ftlepore

Oddly condescending response, but okay.
If CGC stops caring about the market and their effect on it, then people are going to find alternatives. That's pretty simple. Once the company that EVERYONE uses as the market standard stops caring about the market, they're going to lose credibility and that's bad for business.
I guess 2019 alone was a terrible year for this "aging" you mentioned, since that's when multiple of these 70 year old books "aged." I guess I was just coincidentally right on the cusp and 2020 was just The Year of Cream. 🤔

You're welcome to avoid any healthy discussion that you don't enjoy.

I'll go ahead and show what we're talking about here, since the books with their new grades and the labels from their previous grades seem like really strong evidence. These are nine books I sent in to get CPR'd along with their results. At least two of these were previously graded LAST YEAR by CGC. The new current slabs can be seen on the top, while the label they previously had before CPR is on the bottom.
The Avengers #6 kept the same CGC grade of 7.5, but was bumped down to cream pages. This is super weird because, as per the original label, it was just recently graded with OW pages on 8/2019. I have no idea why, barely a year later, the pages are suddenly cream after being encapsulated the entire time. (https://www.cgccomics.com/certlookup/2060457001/)   Avengers #8 was originally a PGX grade of 7.5, OW/W. I sent that one in myself to C**S in 2017 and it came back the same 7.5, OW/W. So, again, it's weird that it now comes back from CGC at 7.0, Cream/OW after being in the same holder for years and after being pressed and cleaned. (https://www.cbcscomics.com/grading-notes/17-028919F-001)   The Fantastic Four #52 was originally graded a 6.5 by CGC and was graded just last year on 4/2019. It has been in the slab the entire time. Now it's a 6.0 after pressing and cleaning. (https://www.cgccomics.com/certlookup/2032473001/)   I definitely understand a single book going down due to a stricter grading or happenstance, but for every single book to come back the same or worse is baffling. Even if these books didn't improve from a pressing and cleaning, they should have at least stayed the same, and I have no idea how the page quality is suddenly worse of several of them.

I actually agree with this. As I said, if the copy of FF #52 in question was graded a 6.5 last year through CGC, then all of a sudden the very next year the same exact book goes down in page and grade quality without being touched, that's going to invalidate A LOT of slabbed book grades. That seems terrible for the market. "Oh, it's a Hulk #181 7.5? Is it an old 7.5 or a new 7.5? Is it really closer to a 6.5? Who knows!" The majority of people buying books aren't professional graders, and the entire point of slabbing books is to have a uniform grade that we can reference and trust. For CGC to change the standard this drastically, it makes thousands, if not millions of grades suspect. If we're still forced to meticulously grade the books within the slab ourselves, it kind of defeats the purpose.

Oddly condescending response, but okay.
If CGC stops caring about the market and their effect on it, then people are going to find alternatives. That's pretty simple. Once the company that EVERYONE uses as the market standard stops caring about the market, they're going to lose credibility and that's bad for business.
I guess 2019 alone was a terrible year for this "aging" you mentioned, since that's when multiple of these 70 year old books "aged." I guess I was just coincidentally right on the cusp and 2020 was just The Year of Cream. 🤔

But they aren't delivering outstanding results. That's the entire point of this thread. They're delivering mixed results depending on grader, year, and environment, apparently. If people have to literally stop submitting books to CGC during certain time periods due to fluctuations in grading, the quality is not consistent. I think most people here on the boards who have been around long enough can grade a book without 2 grade points (grading a 7.0 between a 6.0 and a 8.0, for example), so to imply CGC is doing outstanding work because they also get it within this range, rather than on the dot every time which is their singular job, feels incorrect is not really the standard that myself, or many others I would assume by this thread, are looking for.
 
Not really conflating anything, thanks, but I guess also presuming your post is "informative" is also a really weird thing to do. If you're seriously alleging that "there's also a thing that happens to pages of paper. Most of us call it "aging" and "Pro Tip" weren't meant to be condescending, then I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree. For sure man, books age. Literally no one is disagreeing with you. But you're really oversimplifying for some reason, and not looking at the big picture, where four books that were graded within the last couple years as OW/W came back C/OW. Either all four of these books, in slabs, miraculously aged to cream in one year while being stored in boxes, or it's a grading issue that many others have experienced in this very thread. Not sure why we're leaning toward the first option here.

I think the main point here is that, when the industry is relying on consistency and quality, there should be consist light quality whenever you're grading books. I can't even imagine CGC grading books in multiple different environments with varying light quality. That seems extremely lazy and unprofessional.

I actually agree with this. As I said, if the copy of FF #52 in question was graded a 6.5 last year through CGC, then all of a sudden the very next year the same exact book goes down in page and grade quality without being touched, that's going to invalidate A LOT of slabbed book grades. That seems terrible for the market. "Oh, it's a Hulk #181 7.5? Is it an old 7.5 or a new 7.5? Is it really closer to a 6.5? Who knows!" The majority of people buying books aren't professional graders, and the entire point of slabbing books is to have a uniform grade that we can reference and trust. For CGC to change the standard this drastically, it makes thousands, if not millions of grades suspect. If we're still forced to meticulously grade the books within the slab ourselves, it kind of defeats the purpose.

I actually agree with this. As I said, if the copy of FF #52 in question was graded a 6.5 last year through CGC, then all of a sudden the very next year the same exact book goes down in page and grade quality without being touched, that's going to invalidate A LOT of slabbed book grades. That seems terrible for the market. "Oh, it's a Hulk #181 7.5? Is it an old 7.5 or a new 7.5? Is it really closer to a 6.5? Who knows!" The majority of people buying books aren't professional graders, and the entire point of slabbing books is to have a uniform grade that we can reference and trust. For CGC to change the standard this drastically, it makes thousands, if not millions of grades suspect. If we're still forced to meticulously grade the books within the slab ourselves, it kind of defeats the purpose.

I'll go ahead and show what we're talking about here, since the books with their new grades and the labels from their previous grades seem like really strong evidence. These are nine books I sent in to get CPR'd along with their results. At least two of these were previously graded LAST YEAR by CGC. The new current slabs can be seen on the top, while the label they previously had before CPR is on the bottom.
The Avengers #6 kept the same CGC grade of 7.5, but was bumped down to cream pages. This is super weird because, as per the original label, it was just recently graded with OW pages on 8/2019. I have no idea why, barely a year later, the pages are suddenly cream after being encapsulated the entire time. (https://www.cgccomics.com/certlookup/2060457001/)   Avengers #8 was originally a PGX grade of 7.5, OW/W. I sent that one in myself to C**S in 2017 and it came back the same 7.5, OW/W. So, again, it's weird that it now comes back from CGC at 7.0, Cream/OW after being in the same holder for years and after being pressed and cleaned. (https://www.cbcscomics.com/grading-notes/17-028919F-001)   The Fantastic Four #52 was originally graded a 6.5 by CGC and was graded just last year on 4/2019. It has been in the slab the entire time. Now it's a 6.0 after pressing and cleaning. (https://www.cgccomics.com/certlookup/2032473001/)   I definitely understand a single book going down due to a stricter grading or happenstance, but for every single book to come back the same or worse is baffling. Even if these books didn't improve from a pressing and cleaning, they should have at least stayed the same, and I have no idea how the page quality is suddenly worse of several of them.

I'll go ahead and show what we're talking about here, since the books with their new grades and the labels from their previous grades seem like really strong evidence. These are nine books I sent in to get CPR'd along with their results. At least two of these were previously graded LAST YEAR by CGC. The new current slabs can be seen on the top, while the label they previously had before CPR is on the bottom.
The Avengers #6 kept the same CGC grade of 7.5, but was bumped down to cream pages. This is super weird because, as per the original label, it was just recently graded with OW pages on 8/2019. I have no idea why, barely a year later, the pages are suddenly cream after being encapsulated the entire time. (https://www.cgccomics.com/certlookup/2060457001/)   Avengers #8 was originally a PGX grade of 7.5, OW/W. I sent that one in myself to C**S in 2017 and it came back the same 7.5, OW/W. So, again, it's weird that it now comes back from CGC at 7.0, Cream/OW after being in the same holder for years and after being pressed and cleaned. (https://www.cbcscomics.com/grading-notes/17-028919F-001)   The Fantastic Four #52 was originally graded a 6.5 by CGC and was graded just last year on 4/2019. It has been in the slab the entire time. Now it's a 6.0 after pressing and cleaning. (https://www.cgccomics.com/certlookup/2032473001/)   I definitely understand a single book going down due to a stricter grading or happenstance, but for every single book to come back the same or worse is baffling. Even if these books didn't improve from a pressing and cleaning, they should have at least stayed the same, and I have no idea how the page quality is suddenly worse of several of them.

Just picked up a copy of Venom #3 (3rd Print), and the copy looks great. There are just a few minor issues I'm seeing along with edges and I'm wondering if they would knock the book down from 9.8. I'm not sure if any would qualify as manufacturer defects. The issues on the front could only be seen through my phone when I was zooming in; I attached larger front photos to give an idea of how small they are.
If you guys could let me know what you think, I'd appreciate it!

Unlikely, unfortunately. The book is going for around $60 unslabbed on eBay and it only cost $20, so it was a great price. It was a customer appreciation variant which they sold out of. I've attached the cover for the book, which is a great Kirkham cover.