CGC's mysterious "Grading Standards"...

[Shield]

I read lots of threads where people complain about CGC not publishing their grading standards. I was bored for a minute, and thought about this. Why should they? Do certain restaurants disclose their secret sauce? Wouldn't a published set of standards mean the majority of the encapsulated books be held under intense scrutiny, thus only adding lots of "manpower" aka company resources to put out fires? We've seen their own grading standards become fine tuned over the years (the other thread about the AF #15 with the color copy front cover graded as an apparent 4.5 got me thinking about this).

 

If you personally became president of CGC today, would YOU make an effort to publish your "official" January 2009 standards based on 9 years of collective grading "evolution?" I don't think I would, and I certainly understand why CGC doesn't.

 

 

[Bosco685]

Actually, I understand where your thought process is going when it comes to a "competitive edge" service, but with collectibles this is different.

 

CGC is supposed to drive not only a common standard sellers and buyers are comfortable with when conducting transactions, but also detect things such as restoration or book damage not caught before because we would have to buy based on a raw book picture.

 

So if a product like CGC is going to be marketable, their grading standard is what drives that interest and acceptance. I would think from their early days when they brought major retailers together and passed around books to come to an agreement on conditions, this is what made them agree to support CGC.

 

I'm not a fan of his, but you can read Chuck Rozanski's historic articles on the topic and see this was why he jumped on-board (at least one reason - another was $$$$ to be made).

[PokerKid]

I would use their service, not because they have a better set of standards, but because the professionals looking at the book and determining the grade are experts and take their job as seriously as I take my purchases.

 

I'm not a fan of:

"Here, your book got a 9.2"

"Why?"

"Because we say so!"

 

I would prefer to know the criteria that caused it - how much is taken off for page quality, dings, blunted corners, foxing, etc. Knowing the standards wouldn't change the fact that the grade is still an opinion and that a different grader might give it a slightly different grade, but at least I would know the criteria.

 

 

[Bosco685]

Oddly enough, interesting you brought this up as my company had Legal come in to train managers on the difference between Trade Marks, Patents, Copyrights, etc.

 

Someone like a Coca Cola that had an employee hack the "secret recipe" system and then tried to sell this to Pepsi is where a competitive edge legal issue comes into play. Luckily for Pepsi, they turned the Coca Cola employee in.

 

With CGC, their driving a commonly accepted standard so there are no questions between the parties is the critical competitive edge, but it is also part of the product feature they are offering. Otherwise, we would be questioning sellers "Why did that book get a 9.6 and not a 9.8? What's wrong with it as there has to be a problem?"

 

That is not the common engagement now but rather we agree there are these common grading standards that we come to accept.

[DrWatson]

Hell no, I wouldn't disclose it. After all these years, I know how to pick 9.8s. Occasionally I get a 9.6. The code can be cracked. It's called trial and error.

[GACollectibles]

Hell no, I wouldn't disclose it. After all these years, I know how to pick 9.8s. Occasionally I get a 9.6. The code can be cracked. It's called trial and error.

 

That is reverse grading and a process by elimination to a point where you estimate by comparison.

[VintageComics]

Hell no, I wouldn't disclose it. After all these years, I know how to pick 9.8s. Occasionally I get a 9.6. The code can be cracked. It's called trial and error.

 

That is reverse grading and a process by elimination to a point where you estimate by comparison.

 

It's called a good business model as it keeps people submitting.

 

BTW, Watson. That avatar is the way I will always remember you.

 

[DrWatson]

Hell no, I wouldn't disclose it. After all these years, I know how to pick 9.8s. Occasionally I get a 9.6. The code can be cracked. It's called trial and error.

 

That is reverse grading and a process by elimination to a point where you estimate by comparison.

So what? I call it adapting to a set circumstance without person_without_enough_empathying and moaning.

[DrWatson]

Hell no, I wouldn't disclose it. After all these years, I know how to pick 9.8s. Occasionally I get a 9.6. The code can be cracked. It's called trial and error.

 

That is reverse grading and a process by elimination to a point where you estimate by comparison.

 

It's called a good business model as it keeps people submitting.

 

BTW, Watson. That avatar is the way I will always remember you.

 

I think I have changed that one. Are you talking about the head in the sand?

[GACollectibles]

Yes, you have plenty of other things to blitch and moan about! (thumbs u

[VintageComics]

Nope. The one you have now.

[DrWatson]

Yes, you have plenty of other things to blitch and moan about! (thumbs u

Bostonians are high on the list.

[DrWatson]

Nope. The one you have now.

You mean the straight jacket? They let me keep it as a souvenir.

[GACollectibles]

Yes, you have plenty of other things to blitch and moan about! (thumbs u

Bostonians are high on the list.

 

Another jealous sports fan. Sigh.

[joeypost]

Sure I get frustrated sometimes with grades I receive and question the process but if I were put into a top position with the company, I would have to keep our standards in house. If three other grading companies sprouted tomorrow and disclosed every process they use to arrive at a grade, it would cause competitive price drops in service ultimately losing them money. The slab wars would still be won by CGC. Why? Imagine how many millions of dollars are currently sealed up in the brand. Because I can't. I don't see all that gold and silver being cracked in my lifetime to transfer to another company. In this case, the head start wins.

 

They were first to market and have easily held the 800 pound gorilla designation. Just on those fact alone they have no reason to divulge any trade secrets.

 

Even a company like coke who has direct competition has firmly held their flagship products formula a secret. Like Watson has said earlier you can figure out through trial and error what they look for and what they overlook.

 

We know major no-no's are: stains, CGC's, tears, rusty or popped staples, fading, etc. And bindery tears, printing creases, miscuts, etc are overlooked.

 

If you know what to look for your hit rate can be up in the 90% or greater range.

 

[Bosco685]

What trade secrets on grading? That is not a secret really, is it?

 

To me, it is their outstanding ability to catch things like restoration and also standing behind their product through the hologram label and improving their casing so it is not something that can be easily cracked open, resealed, and then a false product sold.

 

Grading would not be their competitive edge. Especially since many have said lately there has been a slight shift in how they grade books with stress lines and corner blunting. That would be a competitive disadvantage.

[Timmay]

 

We know major no-no's are: stains, CGC's, tears, prusty or opped staples, fading, etc. And bindery tears, printing creases, miscuts, etc are overlooked.

 

 

 

What are those??

 

[joeypost]

What trade secrets on grading? That is not a secret really, is it?

 

To me, it is their outstanding ability to catch things like restoration and also standing behind their product through the hologram label and improving their casing so it is not something that can be easily cracked open, resealed, and then a false product sold.

 

Grading would not be their competitive edge. Especially since many have said lately there has been a slight shift in how they grade books with stress lines and corner blunting. That would be a competitive disadvantage.

 

If you want to fight over words we can use criteria. Everything they use to come to a numeric grade on a book is not a secret, neither are the ingredients in coke. What we don't know are the amounts and combinations. These are the variables that some call into question.

 

Personally I have not seen a shift in their grading. My averages and what I expect back has not changed. That is also true for many I know that regularly submit.

 

Oddly enough, none of them are given to conspiracy theories.

[joeypost]

 

We know major no-no's are: stains, CGC's, tears, prusty or opped staples, fading, etc. And bindery tears, printing creases, miscuts, etc are overlooked.

 

 

 

What are those??

 

 

Thank you Mister Helper.

[DrWatson]

 

We know major no-no's are: stains, CGC's, tears, prusty or opped staples, fading, etc. And bindery tears, printing creases, miscuts, etc are overlooked.

 

 

 

What are those??

 

He doesn't know.