Jack Kirby lightbox question?

[Niblos!]

I recently read some inkers did lightboxing on Jack Kirby because he required that he get all the original pencil art back after 1975- including the inkers share.

 

Would this mean everything from Devil Dinosaur to Captain Victory may actually be "lightboxed" art without any real "hands on" help from Jack?

 

[thethedew]

[Niblos!]

I must say I was floored when I read this as it had me running to my collection to look for Kirby's pencils. Recently, I aquired my first Kirby page in a trade from "In the Days of the Mob" #1 with inks by Vince Colletta, '71 by hampshire distribution (DC). Fortunately, Kirby's pencils can be found thoughout the page.

 

I never really considered this factor when I purchased pieces for my collection but it certainly has me doing more research before I pull the trigger.

 

[bluechip]

I recently read some inkers did lightboxing on Jack Kirby because he required that he get all the original pencil art back after 1975- including the inkers share.

 

Would this mean everything from Devil Dinosaur to Captain Victory may actually be "lightboxed" art without any real "hands on" help from Jack?

 

That would seem to indicate that any published Kirby art post 1975 was lightboxed, and yet it's my understanding that is not the case. I've seen Kirby Marvel pages inked by Royer post 1975 which, I was assured by reliable sources, were not lightboxed but did indeed have Kirby pencils underneath.

 

 

 

[Niblos!]

I can only imagine the artist having dilated pupils for days after hovering over a lightbox for lenthy periods. I shot Mark Evanier an email so I'll let you guys know what I hear. I really appreciate everyone's input but it seems with only the exception of Super Powers and a few other titles, the inkers must have worked directly over Kirby's pencils.

 

I ran across the above comment last night when I was looking over a high-profile art dealer's collection and wondered if there was any truth to it. Since I haven't been exposed to twomorrow's Jack Kirby Collector, I knew you guys would be able to get to the bottom of this.

 

[glendgold]

Where exactly did you read this and what exactly did you read? It's comments that begin with "I read somewhere" that end up with internet rumors that even snopes.com can't kill.

 

Let me tell you what I know, but before that: my name is Glen Gold, I've been collecting Kirby art since 1992, and I've been concerned about forgeries, lightboxes, misidentified artwork, deliberate con jobs and accidental misunderstandings ever since then. I'm sure there are people out there who know more about Kirby art than I do, but I've been trying to disseminate good information about the subject for almost twenty years. Back in The Jack Kirby Collector #19, I wrote about how to authenticate Jack's art. The information hasn't really changed since then. But, to address what you're talking about:

 

No, Jack didn't require inkers to lightbox his art after 1975. In most cases, in most PUBLISHED Kirby art, the pencils and inks are on the same board. The exceptions I can think of are the following:

 

*Theakston-inked Superpowers pages. Most of these are lightboxed, some aren't.

*Heroes and Villains pin-ups from the 1970s "Roz" Sketchbook.

*A few pages to Thor 177, on vellum

*Some 1970s Marvel covers, also on vellum -- Kazar 12, for instance

 

The reason I got interested in this was that back in 1993, a guy had a pair of Royer-inked covers for sale. But when he looked at them, he couldn't prove there were Kirby pencils on them. Royer erased so thoroughly it was tough to see Jack's work there. I contacted the estate, and Royer, both of whom were kind enough to set me straight: in published work, Royer ALWAYS inked over pencils. (If there are exceptions, they're rare.) There are ways to tell whether Jack touched a page or not, but now's not the time to get into it. Suffice to say: if it's published, unless it's one of the things mentioned above, and unless it's on vellum, you're 95%, if not 99% in good shape.

 

Where it gets tricky is in unpublished work, and convention sketches. Kirby did a lot of such things and lately people have tried their hand at inking them -- lightboxing them -- either because they want to create a separate piece of artwork or because they are unscrupulous and hope to sell them at a massive profit. Before buying a piece of artwork like this, ask the seller if there are Kirby pencils underneath. You should really have a clear answer before buying. I'm sorry if the seller lies to you.

 

I'm sure I'll need to say more at some point, as there are always asterisks, and points of interest, but for now: no, Jack didn't require post-1975 pages to be lightboxed.

 

Glen GOld

 

[jeBailey]

Thanks for the info.

 

John