Ironmandrd

Real

Who knows what he's really thinking (and his demeanor sucks) but I think it's just as likely that he didn't want to bother with scanning 27 pages. LAZY. But OP has moved on so it's all moot anyway.

FWIW, if the price was agreeable and I liked what I saw in the 8 pages I would have taken the risk --after getting an email from the seller that the other pages were of similar quality (ie, no half finished pages etc.) and that if there are material condition issues to any of the pages that I could return them all (and I likely also would have asked for scans of any other splashes and the endpage).

I would say that most of Trimpe run on Hulk makes him a B-/B artist on that run and in a few other issues he did during those prime years. But after that I view him as a C artist with some D artist mini-runs (remember when he tried to ape Liefeld?).

If that were the case why would they both drop out? They would talk and one would stay to try to win it and the other would cancel his bids and stay out of it. I guess if they were being sneaky, they still would agree to have only one of them, both cancel their bids and the one still going for it would be sniping at the end.

I wonder how much nostalgia and art appreciation is being passed down to the next generation--how many children of OA collectors in their 40s, 50s and 60s etc. are themselves interested in comics and/or the art. I'm reminded of recently seeing my friend's 13 daughter wearing an AC/DC tee-shirt and I asked it was that just fashion or something else--and he said she listens to their music and is a fan. It's clear that at least a part of her affinity for AC/DC is because her father listened to that music.

He usually has different "hidden stashes" for different buyers/types of buyers. I would see his hidden stash of Iron Man/Avengers/Buscema etc but he's not going to show me Ditko Spidey or twice-up Kirby unless I asked. That also means that if you are a BSD for say TOS and TTA but not Ditko/Romita Spidey but you were starting to branch out, you might not see a page like this either unless you specifically asked.

Plus we’ve all seen results go both ways—high end piece is offered, even “shopped around,” for $X and at auction sometimes (usually?) it sells for less than $X but sometimes it sells for more than $X. And not every BSD or buyer at that level is equally plugged in to every high end piece and when it is offered.

A contributing factor I'm sure is that it is cover sized, not the usual small sized corner box art.

You didn't mention to them that it was listed on their site for less? I once had a similar issue come up for a low 5 figure 60s page (with a different dealer) and so I went on the website and "bought" the page for the smaller amount and then paid cash at the show. When I gave the dealer the money after telling him I bought it through the site, he looked perplexed because the money was clearly several thousand short of the price sticker. I told him that was the price on the site and to his credit he didn't gripe and gave me the page.

On the one hand it's conceptually a great page between the 2/3 splash and the great dialogue and meaningful content. But darn that Spidey figure looks wonky in so many ways. For that range of asking price, I cannot see how one wouldn't a better splash or for much less money, an action page.

Some random thoughts: I agree with Gene's and Dan's cogent view's above, including the idea that B pieces are often mis-priced----intentionally or indifferently (and less frequently mistakenly) by dealers and mistakenly or from a wilfull blindness or wishful thinking perspective by collectors. Dealers see that a better (B+/A?) page sells for say $10k and suddenly their B- and B pages in that book or in that run or by that artist are all repriced at $10k (or more). So dealers asking A level prices for B level pieces. That lack of differentiation sometimes is done by collectors as well, especially when selling. They convince themselves that their B piece should command A level prices. A few times over the last 6 years a John Buscema 70s Avengers page sold for a new all time high on HA. Each time seeing that public price, dealers increased their pricing on similar but not has nice JB Avengers pages (ie, B level pieces) to at or above the public auction price for the B+/A level pieces --and some collectors privately offered B level pages for the A level auction prices. Back to the overall discussion and thinking first about what is A level material to then see what B level is (and I think it's overall more interesting (and may be easier) to discuss what constitutes A level vs what constitutes B level) ---I think a tricky part comes in with how we define the "class" in "best in class" including how big or small that group is. Is it a particular artist on a book or run? Artist overall across books (besides A level X-Men pages, can John Byrne have A level FF pieces, A level Champion pieces, A level Cap pieces, A level MTU pieces, etc.). What about Kirby? Can his mid/late 70s stint at Marvel have A level pieces vs his 60s/early 70s Marvel? Is best in class judged by looking at a particular character run or storyline? What about middle of the road artists--Can they have A level work that is not historic/first appearance? Al Milgrom jumps to mind--let's take him as an artist as the "class." I presume Al Milgrom is on no ones artist A list, but can he have a A level piece? To me, yes. His singular work on the cover to Iron Man 96 where he was clearly aping/channeling Kirby (and reflecting a darn cool story--IM vs Ultimo with IM getting beaten up but not giving up) is a A level piece to me. And other than maybe Firestorm 1 where he was aping/channeling John Buscema and which is Firestorm's first appearance, I cannot think of another cover of his that I would view as A level (I am probably forgetting some--note, Hulk 271 is not Rocket Raccoon's first appearance). So besides that small handful, that basically puts the rest of Al Milgrom covers as B or below. Fair? Unfair?

In all seriousness, to me this almost has to be two bidders who believed this was full sized. No other explanation fully makes sense (the only other one would be that the bidder(s) had the pages before and after and they were trying to complete a multi-page sequence—but that’s not possible as different people own the pages before and after this page). And while the description is technically accurate, it doesn’t use the phrase “half-page” or something similar. So it’s not impossible that a bidder read too quickly and those it was a splashy full page.. I know people who own pages from this issue (myself included) and surrounding issues and I cannot see them paying full boat as if this were an “A” level full page. For example, there’s no Arkon tax as he doesn’t appear on the page. And the Arkon story tax usually involves Arkon and the Scarlet Witch, which this also doesn’t have. So I cannot see how a half page (no matter how dynamic/cool), even with a bump for the Arkon story (and being all action), could be $10k+. Alternatively, what’s the case that this is worth almost $11k?

I agree--great action on that page. Just surprised it went so far past $5k which was the highest price a JB Conan page had gone for on HA (and it had Belit too).

$7800 for Conan 72 panel page????? That is a steep Belit tax. https://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/panel-pages/john-buscema-and-ernie-chan-conan-the-barbarian-72-story-page-2-original-art-marvel-1977-/a/7189-92026.s?ic16=ViewItem-BrowseTabs-Auction-Archive-ThisAuction-120115

This is confusing on several levels--maybe because there are not enough facts here. If this is a merchant transaction (even if there were no invoice), why isn't Paypal's own insurance protection covering the amount (and they either then later get it from him or suspend his paypal account if they cannot)? They have to wait some time for him to give his defense and side of the story before they act to make a final determination but once that time passes, whether he's responded or not, they can settle it in your favor. After that presumably they suspend his paypal account and/or maybe freeze his existing paypal balance (from the other commissions you thought he was getting paid for) and could get the refund from that paypal balance. And if they never recover it from him presumably they suspend him and he cannot use Paypal until he clears the amount he owes. Conjecture on my part as I don't know paypal's current rules but it seems that you should bed coming out of this better than you appear to be.

There's a ton of stuff under FMV - and they'll all quickly make substantial jumps in the live bidding. By the way, just noticed this funky Batman #400 page with Ra's al Ghul in the auction. A lot of cool stuff in this auction.

Well, I just wanted to see what 2025 prices look like.

Thanks for posting! I wish there were pics with what the Donnellys had where you could see their prices.

Random question for owners of this book--does this book have any other special features in the back? Like copies of any art or anything else unusual (like copies of little seen promos)?. Also the IDW site says that this does not have issue #128--is that true? Thanks in advance.

My initial reaction is that I just don't ever see this model working for OA for a variety of reasons unless it adopted the same passive investor/PE model involving other high end/luxury/unique assets. For example, there are a number of private funds that buy high end vintage cars (Ferrari etc.) and I understand one investing motivation is that investors get a kick out of owning a fund that owns a portfolio of cool cars. But no investor is asking if a car is available for them to borrow for the weekend to drive around town or show their friends. And the manager of the fund makes all the decisions and of course the fund has custody/ownership of the assets. A small group could form a general partnership or similar collective vehicle whereby money is pooled and decisions to buy or sell are made by all "partners" but that leaves the fundamental issue of who is holding the art and how do the partners appreciate the art. I don't see it as practical of course to share the art or pass it around for periods of time.

Debbie Downer Note: fractionalization or selling participations etc. raise securities law issues (ie, depending on how it is structured and intended to operate and rights of the participants, securities laws may need to be complied with.)

Thanks Gene for the round-up!

Putting aside whether $55k is FMV for that cover, it has been 11 years.

Why do you say "now"? Was it less at a previous show?