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is Batman 1 overtaking Marvel Comics 1 in terms of value, significance....

Started by drdonaldblake,

111 posts in this topic

VintageComics

VintageComics

Posted
Posted

I might disagree. I guess in that regard I don't disappoint. meh

 

There can be several reasons why the two may or may not be related.

 

I can't help but notice that a Batman #1 CGC 1.5 just sold for a little over $8K acc. to GPA. I sold my MMC #9 for near that in December (former/cracked out CGC 1.5).

 

Now before people jump on me, I'm not correlating the #9 to the Bats #1 as much as I am showing that in lower grades it is a much more common book than Timely copies and does not fetch as much of a premium.

 

I guess a very telling sign will be how Batman #1 compares in low to mid grades over the next little while.

 

So many times it may be difficult to relate historical relevance to current market unless an actual trend is noticed across all grades.

 

R.

 

 

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VintageComics

VintageComics

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Posted

If it's pure $$ then Batman #1 has overtaken MC #1 in higher grades simply because of rarity.

 

 

Really? I disagree, MC 1 is rarer than Batman 1. I think you are getting rarity and availability confused. Availability comes and goes, and right now there are lots of MC 1's out there. 5-7 years ago, it was the opposite.

 

And as for my personal preference, you can put me down for an MC1 over a Bat 1 in the same grade any day of the week including Sundays. And I drink the DC Kool-Aid. :cloud9:

 

 

Ahh, you are right. There are many more Batman #1 on the census than MC #1. Just checked.

 

MC #1 currently seems to be much more available in the 7.0 and up grade range.

 

Welcome to the kool-aid spike club.

 

:devil:

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nearmint

nearmint

Posted
Posted

The Bat #1 you're referring to didn't just sell, it sold in May of last year. The big jump in prices happened just after that. It wasn't until the San Diego con in late July that suddenly copies seemed to be absent from the marketplace. Prices rose significantly on copies that appeared from then on.

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VintageComics

VintageComics

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Posted
The Bat #1 you're referring to didn't just sell, it sold in May of last year. The big jump in prices happened just after that. It wasn't until the San Diego con in late July that suddenly copies seemed to be absent from the marketplace. Prices rose significantly on copies that appeared from then on.

 

My bad. I misread and thought it was May '09.

 

If that is the case I am happy to be corrected.

 

So are you bidding on Adam's #1 2.0?

 

I'm thinking about it.

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nearmint

nearmint

Posted
Posted

If it's pure $$ then Batman #1 has overtaken MC #1 in higher grades simply because of rarity.

 

 

Really? I disagree, MC 1 is rarer than Batman 1. I think you are getting rarity and availability confused. Availability comes and goes, and right now there are lots of MC 1's out there. 5-7 years ago, it was the opposite.

 

And as for my personal preference, you can put me down for an MC1 over a Bat 1 in the same grade any day of the week including Sundays. And I drink the DC Kool-Aid. :cloud9:

 

 

MC #1 is a huge book, and I can understand why it'd be #1 on anyone's want list. But, seeing all the factors involved, it doesn't surprise me that Bat #1 is catching up, both in significance and price levels.

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Old Fashion PB and J

Old Fashion PB and J

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The Joker is hands down the #1 villian. He has reshaped what the "bad guy" is in comics along the whole way. So to bring him and the Human Torch from MMC1 into the same discusion is just wrong. Android torch is dea, popularity may have soared due to FF1 but it's a different guy. So no real argument there. Namor is one of my favorite Marvel characters without a doubt, but still pales in comparsion to the Joker. And if you want to talk historical importance, here it is. Batman is at issue 600 and what, MMC is looong dead. And it wasnt even Marvel Comics it is Timely, which was sold off and got a "fresh new look". There is no doubting that Marvel has been a force in comics since it's inception, but it does slip from top dog here and there. Maybe not so much in back issue collections, but in consistently delivering quality stories.

 

And just a quick review. The Joker was one of the 1st villians to be a fan favorite. He has been used as almost an industry standard to shape where suerhero books go. Look at stories like "5 way revenge" which shaped the DC SA, and brought the dark and gritty Batman stories we love. The Killing Joke, Frank Millers Dark Knight. And how many times has REALLY attempted or Killed a Robin? The Joker is hands down a staple in the DC universe, and has been around a VERY long time.

 

MMC1.. A name on the cover, and the number 1.

 

Put preference and collecting goals aside, and Bats 1 delivers far better in terms of importance. If you REALLY want to discuss themost important Marvel Comic it would be FF1. If that book didnt launch MMC1 would be below All-Flash 1

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VintageComics

VintageComics

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Posted

Sorry.

 

Porsches Comics elicit an emotional response rather than a logical one.

 

I see Batman #1 as a cool book from a publisher that was responsible for Robin corner shock poses, pink covers and snow men.

 

I have an emotional bias that prevents me from ejoying DC as a reader.

 

R.

 

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stagedoorjohnny

stagedoorjohnny

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Posted

The MMC1.. A name on the cover, and the number 1.

 

 

Yes... THE name on the cover and the number 1. And for me, that in and of itself makes it a huge book that cannot be understated. But then again, you are talking to a guy who would take a Tec 1 over a Bat 1 in the same grade any day of the week. (including Sundays of course) So take it with a grain of salt. :grin:

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VintageComics

VintageComics

Posted
Posted
from a publisher that was responsible for Robin corner shock poses, pink covers and snow men.

 

If that's all you see, then you've got some learnin' to do!

 

To be fair, I loved Batman as a kid and in my teen years.

 

I just dug up my Kindergarten report card. The teacher actually made note of how I loved drawing Batman pictures in school.

 

Somewhere I took a turn for the better.

 

:baiting:

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jimjum12

jimjum12

Posted
Posted
from a publisher that was responsible for Robin corner shock poses, pink covers and snow men.

 

If that's all you see, then you've got some learnin' to do!

 

To be fair, I loved Batman as a kid and in my teen years.

 

I just dug up my Kindergarten report card. The teacher actually made note of how I loved drawing Batman pictures in school.

 

Somewhere I took a turn for the better.

 

:baiting:

 

You STILL do love Batman...it's just that all the beer and cognac has roasted all the brain cells necessary to process that information :baiting: ....GOD BLESS...

 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus) (thumbs u

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Aman619

Aman619

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The Joker is hands down the #1 villian. He has reshaped what the "bad guy" is in comics along the whole way. So to bring him and the Human Torch from MMC1 into the same discusion is just wrong. Android torch is dea, popularity may have soared due to FF1 but it's a different guy. So no real argument there. Namor is one of my favorite Marvel characters without a doubt, but still pales in comparsion to the Joker. And if you want to talk historical importance, here it is. Batman is at issue 600 and what, MMC is looong dead. And it wasnt even Marvel Comics it is Timely, which was sold off and got a "fresh new look". There is no doubting that Marvel has been a force in comics since it's inception, but it does slip from top dog here and there. Maybe not so much in back issue collections, but in consistently delivering quality stories.

 

And just a quick review. The Joker was one of the 1st villians to be a fan favorite. He has been used as almost an industry standard to shape where suerhero books go. Look at stories like "5 way revenge" which shaped the DC SA, and brought the dark and gritty Batman stories we love. The Killing Joke, Frank Millers Dark Knight. And how many times has REALLY attempted or Killed a Robin? The Joker is hands down a staple in the DC universe, and has been around a VERY long time.

 

MMC1.. A name on the cover, and the number 1.

 

Put preference and collecting goals aside, and Bats 1 delivers far better in terms of importance. If you REALLY want to discuss themost important Marvel Comic it would be FF1. If that book didnt launch MMC1 would be below All-Flash 1

 

Just how many Joker stories were there in the GA? I dont think it was all that many actually, right?

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Crowzilla

Crowzilla

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Just how many Joker stories were there in the GA? I dont think it was all that many actually, right?

 

I think you're looking at somewhere around three dozen GA stories.

Seems like a pretty good number to me.

 

 

Edit - or as Jeff has just shown below, about five dozen - a really big number.

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Silver Surfer

Silver Surfer

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Posted
from a publisher that was responsible for Robin corner shock poses, pink covers and snow men.

 

If that's all you see, then you've got some learnin' to do!

 

To be fair, I loved Batman as a kid and in my teen years.

 

I just dug up my Kindergarten report card. The teacher actually made note of how I loved drawing Batman pictures in school.

 

Somewhere I took a turn for the better.

 

:baiting:

 

Probably when you realized that you liked girls and maybe Robin didn't (not that there is anything wrong with that :whistle: ) Maybe Robin swinging on the cover on Bats #1 had a deeper meaning to it than just "optomistic". lol

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nearmint

nearmint

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Posted

Just how many Joker stories were there in the GA? I dont think it was all that many actually, right?

 

Batman #1 1st Appearance, vs the Batman The Dark Knight Archives #1, The Great Comics Book Heroes (Feiffer), Batman from the 30's to the 70's, Famous First Editions F-5, The Greatest Joker Stories Ever Told

Batman #2 vs the Batman The Dark Knight Archives #1

Detective #45 vs the Batman The Batman Archives #1

Batman #4 vs the Batman The Dark Knight Archives #1, Limited Collector's Edition #C-25, The Greatest Joker Stories Ever Told

Batman #5 vs the Batman The Dark Knight Archives #2

Batman #7 vs the Batman The Dark Knight Archives #2

Batman #8 vs the Batman The Dark Knight Archives #2

Detective #60 vs the Batman The Batman Archives #2

Batman #9 vs the Batman The Dark Knight Archives #3

Detective #62 vs the Batman The Batman Archives #2

Detective #64 vs the Batman The Batman Archives #2

Batman #11 vs the Batman The Dark Knight Archives #3

Batman #12 vs the Batman The Dark Knight Archives #3

Batman #13 vs the Batman

Detective #69 vs the Batman The Batman Archives #2

Detective #71 vs the Batman The Batman Archives #3

Batman #16 vs the Batman

Detective #76 vs the Batman The Batman Archives #3

Batman #19 vs the Batman

Batman #20 vs the Batman

Detective #85 vs the Batman The Batman Archives #4

Batman #23 vs the Batman

Detective #91 vs the Batman The Batman Archives #4

Batman #25 vs the Batman

Batman #28 vs the Batman

Detective #102 vs the Batman The Batman Archives #4

World's Finest #19

Batman #32 vs the Batman

Detective #109 vs the Batman

Detective #114 vs the Batman

Batman #37 vs the Batman

Detective #118 vs the Batman

Batman #40 vs the Batman

Detective #124 vs the Batman

Detective #128 vs the Batman

Batman #44 vs the Batman

Batman #46 vs the Batman

Detective #137 vs the Batman

Detective #138 vs the Batman

Batman #52 vs the Batman

Batman #53 vs the Batman

Detective #149 vs the Batman

Batman #55 vs the Batman

Batman #57 vs the Batman

Batman #59 vs the Batman

World's Finest #48

Detective #168 Origin, as the Red Hood, vs the Batman Limited Collector's Edition #C-39, The Greatest Joker Stories Ever Told

Batman #63 vs the Batman

Batman #66 vs the Batman

Batman #67 vs the Batman Batman from the 30's to the 70's

Detective #180 vs the Batman

World's Finest #59

Batman #73 vs the Batman Batman #176, The Greatest Joker Stories Ever Told

World's Finest #61 vs Batman The Greatest Joker Stories Ever Told

Batman #74 vs the Batman

Detective #193 Origin, as the Red Hood, vs the Batman

Batman #80 vs the Batman

Batman #85 vs the Batman Batman #182, Batman vs. the Joker

Batman #86 vs the Batman Batman vs. the Joker

Batman #87 vs the Batman

Batman #97 vs the Batman

World's Finest #88 w/ Lex Luthor, vs Superman and Batman The Greatest Joker Stories Ever Told

 

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Crowzilla

Crowzilla

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Posted
But then again, you are talking to a guy who would take a Tec 1 over a Bat 1 in the same grade any day of the week. (including Sundays of course) So take it with a grain of salt. :grin:

 

Well Tec #1 certainly guides for more, and I'm pretty sure would bring more in equal grades everyday of the week. For wowness factor, I'm with you - give me a Tec #1.

For long term investment, Bat #1 will probably turn out to be the better book.

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VintageComics

VintageComics

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Posted

Listen, I ain't gonna argue that the Joker is not important. As far as preference, there really is no arguing as it's a personal taste thing.

 

This question is directed to the open floor.

 

Putting $ value aside, how do you define significance for a particular issue?

 

What sort of criteria would you use?

 

 

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nearmint

nearmint

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Posted
Listen, I ain't gonna argue that the Joker is not important. As far as preference, there really is no arguing as it's a personal taste thing.

 

This question is directed to the open floor.

 

Putting $ value aside, how do you define significance for a particular issue?

 

What sort of criteria would you use?

 

 

Continued presence and popularity within popular culture. A good example is The Big Red Cheese, huge in his day, but he's fallen off the radar of the general public. The books are still very cool, but many are bargains because the demand isn't there anymore.

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stagedoorjohnny

stagedoorjohnny

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Posted

Well Tec #1 certainly guides for more, and I'm pretty sure would bring more in equal grades everyday of the week. For wowness factor, I'm with you - give me a Tec #1.

For long term investment, Bat #1 will probably turn out to be the better book.

 

 

I think you'd be surprised how comparable some recent sales have been between the two books. Bat 1 has certainly closed the gap on a lot of key books of late, Tec 1 no exception.

 

And you are probably right, Bat 1 would be the better "investment" going forward. But oh... how I would love a nice, clean, mid-grade copy of Tec 1 completely unrestored with decent pages. :cloud9:

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