and you feed the masses with it because of demand you are doing the same thing that was being done in the 90s with a product. Why does it make a difference whether that product is a collectible or not? Can you explain why in the world of meeting demand that makes any difference? Because it might "hurt" the market?

 

 

It certainly does matter. The collectibles market is not like the food market which is not like the automobile market and so on. They have different ways in which their item is sold. Just to pull a term from BASIC economics, something from the world of comics would be considered a very "elastic" good unlike a car which would be considered more "inelastic". So you cannot simply plug any product and then compare as if they were on even fields, because if the products are too far away in nature then many of the base attributes are different. You could probably compare comics to something like the stamp market, coin market or model train market because they are all very elastic goods. Elasticity in a product influences the demand of a product...I am quite suprised you don't know this.

 

Which leads me to, even if you predicted that the there was an overflood, how would you be able to predict that this would definitively cause some sort of collapse. You are asking the owners to have seen this coming, which is like saying if I knew Enron was going to collapse, I never would have bought their stock and the employees should have known to quit. Well, duh. Don't promote something you know is going to be harmful. Was that really within their ability?

 

That's why I said, "IF". If in some way they predicted it. If you want to compare it to Enron, then there were some people who did in fact get out. Not a lot. I think its around the 150-ish area. To go back to comics, the owners of a store are supposed to do everything in their power to be successful. The includes trying to predict market trends. If they saw it coming then so be it, if they didn't...well that's the alternative. I'm just thinking that some amount of owners would look at who they are selling 25 or 50, or 100 copies of something to and understand WHY they are buying so many copies. Once they understood why they were buying so many copies, then one could take an educated guess that whenever the market at large decides it wants to cash in on all of these books, then we may be in serious trouble.

 

And let's say that the owner doesn't make money "now" who's to ensure that they "will" make money later? Why do you think that these comic shops would have survived if "only" they hadn't pandered to those greedy speculators.

I'm not saying they would have necessarily would have survived. They might have gone out, BUT I'd guess they went out with very little leftover inventory unlike the stores that might have stayed open a little longer.

 

Basically, I really don't understand your argument. It lacks some basic points of logic, and I think what we need is someone who's actually run a store to come on and explain why this is either correct or flawed, but needs to be done in a much more clear fashion.

 

That's okay. I think your point lacks some basic economic points such as predicting market trends and the concept of elasticity But that's okay, you're still a good guy.

[Flaming_Telepath]

 

Yeah, who is right?

 

The one lone voice with four years' collecting experience...

 

Or the ton of guys who have been around for friggin' decades and have seen it all before, have been hip-deep in it in one capacity or another, and happen to agree that it's not quite how four-years-experience guy sees it.

 

Oh, here it goes again. You unreasonable old *spoon* always pull this one out at some point. But you go right on ahead and blindy meet any demand set in front of you. Go ahead.

 

And as for your comments about the business being in trouble if this debate is indicative of the state of play....get right off your high horse! Just because somebody took issue with your authorative proclamations, and weren't willing to back down in the face of your genius argument, you think we're all in trouble?

I think we're in trouble if the industry as a whole embraces views like yours.

 

Got news for you matey....you simply ain't that important.

 

Oooh, aren't you the one in charge?

 

Not only are you an *spoon* who does not understand the most simple of business practices, but your a "flaming *spoon*"....Flame on

 

How many businesses have you run, arse-wipe? I'm on my fourth, and in-between times I have actually written a book, which is now with a publishing house...full MSS, all the works.

 

And this year, my flag-ship business produced its best ever sales figures in June, which we bettered in July, and then bettered again in August. Our net worth is at the moment 45% up on what it was at the end of December 2005.

 

When you've actually done something with your life, have achieved something of note, you can come around and tell us all that we know nothing.

 

Until then, you're simply producing more methane than a whole herd of cattle.

[comicdonna]

Wow! I see, that last night was a busy night. I wonder what today will bring?

[mica]

Well I PM'd Mister_not_so_nice and he remembered the scans.

I couldn't find it last night in this forum but it was in the Copper forum Not sure how relevent it is to this evolving discussion LINK Scroll down to see the scans.

 

The speculator kid's expressions are priceless.

[awe4one]

 

Yeah, who is right?

 

The one lone voice with four years' collecting experience...

 

Or the ton of guys who have been around for friggin' decades and have seen it all before, have been hip-deep in it in one capacity or another, and happen to agree that it's not quite how four-years-experience guy sees it.

 

Oh, here it goes again. You unreasonable old *spoon* always pull this one out at some point. But you go right on ahead and blindy meet any demand set in front of you. Go ahead.

 

Your mentality is exactly the reason this hobby crashed hard in the 90s. You'd do well by listening to those who were actively collecting during that time. Alot of current events seem like deja vu and the market, both back issues and current releases, are due for a significant correction. You will learn...

 

Jim

[KingOfRulers]

 

Yeah, who is right?

 

The one lone voice with four years' collecting experience...

 

Or the ton of guys who have been around for friggin' decades and have seen it all before, have been hip-deep in it in one capacity or another, and happen to agree that it's not quite how four-years-experience guy sees it.

 

Oh, here it goes again. You unreasonable old *spoon* always pull this one out at some point. But you go right on ahead and blindy meet any demand set in front of you. Go ahead.

 

Your mentality is exactly the reason this hobby crashed hard in the 90s. You'd do well by listening to those who were actively collecting during that time. Alot of current events seem like deja vu and the market, both back issues and current releases, are due for a significant correction. You will learn...

 

Jim

 

My mentality of thinking before acting is the reason the hobby crashed hard?

[Flaming_Telepath]

 

Yeah, who is right?

 

The one lone voice with four years' collecting experience...

 

Or the ton of guys who have been around for friggin' decades and have seen it all before, have been hip-deep in it in one capacity or another, and happen to agree that it's not quite how four-years-experience guy sees it.

 

Oh, here it goes again. You unreasonable old *spoon* always pull this one out at some point. But you go right on ahead and blindy meet any demand set in front of you. Go ahead.

 

Your mentality is exactly the reason this hobby crashed hard in the 90s. You'd do well by listening to those who were actively collecting during that time. Alot of current events seem like deja vu and the market, both back issues and current releases, are due for a significant correction. You will learn...

 

Jim

 

My mentality of thinking before acting is the reason the hobby crashed hard?

 

You could try thinking before posting next....

[KingOfRulers]

 

How many businesses have you run, arse-wipe? I'm on my fourth, and in-between times I have actually written a book, which is now with a publishing house...full MSS, all the works.

 

And this year, my flag-ship business produced its best ever sales figures in June, which we bettered in July, and then bettered again in August. Our net worth is at the moment 45% up on what it was at the end of December 2005.

 

When you've actually done something with your life, have achieved something of note, you can come around and tell us all that we know nothing.

 

Until then, you're simply producing more methane than a whole herd of cattle.

 

 

What does any of your life or mine have to do with it? We are talking economic theory--not how many businesses you or I claim to own. What a person_who_is_obnoxiously_self-impressed bag.

[KingOfRulers]

 

Yeah, who is right?

 

The one lone voice with four years' collecting experience...

 

Or the ton of guys who have been around for friggin' decades and have seen it all before, have been hip-deep in it in one capacity or another, and happen to agree that it's not quite how four-years-experience guy sees it.

 

Oh, here it goes again. You unreasonable old *spoon* always pull this one out at some point. But you go right on ahead and blindy meet any demand set in front of you. Go ahead.

 

Your mentality is exactly the reason this hobby crashed hard in the 90s. You'd do well by listening to those who were actively collecting during that time. Alot of current events seem like deja vu and the market, both back issues and current releases, are due for a significant correction. You will learn...

 

Jim

 

My mentality of thinking before acting is the reason the hobby crashed hard?

 

You could try thinking before posting next....

 

I do everytime. I suggest you take your own advice to heart.

 

*See next post

[kc120us]

Well I PM'd Mister_not_so_nice and he remembered the scans.

I couldn't find it last night in this forum but it was in the Copper forum Not sure how relevent it is to this evolving discussion LINK Scroll down to see the scans.

 

The speculator kid's expressions are priceless.

 

Those are some very funny scans. Again, we're back at the same old point. Comics are poor investment vehicles. They are meant to be collected for fun and enjoyment. For appreciation of art and story. For nostalgia. Not to get rich.

[awe4one]

My mentality of thinking before acting is the reason the hobby crashed hard?

 

No...believing the speculator mentality is fine for the market. It wasn't and was proven in the early 90s crash. Those guys were thinking before they bought also...too bad they were blinded by $$$ instead of common sense...

 

Jim

[Flaming_Telepath]

 

How many businesses have you run, arse-wipe? I'm on my fourth, and in-between times I have actually written a book, which is now with a publishing house...full MSS, all the works.

 

And this year, my flag-ship business produced its best ever sales figures in June, which we bettered in July, and then bettered again in August. Our net worth is at the moment 45% up on what it was at the end of December 2005.

 

When you've actually done something with your life, have achieved something of note, you can come around and tell us all that we know nothing.

 

Until then, you're simply producing more methane than a whole herd of cattle.

 

 

What does any of your life or mine have to do with it? We are talking economic theory--not how many businesses you or I claim to own. What a person_who_is_obnoxiously_self-impressed bag.

 

My life experience, and your own lack of, tends to bring knowledge and insight, or lack of.

 

When you have seen it all and done it all...rather than read a bit in a few books....you can tell us all why you know best....and at that point, some of us might even consider taking your seriously.

 

But I doubt it.

[KingOfRulers]

My mentality of thinking before acting is the reason the hobby crashed hard?

 

No...believing the speculator mentality is fine for the market. It wasn't and was proven in the early 90s crash. Those guys were thinking before they bought also...too bad they were blinded by $$$ instead of common sense...

 

Jim

 

But what you're ignoring is that they were not the only entities involved in the process. I do not say they are good or bad for the hobby. I don't know where you have me saying that? But for better or worse they have a right to be here just like everyone else...

[Flaming_Telepath]

 

Yeah, who is right?

 

The one lone voice with four years' collecting experience...

 

Or the ton of guys who have been around for friggin' decades and have seen it all before, have been hip-deep in it in one capacity or another, and happen to agree that it's not quite how four-years-experience guy sees it.

 

Oh, here it goes again. You unreasonable old *spoon* always pull this one out at some point. But you go right on ahead and blindy meet any demand set in front of you. Go ahead.

 

Your mentality is exactly the reason this hobby crashed hard in the 90s. You'd do well by listening to those who were actively collecting during that time. Alot of current events seem like deja vu and the market, both back issues and current releases, are due for a significant correction. You will learn...

 

Jim

 

My mentality of thinking before acting is the reason the hobby crashed hard?

 

You could try thinking before posting next....

 

I do everytime. I suggest you take your own advice to heart.

 

That was your come-back?

 

My god, I simply cannot compete....

[KingOfRulers]

 

How many businesses have you run, arse-wipe? I'm on my fourth, and in-between times I have actually written a book, which is now with a publishing house...full MSS, all the works.

 

And this year, my flag-ship business produced its best ever sales figures in June, which we bettered in July, and then bettered again in August. Our net worth is at the moment 45% up on what it was at the end of December 2005.

 

When you've actually done something with your life, have achieved something of note, you can come around and tell us all that we know nothing.

 

Until then, you're simply producing more methane than a whole herd of cattle.

 

 

What does any of your life or mine have to do with it? We are talking economic theory--not how many businesses you or I claim to own. What a person_who_is_obnoxiously_self-impressed bag.

 

My life experience, and your own lack of, tends to bring knowledge and insight, or lack of.

 

When you have seen it all and done it all...rather than read a bit in a few books....you can tell us all why you know best....and at that point, some of us might even consider taking your seriously.

 

But I doubt it.

 

Whatever you say chief. You've seen it all and done it all---the top dog...the big man on campus...the one who knows all and sees all. So I guess you're going to go stick your head up your a s s for another few years now that you've got all of those feelings out?

[awe4one]

But what you're ignoring is that they were not the only entities involved in the process. I do not say they are good or bad for the hobby. I don't know where you have me saying that? But for better or worse they have a right to be here just like everyone else...

 

Right to be here? Sure. Anybody has a right to do whatever they please. Doesn't mean they are good for a hobby. In limited quantities, the hobby will be fine. In large quantities, they have the potential to damage the hobby as was evidenced in the 90s. I think there are enough speculators around these days to cause worry that another adjustment is on the horizon...

 

Jim

[Flaming_Telepath]

 

How many businesses have you run, arse-wipe? I'm on my fourth, and in-between times I have actually written a book, which is now with a publishing house...full MSS, all the works.

 

And this year, my flag-ship business produced its best ever sales figures in June, which we bettered in July, and then bettered again in August. Our net worth is at the moment 45% up on what it was at the end of December 2005.

 

When you've actually done something with your life, have achieved something of note, you can come around and tell us all that we know nothing.

 

Until then, you're simply producing more methane than a whole herd of cattle.

 

 

What does any of your life or mine have to do with it? We are talking economic theory--not how many businesses you or I claim to own. What a person_who_is_obnoxiously_self-impressed bag.

 

My life experience, and your own lack of, tends to bring knowledge and insight, or lack of.

 

When you have seen it all and done it all...rather than read a bit in a few books....you can tell us all why you know best....and at that point, some of us might even consider taking your seriously.

 

But I doubt it.

 

Whatever you say chief. You've seen it all and done it all---the top dog...the big man on campus...the one who knows all and sees all. So I guess you're going to go stick your head up your a s s for another few years now that you've got all of those feelings out?

 

No....it appears that English is possibly your 4th language, and the comprehension of same is sorely lacking. I said (and you quoted me) that when you had seen it all and done it all, you can tell us what's best. Not that I had.

 

When you're solely resorting to insults...and your posts contain nothing of any substance other than that...it's time to give it up.