When UHG no longer matters

[COI]

Count me in as someone who no longer drinks the kool aid.

 

My reasons are simple; if I'm going to spend big bucks on something, I want it to be somewhat unique. Most HG SA Marvel (what I like) isn't unique; in fact, it's becoming more and more common now that we know how to "potentialize" otherwise lower grade books.

 

Sure, mid-lower grade Marvels are common as dirt, but they're also priced acccordingly. Find the "right" lower-mid grade copies, and you can assemble a great looking collection that is exponentially less expensive than its highgrade counterpart.

 

Another thing that mystifies me about high grade collecting is what I'd like to refer to as "scaling expectations". Many collectors will spend tons of cash getting 9.4-9.6 late-silver FFs (just an example), but when it comes to getting an FF1, they're perfectly content with a 3.5-4.0. I never understood this. Why not get lower grade copies to fill the run, and take all that extra money that was previously invested in the more common UHG stuff, and put it towards a nicer key? If a 3.5 or 4.0 is acceptable for an FF1, logically it should be acceptable for an FF 100 as well.

 

Of course, everyone should collect however they choose, this is just one man's perspective.

 

[tth2]

I've never quite understood the buy the label not the book. If a book has a horrible miswrap I do not care what the CGC grade is, I will be passing on it. I have a minimum floor for grades, but even then it is buy the book not the label as not all 8.0's are created equal. It should always be buy the book not the label.

I like to buy books that look great AND have a label to match.

 

They should also be well centered. I don't understand the folks who buy 9.8 BA and late SA books that are crooked or have a big old fat fugly white stripe running down the spine.

[JiveTurkeyMoFo]

Count me in as someone who no longer drinks the kool aid.

 

My reasons are simple; if I'm going to spend big bucks on something, I want it to be somewhat unique. Most HG SA Marvel (what I like) isn't unique; in fact, it's becoming more and more common now that we know how to "potentialize" otherwise lower grade books.

 

Sure, mid-lower grade Marvels are common as dirt, but they're also priced acccordingly. Find the "right" lower-mid grade copies, and you can assemble a great looking collection that is exponentially less expensive than its highgrade counterpart.

 

Another thing that mystifies me about high grade collecting is what I'd like to refer to as "scaling expectations". Many collectors will spend tons of cash getting 9.4-9.6 late-silver FFs (just an example), but when it comes to getting an FF1, they're perfectly content with a 3.5-4.0. I never understood this. Why not get lower grade copies to fill the run, and take all that extra money that was previously invested in the more common UHG stuff, and put it towards a nicer key? If a 3.5 or 4.0 is acceptable for an FF1, logically it should be acceptable for an FF 100 as well.

 

Of course, everyone should collect however they choose, this is just one man's perspective.

 

 

And a crazy man at that...

 

Seriously though, you're right on the Marvel keys thing. An FF # 1 in 6.5 recently sold for under $9k at a Clink auction a few months ago. That's about the cost of 20 or fewer late Silver issues in the run at 9.6. I think I would rather have the # 1 in 6.5, and those 20 books in 9.2/9.4, then pay out the nose for 9.6 copies and have to be content with a low grade # 1.

 

Speaking of, anyone wanna buy my 9.6 FFs?

[RockMyAmadeus]

There is always this perception that a 9.2 is a better looking book than a 9.8. That a 9.8 may get a better grade but you can find something lower grade that is far superior.

 

The truth is a great looking 9.8 looks better than a great looking 9.2. Buy what you like and what you can afford.

 

Or the perception that there is no visible difference. There is.

 

(thumbs u

 

There's quite a visible difference between a 9.2 and a 9.8.

 

 

[fantastic_four]

Speaking of, anyone wanna buy my 9.6 FFs?

 

Possibly!

[fantastic_four]

I like to buy books that look great AND have a label to match.

 

They should also be well centered. I don't understand the folks who buy 9.8 BA and late SA books that are crooked or have a big old fat fugly white stripe running down the spine.

 

+1

 

I used to be a QP mid-grade guy back in the 1990s, but once I realized how easy it was to get stuff through E-Bay in 2000, I switched to high grade with nice QP. If you're just now getting into collecting or starting over, getting low-to-mid-grade books with nice QP is an order of magnitude easier...holding out for high grade extends the hunt to last longer, if not indefinitely. For the main title I collect, FF, it's definitely an indefinite hunt--it has lasted a decade with no end in sight.

 

Mid-grade Spidey with nice QP? Easy-shmeesy, you'll be done fairly quickly, within a year or two. Buying these so easily in 2000 is EXACTLY what inspired me to go high grade. Yes, high-grade Spidey is one of the easier Silver titles around...but with nice QP? Not so much. Try getting nicely-wrapped, high-grade copies of 9, 11, 13, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 33, 34, and 38...it can EASILY take years or decades, which is how long I've been going at it. #33 is the exact hunting equivalent of FF #48--released at the same time, present in Mile High 2 and most likely another warehouse find, PLENTIFUL, but 90% are miswrapped, meaning that finding a perfect QP high-grade copy is REALLY a challenge, a once-every-five-years type of occurrence. I have seen exactly ONE perfect QP/PQ copy of #33 in 9.6 or better hit the market in the last decade (I've seen zero copies of FF 48). Spidey #31 in high grade with perfect QP might be the absolute toughest book in the ENTIRE run--I may have seen at most one in 9.4 or better, and for some reason the issue is just overall less available than most of the rest of the run. The books being more available also just means you can hold out longer for below-market prices or perfect PQ/QP to come your way.

 

Yes, you can scare anything out with enough money except top-hobby copies of popular titles, but that's true with any comic.

[jimjum12]

There will always be a demand for the best....but that market has been out of my reach for many years. Back in the 70's and 80's it was so much more affordable. I've come to the point where I'm happy with the Masterworks and Archives....but I'll always love the originals. I've picked up copies of my very favorites and my collection is small, but the originals I do have are decent. I can be happy with stuff in the 6.5 to 9.0 range....my eyesight probably isn't good enough to appreciate a 9.6 fully. Most of my originals are from the 50's to the early 60's and I'm thankful to have 'em. I do tend to buy the book and not the label. GOD BLESS...

 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus) (thumbs u

[COI]

Count me in as someone who no longer drinks the kool aid.

 

My reasons are simple; if I'm going to spend big bucks on something, I want it to be somewhat unique. Most HG SA Marvel (what I like) isn't unique; in fact, it's becoming more and more common now that we know how to "potentialize" otherwise lower grade books.

 

Sure, mid-lower grade Marvels are common as dirt, but they're also priced acccordingly. Find the "right" lower-mid grade copies, and you can assemble a great looking collection that is exponentially less expensive than its highgrade counterpart.

 

Another thing that mystifies me about high grade collecting is what I'd like to refer to as "scaling expectations". Many collectors will spend tons of cash getting 9.4-9.6 late-silver FFs (just an example), but when it comes to getting an FF1, they're perfectly content with a 3.5-4.0. I never understood this. Why not get lower grade copies to fill the run, and take all that extra money that was previously invested in the more common UHG stuff, and put it towards a nicer key? If a 3.5 or 4.0 is acceptable for an FF1, logically it should be acceptable for an FF 100 as well.

 

Of course, everyone should collect however they choose, this is just one man's perspective.

 

 

And a crazy man at that...

 

Seriously though, you're right on the Marvel keys thing. An FF # 1 in 6.5 recently sold for under $9k at a Clink auction a few months ago. That's about the cost of 20 or fewer late Silver issues in the run at 9.6. I think I would rather have the # 1 in 6.5, and those 20 books in 9.2/9.4, then pay out the nose for 9.6 copies and have to be content with a low grade # 1.

 

Speaking of, anyone wanna buy my 9.6 FFs?

 

I'm also applying this to the more common and less significant key books. I'm starting at the bronze age and buying attractive lower mid-grade keys, but I plan on going nicer as I work my way down to the pre-65' stuff. I'd just rather spend more on the bigger books.

[Larryw7]

When I began here I had a collection that was focused on completion of runs. After some time here I was opened up to so many new titles, characters, and genres. I also became very grade concious... As time has moved on (and my tastes have changed), I realize grade isnt the almighty I thought it was. A conversation awhile back with Foolkiller brought some very valid points, but the conversation was based on this. Why buy books that break the bank, and dont look so great. Why buy a 9.4 when a nice 9.2 can look as good if not better? And it got me thinking.. I collect alot of 9.0 books, I prefer good wraps and nice pages to all. And lately find myself picking up 8.0/8.5 books that nobody wants due to grade that just look so good!

 

Is anyone else feeling this, or is it just a few who have been dropped on their heads? Or maybe the kool-aid isnt as strong as it used to be?

 

I've never cared about ultra high grade. I think VF/8.0 is good enough for most books. I remember buying Bronze books off the stands as a kid that were already in VF or worse shape; look at the photos of GA newstands and you'll see that many of the books on the stands were already VG/F before they were even purchased. Those 9.2-9.6's look incredible,and it's amazing that they survived in such beautiful shape, but they aren't necessary for me personally.

[BEAUMONTS]

Have been buying up cheap 9.2's for years and cracking them out. Enjoying the books, they look better in mylars and I can enjoy a lot more of them. Use to buy SA 9.8's but they get boring sitting in slabbs and I just end up selling them off.

(thumbs u I agree. I find if I crack out a comic and put it in mylar it tends to "stay" in my collection. When I have a comic slabbed in tends to be "liquid" and has a high probability of being sold.

 

[Jaymole]

I am moving away from HG slabs and starting to move toward raw books that are mid to high grade. I am also buying low grade books for reading. I simply do not have the money to buy slabs anymore, and I find that a nice 8.0 to 9.2 is just as satisfying, especially considering the price and the way they look in a mylar.

 

 

[oakman29]

I am moving away from HG slabs and starting to move toward raw books that are mid to high grade. I am also buying low grade books for reading. I simply do not have the money to buy slabs anymore, and I find that a nice 8.0 to 9.2 is just as satisfying, especially considering the price and the way they look in a mylar.

 

 

So your upgrading?

 

 

 

 

 

 

[3319comics]

Pat Im with you and others... hell 7.5 or better for me. Eye appeal is it for me. Moderns atleat 9.4-8 at least . The rest of the stuff its all about presentation ...

[Old Fashion PB and J]

To go with the buy the book, not the label arguement.. I am not talking about buying a label but taking a step back and saying "does this book look good enough to justify the tag?" . Its not a matter of just grade, but price as well. I buy vf slabs for well below guide, if I buy raw I pay more. Being an educated consumer certainly helps. But I seem to care more about nice looking books then I do having top examples. Maybe I just cant justify spending the extra cash?

 

And I agree with COI I would much rather sacrifice a little on the common books to get a nicer key.

[Boba]

I was having a similar conversation with a boardie the other day, over a AMAZING SPIDER-MAN #34 , CGC 9.8 NM/MT, White Pages selling for $23,000 on Comiclink. Now I don't dispute the value of the book, but I for one do not have $23K to drop on a book that isn't even a key as far as I can tell. I guess the folks that buy the "best of" have the bucks to spare and it doesn't matter to them what they pay, as long as they get what they want.

[ComicConnoisseur]

Count me in as someone who no longer drinks the kool aid.

 

My reasons are simple; if I'm going to spend big bucks on something, I want it to be somewhat unique. Most HG SA Marvel (what I like) isn't unique; in fact, it's becoming more and more common now that we know how to "potentialize" otherwise lower grade books.

 

Sure, mid-lower grade Marvels are common as dirt, but they're also priced acccordingly. Find the "right" lower-mid grade copies, and you can assemble a great looking collection that is exponentially less expensive than its highgrade counterpart.

 

Another thing that mystifies me about high grade collecting is what I'd like to refer to as "scaling expectations". Many collectors will spend tons of cash getting 9.4-9.6 late-silver FFs (just an example), but when it comes to getting an FF1, they're perfectly content with a 3.5-4.0. I never understood this. Why not get lower grade copies to fill the run, and take all that extra money that was previously invested in the more common UHG stuff, and put it towards a nicer key? If a 3.5 or 4.0 is acceptable for an FF1, logically it should be acceptable for an FF 100 as well.

 

Of course, everyone should collect however they choose, this is just one man's perspective.

 

I agree with 100 percent of what you say in this post, basically I think a lot of the collectors are thinking what you are thinking now but not the investors or spectulators. (thumbs u

[fantastic_four]

I was having a similar conversation with a boardie the other day, over a AMAZING SPIDER-MAN #34 , CGC 9.8 NM/MT, White Pages selling for $23,000 on Comiclink. Now I don't dispute the value of the book, but I for one do not have $23K to drop on a book that isn't even a key as far as I can tell. I guess the folks that buy the "best of" have the bucks to spare and it doesn't matter to them what they pay, as long as they get what they want.

 

This is the book in question. I suppose the first thing to say is that if you're posting a Census-topping book you're hoping to field a record price for, you should smack yourself in the head for posting a really , distortedly-resized, overly-dark scan like this. Second...this is an example of how hard this book can be to get with nice wrap. Third...the overspray up top--which might not even be there but looks like it is, can't verify it due to the scan distortion resulting from a bad resize though--isn't something I'd ever consider on a 9.8 for this price level. A copy sold for $25K earlier this year, so the price isn't out of the ballpark, but I'll be surprised if it sells at this level. There are some rabid Spidey collectors out there that might pay that price for a 9.8 with white pages.

 

[chrisco37]

Different strokes for different folks.

 

I too go for the 8.5-9.2 range on later Silver as the books look great and the cost much less. I go for eye appeal books over tech grade as well. I do not like badly centered books/miswraps, but PQ doesn't really bother me.

 

Would I rather have a 9.4 or 9.6? Of course. But, not for the price difference.

 

And, I'm fine with 9.6 modern books, although I do have some 9.8's. They're usually half the price of their 9.8 counterparts.

 

 

[cheetah]

It is also listed on Worldwide Comics' site and I assume it is theirs. They really need to get their scanner fixed. They used to have really nice scans, now...not so good.

[paperheart]

Count me in as someone who no longer drinks the kool aid.

 

My reasons are simple; if I'm going to spend big bucks on something, I want it to be somewhat unique. Most HG SA Marvel (what I like) isn't unique; in fact, it's becoming more and more common now that we know how to "potentialize" otherwise lower grade books.

 

Sure, mid-lower grade Marvels are common as dirt, but they're also priced acccordingly. Find the "right" lower-mid grade copies, and you can assemble a great looking collection that is exponentially less expensive than its highgrade counterpart.

 

Another thing that mystifies me about high grade collecting is what I'd like to refer to as "scaling expectations". Many collectors will spend tons of cash getting 9.4-9.6 late-silver FFs (just an example), but when it comes to getting an FF1, they're perfectly content with a 3.5-4.0. I never understood this. Why not get lower grade copies to fill the run, and take all that extra money that was previously invested in the more common UHG stuff, and put it towards a nicer key? If a 3.5 or 4.0 is acceptable for an FF1, logically it should be acceptable for an FF 100 as well.

 

Of course, everyone should collect however they choose, this is just one man's perspective.

 

I agree with 100 percent of what you say in this post, basically I think a lot of the collectors are thinking what you are thinking now but not the investors or spectulators. (thumbs u

 

KARNAK the Magnificent lives.