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Mylar -VS- Inner Well, A simple SCS Experiment.. results inside

Started by Ze-man,

162 posts in this topic

Memphiskidd

Memphiskidd

Posted
Posted

I have been spreading these around.

 

I posted this in another thread....but WTF!

 

Just thought I would share. hi.gif

 

The 2 X-men #150 were received directly from

CGC in my last batch of 10 books submitted.

 

I picked only the most glaringly obvious examples.

 

X-men #150 9.4:

 

3b2a0f4c.jpg597a0533.jpg

 

X-men #150 9.6:

 

d1b2c86c.jpg650d5860.jpg

 

X-men #145 9.4:

 

X-men145front.jpgX-men145back.jpg

 

X-men #176 9.8:

 

cf10393e.jpgcd8116c0.jpg

 

X-men #146 9.6

 

X-men1469.jpg6593fd69.jpg

 

X-men #100 9.6

 

X-men1009.jpgX-menback.jpg

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FFB

FFB

Posted
Posted

I can't see this minor change making much difference, if any at all, in the incidence of slab damage. It might minimize it a tad, but as long as there is a hard edge to come into contact with, it's going to blunt the edges of the comic.

 

Oh yea...I didn't realize the well is two pieces of plastic, one with the well and the other being a flat piece of plastic.

 

Given that this is how the CGC inner well is constructed, something occurred to me that may not require a drastic change to its design. The main reason many of us are thinking that a Mylar is better than the CGC inner well is because the tapered edges gives the comic something more graduated to bump into than the 90-degree wall that the CGC inner well provides. Could changing the walls of the bottom piece of plastic to slant at around a 20- or 30-degree angle significantly reduce the amount of overflash which gets crunched?

 

In other words, if the edges of the inner well looks like this today (this is intended to be a view of what the inner well looks like from the bottom):

 

________________________________________________________________________________

|______________________________________________________________________________|

 

 

Wouldn't overflash get damaged less if the bottom piece of plastic had walls like this?

 

________________________________________________________________________________

\______________________________________________________________________________/

 

 

My crude use of a backslash and foreslash to depict the way the walls of the well should be is more severe than I envision because they slant at around a 45-degree angle, but I believe the angles should be less severe at around 20 or 30 degrees. That would create an area the comic could gradually slide into. So right now, when a comic hits the wall, the overflash turns 90 degrees since that's the angle the wall is, but if the wall was at a much, much lower angle of 20-30 degrees, then the overflash should only bend for that 20 to 30 degrees, which is much less severe than 90 and should significantly decrease the chance of paper fiber damage and ink color break.

 

A further advantage of this design is that today, BOTH sides of the overflash--overflash on both the front and back covers--end up hitting the wall. Using the graduated edge design, the front cover should fail to hit the edge in all but the most extreme shakes (like the one Ze-Man did with his slabbed test book) because the back cover overflash is the one that bends up into the tapered edge. If the angle is low enough, the thickness of the inner pages should eventually prevent further penetration into the tapered edge before top-cover overflash even comes in contact with the wall.

 

Thoughts? 893scratchchin-thumb.gif I still like mister_comics' support insert idea, though...it should be able to protect the right edge better than ANY other solution I've EVER seen used on a comic book. That can definitely be used along with a tapered edge design.

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FFB

FFB

Posted
Posted
These are my books. What can I say? I am proud of them.

 

Thanks for contributing something to the board. grin.gif

Still no reason to spam the boards.

 

Is that the only reason you crawled over here from the CPG forums, to troll and spam? 893blahblah.gif

 

What exactly are you contributing here? At least his posts are ON TOPIC. Don't you have to go back to the monastery?

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fantastic_four

fantastic_four

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Posted
I can't see this minor change making much difference, if any at all, in the incidence of slab damage. It might minimize it a tad, but as long as there is a hard edge to come into contact with, it's going to blunt the edges of the comic.

 

How is it inferior to a Mylar's tapered edges?

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FFB

FFB

Posted
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I can't see this minor change making much difference, if any at all, in the incidence of slab damage. It might minimize it a tad, but as long as there is a hard edge to come into contact with, it's going to blunt the edges of the comic.

 

How is it inferior to a Mylar's tapered edges?

 

Because with tapered edges there is nothing for the edges to run into. With your slight, 20 degree shift in the angle of the well wall, there is still a hard surface to run into. The slight shift in the angle of the wall doesn't solve the problem of having the hard surface to run into. The tapered edge of the mylar does.

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FFB

FFB

Posted
Posted
Which monastary is that? The one in North Dakota, Slovinia, or the imaginary one in Australia? screwy.gif

The one in your moms bedroom. yay.gif

 

One day, Arch will ban you for being nothing but a useless troll, and on that day, there will be much rejoicing. Well, if anyone notices, I mean. sleeping.gif

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liam_hails-migration

liam_hails-migration

Posted
Posted
One day, Arch will ban you for being nothing but a useless troll, and on that day, there will be much rejoicing. Well, if anyone notices, I mean. sleeping.gif

He asked me a question and I answered.

 

I think you better look again and see who is trolling who here. And don't worry, I'll say another prayer for your confusion. angel.gif

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THE_BEYONDER

THE_BEYONDER

Posted
Posted
One day, Arch will ban you for being nothing but a useless troll, and on that day, there will be much rejoicing. Well, if anyone notices, I mean. sleeping.gif

He asked me a question and I answered.

 

I think you better look again and see who is trolling who here. And don't worry, I'll say another prayer for your confusion. angel.gif

 

I'm feeling kinda left out. Can you troll me for a bit? 893crossfingers-thumb.gif

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Ze-man

Ze-man

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Did we ever decide., . rule out.. or explore what , and how a slight pressing.. or pressure when encapsulating the comic to keep it from slipping around inside the well.

 

No matter if it is a blunt edged inner well.. [-----]

or a tapered Mylar type.. <----->

or a combination of both [<--->]

 

 

So if a special Mylar snug was developed with a tapered edge effect, and then that was heat sealed inside an "inner well" of some kind...with a small amount of downward pressure used when sealing the "Mylar Snug"

 

Would this help alieviate some of the slippage..or "staple pull" problems?

 

 

 

Anyhow..just trying to keep the cart moving foward, and upright in this thread.

 

Ze-

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Mister_Comics

Mister_Comics

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Why does the wedge (>) shape necessarily lead to cover separation? I thought cover separation was caused by the container applying pressure to the cover, but not enough to keep the interior in place, causing the interior to rip away from the cover.

 

The cover seperations that I have seen have always been from up and down movement. You could actually see the inner pages protruding out from the cover either at the top or bottom. Staples shown some sign of being pulled. This is how seperation happens. When sudden force like a drop is applied to a slab. The cover is held stationary and the inner pages move freely. (anyone else want to explain G force, I don't) There are several things going on that hold the cover. Static is one. Pressure is another, or lack of pressure depending. The more times the slab is shocked by force, the more the inner pages become loose. If to little pressure, then the comic slids around more freely and from rubbing the mylar static will grab hold of the cover. To much pressure and the pressure force holds the cover. Not the inner pages.

 

Simple experiment if you dare want to try it.

 

Take one of your slabs. One that your sure the comic does not move.

Take the slab and bounce it on its bottom just a few times lightly enough to move the comic inside..

Do you see the inner pages protruding out from the cover. Thats the start of cover seperation. Take the slab now and bounce it on its top edge until the comic inside moves toward the top. Seperation is now getting worse. The more you bounce the slab that more of a seperation you will get. You may have to try several time this simple test. But the final result will be the same. Cover seperation.

 

Ohh! And dinged corners.

 

This is what sending these slabs all around the world is doing to these slabbed books. The holders are great as is, but they were never ment to be bounced around over and over. They are fine if your just going to keep them stationary in one place.

 

I can't imagine that it wouldn't cause at the very least 1/8" overflash splits, and at the worst in the case of a severe jolt, 1/2" to 1" spine splits.

 

Actually I agree with you on this. I'm not sure how those two spine corners would hold up. I do know that if the amount of border around the comic was kept to a minimum, splitting would be kept to a minimum. I don't believe that using the support idea of mine would cause such a big split of 1/2" to 1". The comic would not have that kind of movement area (field of movement).

 

I love the idea of your insert!

 

Appreaciate that! Just trying to contribute any help I can to help out my fellow comic collector buddies.

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