Leaf Casted Brittle Pages

[Ze-man]

. I never saw the entire book though and can only imagine how bad the outer wraps were, if any were even left.

 

 

Why didn't the owner send in the whole book? It seems odd to me you would only recieve the parts that needed work. Wouldn't it have been wise to have you do the disassemble and assemble?

 

I doubt they ever had it, or that it was even whole in recent decades. They probably located these two center donor wraps for their book that was missing them, and these were unfortunately as good as they could find.

 

Lets just say it is a scarce book, and even marrying 2 brittle wraps was better then an incomplete book.

 

But enough of that.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[thirdgreenham]

I knew that guy.

[FFB]

Well in looking at the pictures, i have no doubt they chipped when handled but I'm talking really bad browning which, from the pics show actually look OK. OK as in brittle but able to be handled.

 

I don't have an example on hand but I've had in the past much worse looking pages. Just curious as to how bad it can be where this is still useful and/or where is there diminishing returns.

 

This might make the difference for someone buying a harshly brittle and brown page Adventure 40 or some other key.

 

Ed

 

As I understand it, the level of brownness does not equate to the level of brittleness. Brownness is a function of the presence of chromophores, which make the paper turn brown. Brittleness is caused by a shortening of the cellulose chains that give the paper strength. They usually occur together, but not always and not necessarily at the same rate.

[thirdgreenham]

I've got to say, this is an informative thread. Thanks very much to Ze-Man for sharing his experience with us. (thumbs u

 

Andy

[Green]

I understand the goal of this is to preserve, but if the book were graded by CGC would it be noted as trimmed?

[PreHero]

Interesting process. I assume any book that had this work done would be considered restored. But, for pages that are brittle and flaky, I would think it'd be worthwhile just to save the paper.

 

I know nothing about leaf casting or restoration, so questions might be out in left field. How well does the leaf casted pulp adhere to the original paper - any concern that the casting will separate? Is there any adhesive used during casting?

 

Thanks for sharing.

[FFB]

I understand the goal of this is to preserve, but if the book were graded by CGC would it be noted as trimmed?

 

I think the answer is no, as long as the original material isn't trimmed away during the process. Trimming the added paper so it is flush with the original does not result in a trimmed notation.

[rockman2008]

As I understand it, the level of brownness does not equate to the level of brittleness. Brownness is a function of the presence of chromophores, which make the paper turn brown.

This can be technical but I'll try to be brief. The chromophores aren't directly responsible for brittleness in paper but they are tightly linked to lignin. They act more like "sign posts" for the presence of aged lignin. New chromophores are formed by lignin when it oxidizes.

 

Lignin is the organic polymer (like a "plastic cement") that makes trees rigid and paper stiff. When lignin interacts with light, temperature, and air, it slowly crystallizes over time...which is not a problem when you have high-grade paper, free from lignin. Unfortunately cheap newsprint or pulp paper is made up of almost a third in lignin. It's mainly lignin's fault that your comic book pages are turning brittle from a chemical composition perspective.

 

Brittleness is caused by a shortening of the cellulose chains that give the paper strength.

This is true. If I understand correctly "shortening of the cellulose" is the product of re-pulping newsprint paper for use many times. This occurs in countries of lower economic means, like behind the former Iron Curtain. But I never really thought of it as a prevalent practice in the U.S., except maybe for a short period in the 1940's due to wartime paper shortage...?

 

When paper conservators tackle brittleness issues in paper, obviously they can't do anything with short paper fibers; that's just the inherent physical fault in the paper. What they are able to treat is its chemical composition, for the presence of lignin and acids, and limiting their effects. But enough of that. This will be my last say in this thread.

[FFB]

But enough of that. This will be my last say in this thread.

 

Why? That was a great post.

[FFB]

Brittleness is caused by a shortening of the cellulose chains that give the paper strength.

This is true. If I understand correctly "shortening of the cellulose" is the product of re-pulping newsprint paper for use many times. This occurs in countries of lower economic means, like behind the former Iron Curtain. But I never really thought of it as a prevalent practice in the U.S., except maybe for a short period in the 1940's due to wartime paper shortage...?

 

I was referring to shortening/fracturing of the cellulose chains caused by acid hydrolysis and oxidation after the paper is made. This is what causes a loss in paper strength subsequent to manufacture. Acid hydrolysis results from alum rosin size used on the newsprint, which turns into sulphuric acid, and also from atmospheric pollutants such as nitrogen dioxide and sulphur dioxide, which turn into nitric acid and sulphuric acid. These attack the cellulose polymers and weaken the paper.

[divad]

Really - good stuff. (thumbs u

[divad]

I understand the goal of this is to preserve, but if the book were graded by CGC would it be noted as trimmed?

 

I think it would be a crime to slab books like this, that have been brought "back to life" for the purpose of preservation and enjoyment.

[Green]

I understand the goal of this is to preserve, but if the book were graded by CGC would it be noted as trimmed?

 

I think it would be a crime to slab books like this, that have been brought "back to life" for the purpose of preservation and enjoyment.

I agree, but if it was a book like action 1 i would think it would be ideal to be slabbed at the time of sale for the sellr and the buyer

[divad]

I understand the goal of this is to preserve, but if the book were graded by CGC would it be noted as trimmed?

 

I think it would be a crime to slab books like this, that have been brought "back to life" for the purpose of preservation and enjoyment.

I agree, but if it was a book like action 1 i would think it would be ideal to be slabbed at the time of sale for the sellr and the buyer

(thumbs u

[Hero Restoration]

I just want to say I can't get Kenny's work out of my mind, and I bet it's only a matter of time before he matches the color and make it look like it was never missing pieces.

 

I only wish he didn't have me on ignore.

[arexcrooke]

I understand the goal of this is to preserve, but if the book were graded by CGC would it be noted as trimmed?

 

I think it would be a crime to slab books like this, that have been brought "back to life" for the purpose of preservation and enjoyment.

I agree, but if it was a book like action 1 i would think it would be ideal to be slabbed at the time of sale for the sellr and the buyer

Kenny and I were talking about how this would be handled by CGC. I imagine that it would have to be an Extensive label irregardless of the amount of leaf casting that it would have.

 

The key point that I think this makes is that this technique is so cutting edge that we dont know how to classify it yet because it is so new.

[Green]

I understand the goal of this is to preserve, but if the book were graded by CGC would it be noted as trimmed?

 

I think it would be a crime to slab books like this, that have been brought "back to life" for the purpose of preservation and enjoyment.

I agree, but if it was a book like action 1 i would think it would be ideal to be slabbed at the time of sale for the sellr and the buyer

Kenny and I were talking about how this would be handled by CGC. I imagine that it would have to be an Extensive label irregardless of the amount of leaf casting that it would have.

 

The key point that I think this makes is that this technique is so cutting edge that we dont know how to classify it yet because it is so new.

Hell yea arex its exciting even for me and im not involved nor do i collect/have any books that could benefit from it!

[FFB]

I understand the goal of this is to preserve, but if the book were graded by CGC would it be noted as trimmed?

 

I think it would be a crime to slab books like this, that have been brought "back to life" for the purpose of preservation and enjoyment.

I agree, but if it was a book like action 1 i would think it would be ideal to be slabbed at the time of sale for the sellr and the buyer

Kenny and I were talking about how this would be handled by CGC. I imagine that it would have to be an Extensive label irregardless of the amount of leaf casting that it would have.

 

The key point that I think this makes is that this technique is so cutting edge that we dont know how to classify it yet because it is so new.

 

I don't think leaf casting would automatically get Extensive. It depends on how much loss is filled. It'll be judged the same way as manually-applied Japan paper.

[Ze-man]

I understand the goal of this is to preserve, but if the book were graded by CGC would it be noted as trimmed?

 

I think it would be a crime to slab books like this, that have been brought "back to life" for the purpose of preservation and enjoyment.

I agree, but if it was a book like action 1 i would think it would be ideal to be slabbed at the time of sale for the sellr and the buyer

Kenny and I were talking about how this would be handled by CGC. I imagine that it would have to be an Extensive label irregardless of the amount of leaf casting that it would have.

 

The key point that I think this makes is that this technique is so cutting edge that we dont know how to classify it yet because it is so new.

 

I don't think leaf casting would automatically get Extensive. It depends on how much loss is filled. It'll be judged the same way as manually-applied Japan paper.

 

Exactly, does not matter if the item is leafcasted or piece filled by hand, the same amout of area is being filled. How or if it will be graded differently I do not know.

 

Time will tell if leaf casting proves superior to typical hand piece filling because in most cases less paper will be added due to how leaf casting can fill only the areas that are missing as opposed to overlaying japan paper and gluing it on top of the page.

[Ze-man]

I just want to say I can't get Kenny's work out of my mind, and I bet it's only a matter of time before he matches the color and make it look like it was never missing pieces.

 

I only wish he didn't have me on ignore.

 

I forgot to take you off ignore from months ago, sorry.

 

And regarding color matching?..well it is quite involved actually.

 

On these tanned brittle pages I could have possibly made a better color match but would have sacrificed tensile strength, and bonding qualities because tanned vintage donor paper is too broken down to use. And using color matching archival paper would not be a good texture match to old interior newsprint. Plus factor in these pages were washed(and lightened in the process) but I had to decide what would be the best color match beforehand due to not wanting to wash, dry, and wet again for casting.

 

Ultimately, the tanned edge remained tan, but if you notice, the color match is quite close to the inner portions of the pages.

 

Only way to make a perfect match now would be CT, which is typical of any added in fill.

 

 

See , simple right?