Top Collections NOT in the Registry?

[TheWatcher]

Verzyl owns the entire Mile High Timely run. The only book that is not a Mile High is his Cap #1 because the Mile High was restored. I believe he has the Allentown #1 which is a 9.6

He doesn`t have the MH Red Raven #1, does he?

 

Thought Chuck kept that book along with some others

[VintageComics]

Verzyl owns the entire Mile High Timely run. The only book that is not a Mile High is his Cap #1 because the Mile High was restored. I believe he has the Allentown #1 which is a 9.6

He doesn`t have the MH Red Raven #1, does he?

 

Bedrock or Gator could answer that. I'm not sure.

 

 

[rob_react]

I tend to agree with the idea that the vast majority of top collections are not in the registry.

 

I also agree that there are many, many, many nice copies out there and even now the CGC census only begins to tell the story of the books that are out there.

 

 

[VintageComics]

Many of you guys really have no idea of the vast amount of collectors with terrific collections. There are a ton of guys with complete Silver Age Marvel & DC collections. Tons of guys with immense GA collections. Tons of guys with complete Disney, EC, pre-code horror, and on down the line. The depth and the breadth of this hobby and the collectors that comprise it never ceases to amaze me.

 

I know of a collector who has basically 99% of every Superman collectible ever made. I don't know if he has an Action #1, but he has some extremely obscure stuff. And he has tons of original art, he has tons of statues, collectible rings, etc. He also has an enormous Walt Kelly collection

 

I know a guy who has a copy of every book which is in the top 100 GA comics, and multiples of some of them. Well, had....Ricky just bought his Silver Streak #6 Allentown.

 

Most of these guys not only don't publicize their collections and really don't talk about them much at all. Most of them have never and probably never will be on this board and a majority of the books are not slabbed. We have only touched the tip of the iceberg with the books that are out there.

 

Dale, this is such a good post it deserves repeating.

 

 

[tth2]

tom brulato's ASM collection would be #1

 

He's got the best overall SA collection by far

 

Of the known collections, I would guess this is the case.

 

There are many collections not known that are phenomenal though.

 

I saw a post on here saying they figured 80% of collections are not in the registry. I would say the number would be closed to 99.9% of collections are not in the registry.

You really believe there`s a SA Marvel collection out there that is better than Brulato`s?

[rob_react]

tom brulato's ASM collection would be #1

 

He's got the best overall SA collection by far

 

Of the known collections, I would guess this is the case.

 

There are many collections not known that are phenomenal though.

 

I saw a post on here saying they figured 80% of collections are not in the registry. I would say the number would be closed to 99.9% of collections are not in the registry.

You really believe there`s a SA Marvel collection out there that is better than Brulato`s?

 

I don't think it's impossible that there's a better collection out there. 20-30 years ago an obsessive collector could have put together a perfect collection on the secondary market for a fraction of the price you'd pay for a 9.4 AF15 right now.

 

Case in point- imagine someone with the resources and mindset of Dave Anderson buying Silver Age Marvels in the 80s.

[VintageComics]

tom brulato's ASM collection would be #1

 

He's got the best overall SA collection by far

 

Of the known collections, I would guess this is the case.

 

There are many collections not known that are phenomenal though.

 

I saw a post on here saying they figured 80% of collections are not in the registry. I would say the number would be closed to 99.9% of collections are not in the registry.

You really believe there`s a SA Marvel collection out there that is better than Brulato`s?

 

I don't see why not.

 

It may not be better...it may comparable. When you are talking about 9.4 and up SA runs it's all good to me.

[Hedge Collector]

tom brulato's ASM collection would be #1

 

He's got the best overall SA collection by far

 

Of the known collections, I would guess this is the case.

 

There are many collections not known that are phenomenal though.

 

I saw a post on here saying they figured 80% of collections are not in the registry. I would say the number would be closed to 99.9% of collections are not in the registry.

You really believe there`s a SA Marvel collection out there that is better than Brulato`s?

 

I don't think it's impossible that there's a better collection out there. 20-30 years ago an obsessive collector could have put together a perfect collection on the secondary market for a fraction of the price you'd pay for a 9.4 AF15 right now.

 

Case in point- imagine someone with the resources and mindset of Dave Anderson buying Silver Age Marvels in the 80s.

 

But don't you think its highly, highly , unlikely to beat a manually put together verified 9.8 collection?

 

Not to mention comics were so much less accessible 20-30 years ago and the grades so much more variable. It would have been cheaper for sure, but much much more difficult if not impossible to do compared to today.

[VintageComics]

I would argue that it would be easier for a serious collector who was well networked to put together a 9.8 run back 20-30 years ago than it is now.

 

You could find multiple copies of almost any Marvel book at cons, from dealers etc.

 

I'll bet you had multiple NM copies of AF #15 and FF #1 to choose from at a big con.

 

R.

 

 

 

 

[Hedge Collector]

I would argue that it would be easier for a serious collector who was well networked to put together a 9.8 run back 20-30 years ago than it is now.

 

You could find multiple copies of almost any Marvel book at cons, from dealers etc.

 

I'll bet you had multiple NM copies of AF #15 and FF #1 to choose from at a big con.

 

R.

 

 

 

 

I remember seeing tons of ASM 1's, AF 15's, and FF 1's at cons 20 years ago as well.

 

But I would guess that 99% of those wouldn't have graded at 9.4 or better.

 

Even as it stands today, there are only 7 AF 15's and 5 FF 1's in 9.4 or better (in the census).

 

 

[Dale Roberts]

tom brulato's ASM collection would be #1

 

He's got the best overall SA collection by far

 

Of the known collections, I would guess this is the case.

 

There are many collections not known that are phenomenal though.

 

I saw a post on here saying they figured 80% of collections are not in the registry. I would say the number would be closed to 99.9% of collections are not in the registry.

You really believe there`s a SA Marvel collection out there that is better than Brulato`s?

 

No, not at all. I don't think that was really the point of the post. I do think there are some collections out there, that is you take in the complete scope of the collection, including Golden Age, Horror, and Silver Age would surpass his collection in greatness and importance. And there always is the chance that there is a collection which rivals his out there as of yet untouched. I mean look at the Rocky Mountains which were just found.

 

I know people who have 9.2 - 9.4 copies of early to mid 50s Super Hero DCs and those books are tougher than any Silver Age Marvels regardless of grade.

[fantastic_four]

I would argue that it would be easier for a serious collector who was well networked to put together a 9.8 run back 20-30 years ago than it is now.

 

Except that nobody was splitting the Near Mint and Mint hairs much back then. If someone knows of a collector who was constantly working to upgrade their "Near Mint"s to "Mint"s, please, share their name...I suspect 99% of even high-end collectors either equated the two or believed "Mint" to be a barely-useful grade designation. Brulato has been splitting that hair for 15-20 years, and since CGC started, he's been splitting the 9.6/9.8 hair longer than pretty much anybody else ever has except perhaps Schmell.

 

The possibility of a complete original owner collection surpassing his in quality is remote in the extreme as well; he's already picked the best he could get from the best Silver pedigrees anyway. It would have to be a collection whose condition makes Mile High, San Francisco, Pacific Coast, AND Curator look slightly inferior by comparison comprised of mostly 9.8 copies. REMOTE odds, so remote as to not even be worth considering.

[VintageComics]

I would argue that it would be easier for a serious collector who was well networked to put together a 9.8 run back 20-30 years ago than it is now.

 

Except that nobody was splitting the Near Mint and Mint hairs much back then. Brulato has been splitting that hair for 15-20 years, and since CGC started, he's been splitting the 9.6/9.8 hair longer than pretty much anybody else ever has except perhaps Schmell.

 

The possibility of a complete original owner collection surpassing his in quality is remote in the extreme as well; he's already picked the best he could get from the best Silver pedigrees anyway. It would have to be a collection whose condition makes Mile High, San Francisco, Pacific Coast, AND Curator look slightly inferior by comparison. REMOTE odds, so remote as to not even be worth considering.

 

Actually, I'll disagree with you. TB and DS are not anomolies. There are plenty of people who were meticulous back in the day, as witnessed by some of the great Pedigrees that have come to market. Even outside of those famous Pedigree collections there were many anal and condition conscious collectors.

 

My best friend owned 3-4 "perfect Mint" copies of every book he had. He was a long time collector who managed one the longest running LCS in Canada (Now And Then Comics). He also happens to be a very strict grader and in most cases is tougher than CGC. We compare notes all the time.

 

He basically cherry picked his books from the best of whatever walked in the door at the time.

 

When he sold his collection to fund the opening of his own store about 15 years ago dealers from Toronto to London (and possibly further) were paying 3-5 times guide for his non key books. He swears to me that he had 4 perfect mint copies of GL #76 (he was a Neal Adams fanatic). I generally agree with his grading that his idea of perfect Mint is 9.6/9.8.

 

There are tons of people out there who were super strict graders before CGC was even an idea.

[rob_react]

I would argue that it would be easier for a serious collector who was well networked to put together a 9.8 run back 20-30 years ago than it is now.

 

You could find multiple copies of almost any Marvel book at cons, from dealers etc.

 

I'll bet you had multiple NM copies of AF #15 and FF #1 to choose from at a big con.

 

R.

 

 

 

,

 

And some of the 9.4s and 9.2s would have been 9.8s 30 years ago. In the right, obsessive, hands it would have been possible.

 

I'm not saying it happened, for certain, I just wouldn't discount it out of hand. Remember, most Silver Age Marvels are available in quantity NOW- even more so back then. It's only the stuff from, say, 1965 and earlier that would have taken extraordinary effort.

[fantastic_four]

Actually, I'll disagree with you. TB and DS are not anomolies. There are plenty of people who were meticulous back in the day, as witnessed by some of the great Pedigrees that have come to market. Even outside of those famous Pedigree collections there were many anal and condition conscious collectors.

 

The glass isn't 99% empty, it's 1% full!

 

I'll believe there was someone pre-CGC who picked out all 9.6/9.8 or better copies of some major Gold or Silver runs when I see it.

[VintageComics]

Actually, I'll disagree with you. TB and DS are not anomolies. There are plenty of people who were meticulous back in the day, as witnessed by some of the great Pedigrees that have come to market. Even outside of those famous Pedigree collections there were many anal and condition conscious collectors.

 

The glass isn't 99% empty, it's 1% full!

 

I'll believe there was someone pre-CGC who picked out all 9.6/9.8 or better copies of some major Gold or Silver runs when I see it.

 

So you're saying that just because you haven't seen it yet it's not possible.

 

You're assuming that we've found the "best of the best".

 

You're assuming that after TB and DS where made the mold was broken.

 

I've seen it. I've shown him books that pre slabbing and his grading is as tight as anybody you'll ever know, but I can't argue intagibles with you.

 

Think about it, just in the past year we have found the Valparaiso and Rocky Mountain books and those are now sitting in registries.

 

I maintain that there are MANY more similar collections out there waiting to be either found, CGC graded or added to registries.

 

That's a no brainer.

 

 

[Bunky Brian]

Actually, I'll disagree with you. TB and DS are not anomolies. There are plenty of people who were meticulous back in the day, as witnessed by some of the great Pedigrees that have come to market. Even outside of those famous Pedigree collections there were many anal and condition conscious collectors.

 

The glass isn't 99% empty, it's 1% full!

 

I'll believe there was someone pre-CGC who picked out all 9.6/9.8 or better copies of some major Gold or Silver runs when I see it.

 

So you're saying that just because you haven't seen it yet it's not possible.

 

You're assuming that we've found the "best of the best".

 

You're assuming that after TB and DS where made the mold was broken.

 

I've seen it. I've shown him books that pre slabbing and his grading is as tight as anybody you'll ever know, but I can't argue intagibles with you.

 

Think about it, just in the past year we have found the Valparaiso and Rocky Mountain books and those are now sitting in registries.

 

I maintain that there are MANY more similar collections out there waiting to be eithr found, CGC graded or added to registries.

 

That's a no brainer.

 

 

I agree with my best friend Roy, on that, take it to the bank, so there HMMMH.

[MrBedrock]

Verzyl owns the entire Mile High Timely run. The only book that is not a Mile High is his Cap #1 because the Mile High was restored. I believe he has the Allentown #1 which is a 9.6

He doesn`t have the MH Red Raven #1, does he?

 

Bedrock or Gator could answer that. I'm not sure.

 

Chuck still has the Red Raven 1 (thumbs u

[fantastic_four]

So you're saying that just because you haven't seen it yet it's not possible.

 

I believe a 1% or less chance to be greater than impossible, but completely unworthy of consideration. An original owner pedigree collection surfacing that's better than Brulato's collection I deem to be so close to impossible that I don't even know why I'm even responding about it. It'd be better than any pedigree ever found to date. 0.001% chances.

 

If we get back to the primary thrust of the thread, I'm absolutely convinced there are MANY unknown pedigrees or assembled collections that would find their place in the top 5 or 10 known sets out there. Identifying some of those are where the interesting use lies in a thread like this.

[adamstrange]

Verzyl owns the entire Mile High Timely run. The only book that is not a Mile High is his Cap #1 because the Mile High was restored. I believe he has the Allentown #1 which is a 9.6

He doesn`t have the MH Red Raven #1, does he?

 

Bedrock or Gator could answer that. I'm not sure.

 

Chuck still has the Red Raven 1 (thumbs u

Last I knew he does not have the Subby 32. There are probably a handful he does not have.