Maker's Mark...

[PovertyRow]

...so to speak. When a watchmaker works on a watch they will usually put a small mark indicating themselves and maybe even a date. It is a desireable thing as it helps track the watch's history.

 

So, what if restorers could put a small invisible mark somewhere (say inside back cover bottom) that could only be seen by, for example, UV light and that was archival and invisible when viewed in white light. The mark could be something as simple as JJS, JJM or JJP for John Jones Slight, Moderate or Professional.

 

Now it would take a collective effort to do this but I think the idea has merit. Thoughts?

[fantastic_four]

I'm surprised some don't already do it; sounds good to me.

 

Am I overreacting, or are the slight restorers of FN to VF books who don't disclose their work killing the chances that there will be any more professional restorers after the current crop?

[supapimp]

and i thought you were talking about whiskey!?!

[PovertyRow]

and i thought you were talking about whiskey!?!

 

I figured someone would think that!

[supapimp]

you should've known!

[PovertyRow]

Am I overreacting, or are the slight restorers of FN to VF books who don't disclose their work killing the chances that there will be any more professional restorers after the current crop?

 

It certainly isn't helping things. But I think a lot of the comic restorers are still getting good business from the movie poster crowd. For some reason restoration is just plain accepted there. And should restoration come back in favor in the comics world which I think, at some point, it really HAS to, as the years go by and the GA books especially get older and older and in more need of at least structural stability. Which leads me to another topic I shall post momentarily.

[PovertyRow]

Oh - another thought - in addition to the JJS, JJM and JJP - an invoice number where one could call or email the restorer and ask them about #2174. Just like calling CGC for grader's notes. And they could then pull the invoice number and tell you exactly what was done.

 

Now at first glance this seems like a lot for the restorer to go through but I think the added business gleaned from such a system would more than compensate for the extra work in revealing the restoration.

[Lantern]

I do think that the idea of a restorers mark has merit. Especially if it was detectable under an easily accessible medium like UV lights. I also like the idea of a tracking, reference, or invoice ID number. Those types of marks would ensure the resto was always traceable.

 

The only problem I see with the idea is that reputable restorers already provide "work sheets" with their end product. The people that pay to have the quality restoration done to books are usually the ones that willingly provide the "work sheets" with the book when it is sold. In fact, with some of the big name restoration experts it is a selling point to have the resto done by them.

 

While it is a great idea, I can think of a few practicing restorers that would not play by the same rules, and those are the ones that need to be tracked, monitored, and policed.

 

By the way Pov, I love these resto topics.

[PovertyRow]

I do think that the idea of a restorers mark has merit. Especially if it was detectable under an easily accessible medium like UV lights. I also like the idea of a tracking, reference, or invoice ID number. Those types of marks would ensure the resto was always traceable.

 

The only problem I see with the idea is that reputable restorers already provide "work sheets" with their end product. The people that pay to have the quality restoration done to books are usually the ones that willingly provide the "work sheets" with the book when it is sold. In fact, with some of the big name restoration experts it is a selling point to have the resto done by them.

 

While it is a great idea, I can think of a few practicing restorers that would not play by the same rules, and those are the ones that need to be tracked, monitored, and policed.

 

By the way Pov, I love these resto topics.

 

I do agree that that rep restorers provide sheets. The only problem is that some day, books will probably change ahnds and THAT is when the horridness will manifest, because the dealers will also be expected to retain and transfer those sheets to the next buyer. And that seems doubtful for some dealers, neh?

 

The restorers that don't play by the new rules - well it is possible that over time they will be revealed. One can only hope. But as things stand now, I think it would be better than the status quo.

 

Man it is a tricky thing!

[PovertyRow]

You know what? In these strange times....a seems in order.

 

Dagnabbit!

[esquirecomics]

This is worth pursuing further. Of course the mark would have to be on the front or back cover given the CGC slab would nullify its value if it were on the inside. And it will not, of course, affect pressing being done by non-professionals or shady sellers.

 

But, at the very least, it is something that should be asked of all the professional restorers and it is a step forward.

[PovertyRow]

A good observation!. The mark should be on the front or back cover (outside) so it can be verified through the slab. I confess to not being much of a slab buyer. I have maybe 8 or so slabbed books I got for a few bucks each at a flea market. The only slabbed books I actually opurchased for my pre-code collection I removed from the slabs. So I tended to think in terms of the non-slab collector. But yes, I vote for the outside of the back cover.

[FFB]

A good observation!. The mark should be on the front or back cover (outside) so it can be verified through the slab. I confess to not being much of a slab buyer. I have maybe 8 or so slabbed books I got for a few bucks each at a flea market. The only slabbed books I actually opurchased for my pre-code collection I removed from the slabs. So I tended to think in terms of the non-slab collector. But yes, I vote for the outside of the back cover.

 

The slab and inner well have UV inhibitors. You couldn't verify it through the slab even if you put the invisible ink on the outside cover.

[Red Hook]

It would take me about 37 seconds to counterfeit a makers mark. How would you prevent that from happening?

[Sal]

why would it need to be visible through a slab? unless you're suggesting a maker's mark as something desirable, which i can't really get my head around.

 

if you're going to do something like this, why not go chemical?

 

a chemical signature would be infinitely better. impossible to forge, as each book would have it's own specific sig. a chemical signature inserted into the book by CGC - or a subcontractor - tied back to a database and detectable by CGC. that way, when the book goes out PLOD, gets deslabbed, sold and resubmitted, it would be merely be rescanned the book through their 'sniffer' and detect whether the book had been there before.

 

of course, this would raise the price of grading an astronomical degree, but wouldn't it be worth it?

 

oh and red, i can counterfeit that mark in thirty seconds, so nanny nanny boo boo

[Red Hook]

Why not a nice certificate with a scan, and a notarized signature....on big ticket books. Don't maim the book further with a mark.

 

Actually, I think I could fake a mark in about 27.5 seconds.

[sfilosa]

Let's say three of the top restorers decided to do this (i.e. put an invisible mark on the book so that someone with a UV Light could see it).

 

Explain to me how this helps them or a potential buyer.

 

1) Not all books would have this, so is it really assuarance that if you don't see the mark, the book is unrestored?

 

2) Doesn't CGC already note on the label the extent of restoration and type? Yet, everyone complains that the PLOD with even the smallest restoration, just kills a book value?

 

3) Lastly, the restorers who did put this mark on the book, would PROBABLY LOSE BUSINESS. Why, because those people who want work done on their book and for whatever reason don't feel the need to disclose it (i.e. either because they feel pressing isn't restoration or they are just want to defraud the buyer), will go to a restorer who doesn't put this mark on the book.

 

It's so funny, but everyone expects the RESTORE to take the HIGH ROAD. The real HIGH ROAD, is CGC, an independent third party, who actually MAKES MONEY giving their opinion on if a book is restored or not.

[PovertyRow]

Why not a nice certificate with a scan, and a notarized signature....on big ticket books. Don't maim the book further with a mark.

 

Actually, I think I could fake a mark in about 27.5 seconds.

 

You can fake you're arse in 10 seconds. Must be why you have so much cheek!

[Red Hook]

I think I got it down to 23 seconds now!

[PovertyRow]

I think I got it down to 23 seconds now!

 

23 seconds? The mark or your arse?