So frustrated with EBAY dealers

[BassGMan]

Hello (and HELP!), I am brand new to this board and came here out of frustration after being referred here by an online friend. I am going nuts here with some recent Ebay transactions. Yesterday I received THREE pieces of Bad news, two of which involve CGC. First off, the non-CGC problem which is the big one in which I just received my latest response from this guy. In late November I bought from an Ebay dealer an Amazing Spider-Man #1 which he stated was in 7.0 or Better and came with a money back refund if not satisfied. Well, I trusted him (foolishly, but his feedback of 48 did look halfway decent) and bought the book for what I thought was a good deal at $2,325. I thought I would get it CGC graded and sell the 7.0 or so for twice what I paid (in my dreams). Anyway, so I received what looked to me like a 4.5 or a 5.0 and most importantly it was professionally restored on the front and back cover. Almost all the way around the edges along with some tape seals in the middle of the back cover. Anyway, I let the dealer know about it and we have been going back and forth for almost a month with him refusing to refund my purchase with one lame excuse after another. It would take too long here to explain the gory details but believe me, I know what I'm doing and I am right. This dealer is fairly inexperienced, refuses to believe that there is any restoration, does not believe in CGC, and still won't admit to the very obvious restoration that can be seen in my high quality scans. Anyone out there that would like to see them please let me know.

Problem #2. I bought a lot of 300 or so X-Men books on Ebay several months ago for $1,825 with the key book being promised as an unrestored NM Giant Size X-Men #1. Yesterday I received it from CGC as an APP 7.5 with a trimmed bottom edge. Now this Lady Canadian dealer is listed as an "Unregistered User". I e-mailed her anyway to ask for a partial refund. I'm not holding my breath.

Problem #3. I also received my three Hulk #181s yesterday graded as 7.0, 5.0 and 4.5. The dealer I bought them from guaranteed in his ad that if they were sent to CGC and received less than his grade of 8.5, 8.0 and 6.0 then he would refund my $1,100 purchase price AND the cost of CGC grading if I sent them back to him. I just wrote him yesterday asking for that refund or a partial refund of $400 if he would rather I kept the books. Still too soon to see how or if he will respond on that one.

To sum it all up, I am just feeling terrible about all this. All three of these deals represent most of the biggest deals I have done on Ebay so far. These items along with several other lessor priced "Near Mint to Mint" books that I bought (came back as 8.5s) from other dealers have just been turning me sour. Now don't get me wrong, for the most part I have had good experiences and have bought from some outstanding sellers, and as a seller myself I have had excellent luck, but these latest big deals are starting to get me a little depressed about the whole thing. Anyone that has words of wisdom, advice, tips or comments I would surely appreciate it. Thank you------Sid

 

 

[Rickdogg]

This is the main reason I buy only CGC books on ebay. I roll the dice once in a while with dealers who are known to be a little better than others and even then they always seem to come up short. Out of the few times, I've taken a gamble on raw books on ebay, probably only 5% are actually graded correctly if that.

[Aces]

Don't use eBay to buy raw comics worth more than $200 or so.

 

It great for low grade readers like the early marvels I collect, but it's a death trap for high grade and expensive low grade comics.

 

"Look I found an Action 1 in Grandpa's closet! I don't know much about comics but just wire $25,000 cash to my Hong Kong Bank account and it can be yours!"

[Flaming_Telepath]

I'm sorry to hear of your troubles...but unfortunately, they are rather typical of eBay dealings. The over-grading is rife and the 5% success ratio mentioned by Rick is around about my experience, too. I always calculate my bids on raw books based on the assumption that they are half to a full grade out...and on average this usually covers the discrepancies.

 

Regarding the resto issues and refusal to honour guarantees...this is also par for the course. Unless you are dealing with a 'name' who you KNOW takes the goods back for full refunds, you're always playing with fire. If you paid for the goods by Paypal, or direct by CC, the only thing I can suggest is involving your credit card company and call it like it is....fraud.

 

They might take an interest and help you got your hard earned cash back.

[BachelorOfComix]

Well that sucks all around dude. I'm not sure there's much you can do. In the future why not just buy them already slabbed instead of rolling the dice on raw? Since you're gonna send them in for slabbing anyway, why not buy them CGC'd?

[BassGMan]

Hello, you asked why not buy them already CGCed? That is easy to answer. Although I am a collector myself, I try to make some extra money on Ebay by buying unslabbed comics, slabbing them and then reselling them for more. Sometimes it works out, sometimes not. It is amazing, for example how cheap you can buy the McFarlane ASM issues in lots (other than 298-300) sometimes for as little as $1 or $2 each described in Near Mint to Mint. Slab the better ones that look 9.6 or above and then sell them for usually around $40-60 each. One time I even sold a #315 9.8 for $175. So THAT is why I buy many unslabbed books. However, I am starting to learn that this may be a bad idea for the expensive ones. Thanks-----Sid

[Mephisto]

Well that sucks all around dude. I'm not sure there's much you can do. In the future why not just buy them already slabbed instead of rolling the dice on raw? Since you're gonna send them in for slabbing anyway, why not buy them CGC'd?

 

Because he wanted to try and flip the books ASM 1 in particular for a nice profit by buying them raw and then sedning them in so if they came back the grade they were supposed to be it would bring closer to book value when actioned off again.

[BachelorOfComix]

Hello, you asked why not buy them already CGCed? That is easy to answer. Although I am a collector myself, I try to make some extra money on Ebay by buying unslabbed comics, slabbing them and then reselling them for more. Sometimes it works out, sometimes not. It is amazing, for example how cheap you can buy the McFarlane ASM issues in lots (other than 298-300) sometimes for as little as $1 or $2 each described in Near Mint to Mint. Slab the better ones that look 9.6 or above and then sell them for usually around $40-60 each. One time I even sold a #315 9.8 for $175. So THAT is why I buy many unslabbed books. However, I am starting to learn that this may be a bad idea for the expensive ones. Thanks-----Sid

Flipping is a a tough way to make money. It takes a knowledge & patience. You're right, you're better off flipping moderns than the older stuff or start taking lessons from gman.

[BachelorOfComix]

Because he wanted to try and flip the books ASM 1 in particular for a nice profit by buying them raw and then sedning them in so if they came back the grade they were supposed to be it would bring closer to book value when actioned off again.

Well it didn't work out & greed got the best of him I guess. Oh well, I have less sympathy knowing he's a flipper.

[BassGMan]

This is a new word that I am learning "flipper". I just thought it was a smart dolphin. What is wrong with being a flipper? Isn't this providing a useful service? Hopefully making myself a few extra bucks and offering slabbed comics to those that want them. Aren't car dealerships "flippers", Wal-Mart? Anyone or any business buying wholesale and selling retail? No matter what the reason somebody buys a comic or any product, why does it matter what he intends to do with it? I'm not doing anything unethical or misleading by "flipping". Just making a few extra bucks and offering some slabbed books for sale. -----Sid

[rob_react]

This is a new word that I am learning "flipper". I just thought it was a smart dolphin. What is wrong with being a flipper? Isn't this providing a useful service? Hopefully making myself a few extra bucks and offering slabbed comics to those that want them. Aren't car dealerships "flippers", Wal-Mart? Anyone or any business buying wholesale and selling retail? No matter what the reason somebody buys a comic or any product, why does it matter what he intends to do with it? I'm not doing anything unethical or misleading by "flipping". Just making a few extra bucks and offering some slabbed books for sale. -----Sid

 

I don't think he's saying anything negative about flipping in general (at least I hope he isn't.) It's just that coming on here and complaining because you got burned when trying to flip books isn't a very sympathetic angle to take. The idea being if you're going into this transaction looking to make a profit off of it, YOU'RE responsible for due diligence since, in a sense, you're trying to take advantage of the seller. If you get burnt, you've got no one else to blame but yourself. That's the way I see it at least and I flip books all the time, so I'm speaking from experience.

[BassGMan]

[

I don't think he's saying anything negative about flipping in general (at least I hope he isn't.) It's just that coming on here and complaining because you got burned when trying to flip books isn't a very sympathetic angle to take. The idea being if you're going into this transaction looking to make a profit off of it, YOU'RE responsible for due diligence since, in a sense, you're trying to take advantage of the seller. If you get burnt, you've got no one else to blame but yourself. That's the way I see it at least and I flip books all the time, so I'm speaking from experience.

 

Rob, your name is familiar, either you bought something from me recently on Ebay or I bought something from you. Anyway, I understand what you are saying but disagree with it in parts. I completely disagree that I am taking advantage of a seller. Any seller that places an item on Ebay and has his minimum bid met is HARDLY being taken advantage of. If you are assuming that I am buying an item that I know is undervalued, I still do not see that as taking advantage of a seller. Look at 25 cent pots and pans and clothes at garage sales, or great deals anywhere else. Is buying a cheap or undervalued item at the asking price taking advantage of the seller? I don't think so. Telling an old lady that her Action #1 is worth $5 bucks. Now THAT is taking advantage of a seller. As far as getting burned, all that I am asking for is an honest (or at least close) representation of the item from the seller. Again, why would it matter if I want to keep the book or take my chances and go through the expense of CGC grading to resell. Sure, if a guy says it is a NM and I get an 8.5, OK, I can live with that and I expect sellers to overgrade a bit, but a gross exaggeration is another story. And why am I to blame myself for it either way, other than to risk putting my trust in an Ebay dealer? I appreciate your comments but just had to challenge some of them. Thanks-----Sid

[rob_react]

I don't think he's saying anything negative about flipping in general (at least I hope he isn't.) It's just that coming on here and complaining because you got burned when trying to flip books isn't a very sympathetic angle to take. The idea being if you're going into this transaction looking to make a profit off of it, YOU'RE responsible for due diligence since, in a sense, you're trying to take advantage of the seller. If you get burnt, you've got no one else to blame but yourself. That's the way I see it at least and I flip books all the time, so I'm speaking from experience.

 

Rob, your name is familiar, either you bought something from me recently on Ebay or I bought something from you. Anyway, I understand what you are saying but disagree with it in parts. I completely disagree that I am taking advantage of a seller. Any seller that places an item on Ebay and has his minimum bid met is HARDLY being taken advantage of. If you are assuming that I am buying an item that I know is undervalued, I still do not see that as taking advantage of a seller. Look at 25 cent pots and pans and clothes at garage sales, or great deals anywhere else. Is buying a cheap or undervalued item at the asking price taking advantage of the seller? I don't think so. Telling an old lady that her Action #1 is worth $5 bucks. Now THAT is taking advantage of a seller. As far as getting burned, all that I am asking for is an honest (or at least close) representation of the item from the seller. Again, why would it matter if I want to keep the book or take my chances and go through the expense of CGC grading to resell. Sure, if a guy says it is a NM and I get an 8.5, OK, I can live with that and I expect sellers to overgrade a bit, but a gross exaggeration is another story. And why am I to blame myself for it either way, other than to risk putting my trust in an Ebay dealer? I appreciate your comments but just had to challenge some of them. Thanks-----Sid

 

As I said, I flip all the time, so my saying that a flipper is in a way taking advantage of a seller shouldn't be taken as a negative. If the seller is happy with the transaction, then there's nothing more they need to know about the deal. The fact remains that in order to buy from a seller cheaply enough that you can turn around and immediately make a profit off of that purchase you HAVE to be taking advantage of something in the transaction. In your case it's the fact that the books aren't CGC'd. I'm not saying this advantage is something evil. That would be ridiculous since I flip books ALL THE TIME.

 

So I stick by what I said, if you're trying to flip people and you get burnt, that sucks, but it's nowhere near the same thing in terms of sympathy as a regular old collector getting burnt on a book that he wants just to keep. To me, if you're trying to make money it behooves you to be more careful about your purchases.

 

As for having dealt with me recently, what's your ebay ID?

 

[Timely]

His new ebay ID is "BurntBoy".

 

Timely

[supapimp]

This is a new word that I am learning "flipper". I just thought it was a smart dolphin. What is wrong with being a flipper? Isn't this providing a useful service? Hopefully making myself a few extra bucks and offering slabbed comics to those that want them. Aren't car dealerships "flippers", Wal-Mart? Anyone or any business buying wholesale and selling retail? No matter what the reason somebody buys a comic or any product, why does it matter what he intends to do with it? I'm not doing anything unethical or misleading by "flipping". Just making a few extra bucks and offering some slabbed books for sale. -----Sid

 

i denounce the term "flipping/flipper", i'd much rather prefer the term "slinging". BTW, welcome to the boards.

[Filter81]

Bass, I have two quick questions for you.

 

Do you mind sharing the names of some of the sellers you bought those books from? I ask because I was taken advantage of by a lady in Canada a few months back and I'm wondering if its the same person. If it is, I may have some tips on how to get at least a partial refund from her.

 

My other question is, did you buy those 3 hulk 181s from ebay user Boxerbrew?

 

 

[BassGMan]

Hello Rob-React, my Ebay user id is: sansc57803. I have many adult oriented comics ending today and then I will take a few weeks off from selling on Ebay. You bought an Uncanny X-Men #124 NM- from me a little while back and left me positive feedback that said "excellent, thanks". Maybe you flipped that. you bought if for only 9.99 which I would say is undervalued. don't worry, you met my minimum bid and I was happy. Although I feel a little "taken advantage of" . I agree with you about the "sympathy" thing. However business is business and I believe no matter what intentions you have with your purchase, you deserve the same respect from the seller. Absolutely, I agree that as a "flipper" I do need to be more careful than I have been. Thanks ----Sid (or BassGMan or "Burntboy")

[BassGMan]

Bass, I have two quick questions for you.

 

Do you mind sharing the names of some of the sellers you bought those books from? I ask because I was taken advantage of by a lady in Canada a few months back and I'm wondering if its the same person. If it is, I may have some tips on how to get at least a partial refund from her.

 

My other question is, did you buy those 3 hulk 181s from ebay user Boxerbrew?

 

 

Hello, no the 3 Hulks were from a different seller however I am willing to bet we are talking the same female Canadian. Right now she is listed on Ebay as an Unregistered user but her name was Mary Macri and ebay user ID was Comix32. Any info would be helpful. I still have hopes for the Hulk guy to fulfill his promise. I haven't heard from him yet but it was just yesterday that I e-mailed him after receiving the CGCed books. Thanks-----Sid

[joe_collector]

So THAT is why I buy many unslabbed books. However, I am starting to learn that this may be a bad idea for the expensive ones. Thanks-----Sid

 

That's exactly it. You can have good luck with the "tweener" books that aren't high-dollar slabbed, but can bring a nice profit if you get lucky.

 

Buying expensive raw books (at least on EBay) is turning into a fool's game, with only scammers and over-graders offering "high grade gems" raw.

[rob_react]

Hello Rob-React, my Ebay user id is: sansc57803. I have many adult oriented comics ending today and then I will take a few weeks off from selling on Ebay. You bought an Uncanny X-Men #124 NM- from me a little while back and left me positive feedback that said "excellent, thanks". Maybe you flipped that. you bought if for only 9.99 which I would say is undervalued. don't worry, you met my minimum bid and I was happy. Although I feel a little "taken advantage of" . I agree with you about the "sympathy" thing. However business is business and I believe no matter what intentions you have with your purchase, you deserve the same respect from the seller. Absolutely, I agree that as a "flipper" I do need to be more careful than I have been. Thanks ----Sid (or BassGMan or "Burntboy")

 

No, no flipping there, it actually went right into my collection.

 

I'm not saying what sellers have done to you is right, by the way, I'm just offering you some insight on why people might think differently about your situation based on your intentions going in.