Which is the first comic where we see a superhero killing the villain?

[joe_collector]

So when's the first post-code killing of a villain by a hero? Didn't Batman kill people on-frame in the Dark Knight series?

 

There were tons before that, and early-70's characters who killed reams of villains on-panel include Manhunter, Spectre, Conan, Deathlok, Killraven et al.

 

The code started in 1954, and there has to be some villain-killing taking place before 1970.

[joe_collector]

Where are you going with this? I thought we were looking for obvious examples.....

 

Yeah, this is getting creepy.

 

The whole point of ASM 122 was to show Spidey eager for vengeance, yet stopping himself before he crosses that line.

[comicwiz]

Yea, almost exactly like in the film

 

Remeber, in the film, Mary Jane doesn't die, and a sky-trolly full of innocent people -- their lives all spared. In the comic, Spider-Man SNAPS; and emotionally charged Spider-Man that we barely recognized. The Spidey we all knew and loved would carefully use his agility, and wit; often beating down his opponents, where the emotional tear-down tactics would precede the physical one. The loss of Gwen hit an emotional chord with Spider-Man, and the one thing the story does well is play on peoples empathy and emotions. As in many films (the one that quickly comes to mind is Seven), the villain is smeared in a way that evokes revenge and cheering in its audience -- compassion which is irrevocably lost -- to the point that if Brad Pitt turned away without blowing Spaceys brains away, we would never forgive Pitt.

[comicwiz]

The whole point of ASM 122 was to show Spidey eager for vengeance, yet stopping himself before he crosses that line.

 

And yet Marvel STILL gave the readers what they wanted. Had Spidey walked away from his promise of killing Goblin, he'd be considered a wimp.

[comicwiz]

Where are you going with this? I thought we were looking for obvious examples.....

 

Superheroes had been historically casted as the last bastion of justice. Preservation of life, and not the pursuit of death. The Death of Goblin chapter is a major departure from this convention, and one that has all the earmarks of a groundbreaking event in comics.

[joe_collector]

And yet Marvel STILL gave the readers what they wanted. Had Spidey walked away from his promise of killing Goblin, he'd be considered a wimp.

 

He did walk away, and was disgusted with himself for even contemplating murder.

 

Instead, Marvel gave us a karma-based ending instead, with the Goblin sealing his fate by rewarding compassion with deception. Satisfying, while still maintaining the old "Spidey would never kill, no matter what" mantra.

[fantastic_four]

Remeber, in the film, Mary Jane doesn't die, and a sky-trolly full of innocent people -- their lives all spared. In the comic, Spider-Man SNAPS; and emotionally charged Spider-Man that we barely recognized.

 

It happened in a different yet extremely similar way in the film. Spidey saves MJ; Goblin grabs Spidey and throws him into an abandoned building; Goblin beats Spidey senseless; just when it looks like Spidey's done for, Goblin boasts about how since Spidey's ticked him off, he's gonna finish MJ off "nice...and slow"; Spidey snaps, beats Goblin senseless; Goblin impales himself with glider. MJ didn't die, but she would have if Spidey hadn't stopped the Goblin.

[THE_BEYONDER]

In 1976, Cap and Spidey killed a Demon from the "Dark Dimension". It all happened in MTU 52.

 

Cap- "We have to destroy that monster before the alien radiation leaking from its body pollutes the city's atmosphere--making New York unfit for human existence."

 

Spidey- "Gotcha Cap"

 

Spidey(internal dialogue)- " I only hope we're doing the right thing! For all we know, this demon-thing is lost--bewildered--like a frightened child! And instead of trying to help him--we're going to attack!

Of course he probably wouldn't listen to reason anyway-- but I still feel rotten that we're not going to try! Ah well, so much for my crystal-clear conscience! "

[fantastic_four]

Anybody got a link to a web copy of the full Comics Code Authority text? I'm wondering whether there's anything in there about heroes killing villains, or murder in general.

[comicwiz]

Hey James

 

That's an interesting point. I quickly ran a search and found this page which appears to include the original comic code authorities standards. I couldn't find anything which specifically outlines that a hero should not kill a villain. There are however several standards which mention how crime should be punished, and misdeeds dealt with in an appropriate manner. It also mentions the following under one of the subsections:

 

General Standards Part B:

 

1) No comic magazine shall use the word "horror" or "terror" in its title.

2) All scenes of horror, excessive bloodshed, gory or gruesome crimes, depravity, lust, sadism, masochism shall not be permitted.

3) All lurid, unsavory, gruesome illustrations shall be eliminated.

4) Inclusion of stories dealing with evil shall be used or or shall be published only where the intent is to illustrate a moral issue and in no case shall evil be presented alluringly nor so as to injure the sensibilities of the reader.

5) Scenes dealing with, or instruments associated with walking dead, torture vampires and vampirism, ghouls, cannibalism, and werewolfism are prohibited.

 

Looks like the CC had a bone to pick with EC with this particular subsection, doesn't it?