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Should the PLOD become a BLUE label?

Started by VintageComics,

Should the PLOD become a blue label?  

366 members have voted

  1. 1. Should the PLOD become a blue label?

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    • 5509

92 posts in this topic

joe_collector

joe_collector

Posted
Posted
I say yes, as long as it is not a blue "Universal" label and as long as it has a big old "RESTORED" and prominent restoration score separate from the grade on the label.

 

Just bringing back this old chestnut from FFB, and noting that CGC has deleted the "big old "RESTORED"" he noted as a requirement to support this format, and replaced it with an ambiguous "Apparent".

 

How do you feel about that FFB?

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lou_fine

lou_fine

Posted
Posted
tth2;

 

Like FFB here, I also don't know exactly who you are talking about here.

 

The only person I could think of is Jon Berk since he was the one who originally called for the one-colour label system in association with a 10-point restoration rating system, way back in a column he had written for CBM quite a few years ago. Although Jon is a true leader and carries a lot of real power and influence in the actual marketplace, I don't think he would qualify in this case since he only roams around the GA board. In addition, he tries to avoid controversial topics and has not really brought up this particular issue except for one time when he had posted his CBM article right here on the boards.

 

For the life of me, I just can't figure out who you are talking about. confused.gif

 

Can't you just give us a little hint?

Lou, I'll assume you're not just playing coy here. My statement was "There are other fine members of these boards who've been pushing for the restored blue label the whole time I've been here." (emphasis added).

 

I was talking about you! 27_laughing.gif

 

P.S.--I noticed you still haven't answered the question I posed to you in another of these blue label PLOD threads.

 

tth2;

 

How in the world are you guys able to spend so much time on these boards while you are at work? I am able to come on only when I get back home and then only if I can sneak some time away from the family.

 

Anyways, I must have missed your question or either mistakenly assumed that it was just a comment. Apologize for this and just ask me the question again and I will be sure to answer you.

 

As for your comment with respect to me leading the charge for the removal of the PLOD label, I think you give me far too much credit. As a small time collector, I have absolutely ZERO input or influence to change anything at all with respect to the direction of this hobby. It's people like Jon Berk who used to be a past president of the AACBC (or something like that) who has the real power and influence based upon both their long tenure in this hobby along with their deep deep connections to the old boys network.

 

I am not saying that Jon had any impact on this particular change here, but it is rather co-incidental that this proposed change by CGC is really nothing more than a loose adaptation of Jon's original proposal from quite a few years ago. The old boys are always the ones who lead and decide on all the changes while the nobodies like me who just rants on a chatboard are caught in the butt end of all the changes. 27_laughing.gif

 

BTW: Ask me your question again and I will answer it.

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tth2

tth2

Posted
Posted

Lou, I didn't say you were necessarily the reason for getting the change, although I think you have more pull in the hobby than you give yourself credit for. I was just referring to the fact that you've been one of the more vocal proponents of the blue restored label on these boards, at least that's my impression.

 

Regarding the unanswered question, it was from a thread in the SA forum, so I've reproduced the full conversation here:

 

Lou, your characterization of the previous debate is disingenuous to say the least. The controversy came about because your proposal tied two things together: 10 point resto rating system AND getting rid of the purple label. I don't think anyone was criticizing a 10-point restoration rating system per se. The criticisms related to your proposal to change the purple label to blue.

 

So let me ask you this, to sort out which is truly the most important part of your proposal. If only one of the following options was available to you, which one would you go with:

 

1. Blue label with current 3-level resto rating system; or

 

2. Purple label with your proposed 10-point resto rating system?

 

893scratchchin-thumb.gif

 

Tim;

 

Thanks for your response.

 

I have always felt that the current system is really the worst of both worlds since it:

 

1) Served only to stigmitize restored books instead of letting the marketplace determine their own value in a level playing field.

 

2) Limited restoration rating to only three general ambiguous levels instead of a more definitive 10-point numerical rating system.

 

 

My suggestion was to implement an enhancement of the current system to address both of these problems. As a result, the idea for a 10-point restoration rating system AND an one colour label was to address both of these concerns at the same time. I don't understand the rationale for improving something and going only halfway when you have the opportunity to fix both problems at the same time.

 

To answer your question, let me phrase my answer to you in the form of a question back to you. If only one of the following options was available to you, which one would you go with:

 

1) Blue label with new 3-level (Low, Mid, High Grade) condition grading system; or

 

2) Purple label for all books grading lower than 9.4 with current 10-point condition grading system.

 

 

Would the current condition grading system not be better than either one of these options? Or should we settle on the worst of both worlds, analagous to the current restoration rating system by implementing a 3-level generic condition grading system with a purple label for anything lower than High Grade. Why in the world would you want to settle for any of these options instead of getting the best of both worlds. The same should apply when it comes to restoration rating.

 

893scratchchin-thumb.gif

 

I then responded with:

 

Lou, you continue to dance around my question. I fully understand you want both and why you would want both. But sometimes in life progress comes in increments, rather than all in one fell swoop. So just for argument's sake, if CGC wanted to try out an interim solution before going all the way, and could only do one, but not both, which would you choose: (i) purple label with 10 point rating or (ii) blue label with current 3-level rating?

 

By the way, the question you posed to me may have been intended to present me with a tough choice, but I think anyone who's familiar with my collecting habits would know that it would actually be a very simple choice. 27_laughing.gif

 

So, what's the answer?

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lou_fine

lou_fine

Posted
Posted
Lou, you continue to dance around my question. I fully understand you want both and why you would want both. But sometimes in life progress comes in increments, rather than all in one fell swoop. So just for argument's sake, if CGC wanted to try out an interim solution before going all the way, and could only do one, but not both, which would you choose: (i) purple label with 10 point rating or (ii) blue label with current 3-level rating?

 

By the way, the question you posed to me may have been intended to present me with a tough choice, but I think anyone who's familiar with my collecting habits would know that it would actually be a very simple choice. 27_laughing.gif

 

So, what's the answer?

 

Tim;

 

Now I remember your question. I've been meaning to get back to it, but it's been such a long while since I've had the time to hit the SA forum. Way too many forums on this board here.

 

To answer your question here: Yes, based upon your collecting habits, I clearly know what your answer to my hypotheical question would be. Likewise, you should also be able to figure out my answer to your question without too much problems.

 

I am clearly for a system that would impart the most information and allow the potential buyer to make as informed a purchasing decision as possible. With your two options, I would most definitely choose the purple label with the 10-point restoration. This would clearly provide more information to the buyer as opposed to a more generic three-level rating system. In addition, it would also make the need for a dual colour label system redundant and unnecessary.

 

With the 10-point restoration rating system, a rational buyer should have enough information to be able to make a informed purchasing decision. The need for an additional stigmitizing mark in the form of a purple label would be nothing more than overkill and seen by the general marketplace to be CGC's statement that this particular book is not up to CGC's acceptable level of standard. This was never the original intent for the use of the purple label, and has now resulted in CGC's decision to remove the use of the PLOD.

 

Bottom-line: As I have already stated in another thread.......CGC's only purpose should be to determine condition grade, detect and note or rate restoration for a book...........it should not be involved or partake in any activity that would intentionally or unintentionally promote or stigmitize a particular type of book.

 

I hope that answers your question. thumbsup2.gif

 

Lou

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action1kid

action1kid

Posted
Posted

joe collector.

That discloser thing is going to be tough! The guys who have restored books really really want that blue label on there restored books.With that kind of conflict of interest i dont think your going to get to many guys telling you the truth to make a judgement.Im certainly not saying Every guy will tell a fib.But you certainly are going to get guys who have restored tell you they dont have any to conceil there conflict of interest. You have to consider this possibility.

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FFB

FFB

Posted
Posted
joe collector.

That discloser thing is going to be tough! The guys who have restored books really really want that blue label on there restored books.With that kind of conflict of interest i dont think your going to get to many guys telling you the truth to make a judgement.Im certainly not saying Every guy will tell a fib.But you certainly are going to get guys who have restored tell you they dont have any to conceil there conflict of interest. You have to consider this possibility.

 

Those of you who own only unrestored slabs and who rail against the end of the PLOD have just as much BIAS (it's not a "conflict of interest," dope makepoint.gif) as someone who owns restored books and wants to get rid of the PLOD.

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joe_collector

joe_collector

Posted
Posted
Those of you who own only unrestored slabs and who rail against the end of the PLOD have just as much BIAS (it's not a "conflict of interest," dope makepoint.gif) as someone who owns restored books and wants to get rid of the PLOD.

 

So you're really saying that if you found out that the guy spearheading this change has a warehouse full of Restored books, that he would have the SAME level of BIAS as a Joch Koch-like opponent, with a warehouse of unread stock?

 

Give me a 893censored-thumb.gif break.

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FFB

FFB

Posted
Posted
Of course that is true ,on both ends.I admit it.The problem is you wont[restored guys.As for the other comment you made,if you look at all my posts, i will not exchange insults.Ive read many of your posts and have respect for your opinions.

 

How have I insulted you? confused-smiley-013.gif I was just making a point. That's what the little hammer emoticon means. I don't mind that you disagree with me. That's what makes the debate fun.

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