Thoughts on modern values

[mead-migration]

The company decides to do multiple printings AFTER the initial sales on the previous printing come in. Company X does not sit down and say we will do five printings of #1 BEFORE the sell-thru figures for the first issue comes out.

 

That is EXACTLY what I mean. The reason I didn't explain it like how you did is because I thought you already knew the specifics so I went into the main idea but I didn''t have to go into detail. The main idea is that THE COMPANY DECIDES, PERIOD.

 

If a retailer is ordering based on what they believe will skyrocket in price then they are in the wrong business, in my opinion.

 

Many retailers order based on what will skyrocket in price if they don't order enough. That's one of the reasons there's different print runs. I'm not going to go into detail why. A lot of people can figure that out already.

 

You're guessing. Sounds like he ordered not out of fear but by speculation, and he deserved to get burned, sorry.

 

Fear in this case can be interpreted as a form of speculation as in fearing the comic might rise in value so order more of it being similar to speculating the comic might rise so order more of it. Again, I would have thought you would've put two and two together & figured this out yourself but it seems like you want to get into technical terms. I wouldn't be suprised if you tried to check my spelling as well.

 

 

With the Batman 612 example, Batman 612 had already sold thru in most locations, and not as many retailers ordered the second print because they were unaware of the new cover. As a result, the completists went nuts trying to get the second print for the new cover.

 

And the result is that it took the heat off of the 1st prints. My point again. And not only completists were searching for that comic. Collectors, speculators, etc.

 

 

Tanord's quote. You stated that there isn't a great conspiracy to rip customers off but I tend to disagree. I think that there is a conspiracy of collusion. You see when these companies make these deals to have a DF edition or a Wizard Ace Edition, that means more media coverage. Don't you think it's fishy that Wizard being the guide to comics with a price guide also takes part in making thier own comics as well? And you can bet they hyped their own Wizard Ace Editions with pictures and more coverage in their magazines. I've even seen them raise the price of Wizard Ace Edition comics in the guide and didn't see it reflect in my region. And there are several discussions about the Ace Editions in comic book forums about Wizard hyping up their own brand comics. So I know that it wasn't just in my region. A lot of people laugh about Wizard's prices and I'm sure you've heard about what people say about Wizard.

 

 

Let's agree to disagree. I've never used Wizard magazine as a price guide, so I have no use for that aspect.

 

Have you ever used Wizard at all though?(Market Watch,etc.) Has it ever influenced your opinion?

 

Anyone who seriously contemplates the purchase of manufactured collectibles like Wizard Ace Editions and DF limited editions is speculationg. Those books aren't designed for the reader/collector, but for the speculator/collector.

 

Which is EXACTLY my point of ADDING MORE into the supply and LESSENING the demand for regular copys. Thus, the price of the regular copy goes spiraling down.

 

 

Well, then you are perpetually setting yourself up for disappointment by placing the emphasis on collecting over content. Respecting your comics is a given, but for me, comics are meant to be read and enjoyed FIRST, and anything that comes out of that - such as increases in value is a bonus. You would be better off collecting OLDER books, where there is a higher collectibilty factor than speculating on new books in the hope that they will go up in value.

 

Actually I'm pretty good at determining whether a comic book will be hot or not. There have been several articles about this. I'm not going to post that info. here since you're just interested in reading. I don't blame you, hey I like reading comics too but it's always good to get something extra.

 

Comics are a published medium, and like any other printed medium the publisher has a right to meet consumer demand instead of trying to reward a small group of people who get to the shop first thing on Wednesday morning. When a book comes out in paperback and sells out, does the publisher say "too bad for anyone else that wants to read it", NO they go back to press to fill orders from bookstores and make more moeny.

 

Are you talking about book novels or comics at bookstores? Ther IS a difference. Novels are to read. No pictures, no fancy cover, no art. Just the story. Comic books are more flexible in which can be collectibles spawning toys, stickers, prints like lithographs, cards, posters, etc. Both books and comics can spawn movies. Until recently, comics have not been known to reprint issues at a regularity that we see today. It changed to a reprint, a reprint, a reprint, etc. It wasn't always like that & that Reprint Age is fairly new for comics. Books on the other hand usually have a set price. Historically, comics prices have a better range and room to go up and down. Comics have joined books in the Reprinting Age of different formats. It wasn't always like that and it just happened recently.

 

 

You seem to be under the mistaken impression that companies actually care about the collectibility of their books and want to reward the collectors first.

 

I'm not under any impression. I knew that comic companies don't care. They SHOULD though. Being that they don't care shows their ethics. It's all about the money. That's why I don't give a [!@#%^&^] if comic companies go belly up like Chaos. You have to read my quote in the earlier post. I said the people who get the right comics early SHOULD be rewarded. It is not like that in reality but they SHOULD be rewarded.

 

 

Companies care about selling as many copies to as many people who want to read it. A BIGGER reward to any comic is to say that there was such consumer demand for the book (a recent example would be Teen Titans #1) that we had to go thru multiple printings.

 

You're wrong there, comic companies care about selling as many copies PERIOD. They do not care if people read it or not, they only want you to just buy the damn thing. Look at what happened to Valiant, they went and overprinted and they KNEW that not as much people were reading their comics as they printed them but they just wanted to cash in. You don't think that still happens today? Research Dreamwave. I don't want to list them all. The explanation of just selling as many copies to as many people who want to read is a disguise. It's good public relations. If they fessed up and said the real truth collectors, fans, consumers would look at them a different way. A negative way. Do you work for the distribution industry?

You sound like the spokesperson whose job is to play things down and try to sugarcoat it with public relations.

 

Actually the industry, like every other industry, wants CONSUMERS. It doesn't matter if they define themselves as readers or collectors or fans, etc.

 

I KNOW THAT. I was just responding in your own terms in your previous post of collectors and readers.

 

 

Comic book companies want buyers, they exist to make money.

 

They exist to make money but they don't have to be GREEDY. That's bad ethics.

 

To buy new issues with the hope that they will go up in value is only setting yourself up for disappointment. To believe that the companies somehow owe it to you or I to create "collectibles" is ultimately flawed and is what has led to the creation of Dynamic Forces and Wizard in the marketplace.

 

Comic companies don't owe it to me. After the initial print run they SHOULD let the the market sort itself out. What goes up must come down. Don't tamper with it. It's better for the market this way. But they don't do that. Which shows what they're really into. By going into extra multiple reprints they control and manipulate the supply AFTER they print all they printed. What this discussion has done is expose comic companies for what they really are. As far as a price guide is concerned, a legitimate well-organized price guide would be cool but the guide would have to be fair and not manipulative or biased. It can work but it has to be fair and reflect the true nature of the marketplace.

 

Tanord

[Kevin Boyd]

New comics are not a "market", they are a "product". If you don't understand that fundamental difference and get upset when companies try to sell these "products" as they can (and will) then you will be continually upset and will eventually quit this hobby in disgust... I can already see the cracks forming when you start throwing out terms like "greed" and "collusion".

 

The "real" comic book market is in older books. You would be best advised to switch your attention there instead of speculating on hot comics.

 

Your friend will eventually have to close his store because he's ordered a lot of garbage that he will never be able to sell simply because he is "afraid" of not ordering a "possible" collector's item. That's money tied up in product that he will never get back. He should smarten up and order more Spider-Man and X-Men comics instead of 5th printings and Ace Editions, as Spider-Man and X-Men are the only new books that will be worth their salt in the long term because those titles have shown that they are long term winners... there will always be new Spider-Man and X-Men buyers. Anything else is just short term speculation and will end up in the discount bins. A Jim Lee Batman is sure thing, a Pat Lee Transformers is not.

 

Kev