Signature on Interior Grading Question

[telerites]

I'm sure this has been asked before and I am search impotent because I couldn't find a thread.

 

I have several X-Men books from the 1980s that were signed on the first page by John Byrne. I'm assuming the signature does affect the overall grade and downgrades a potential 9.8 to lower. I know it will be tagged on the label but is the downgrading correct?

 

Thanks for any insight

[mysterio]

You should geta blue label, but I am not sure how much the signatures will ding the grades. Cool books!

[etanick]

signature on the interior won't hurt the grade. You are likely to get a note of the label about that sig.

[mschmidt]

signature on the interior won't hurt the grade. You are likely to get a note of the label about that sig.

 

That's not true - unverified signatures on the interior counts as a grade-dropping defect when a book is in a universal label slab. How much of a grade-drop you're in for is dependent on the grade of the book itself, and the size & placement of the signature.

[telerites]

signature on the interior won't hurt the grade. You are likely to get a note of the label about that sig.

 

That's not true - unverified signatures on the interior counts as a grade-dropping defect when a book is in a universal label slab. How much of a grade-drop you're in for is dependent on the grade of the book itself, and the size & placement of the signature.

 

Thanks, Michael. I knew it would get a blue with a label notation (given there is nothing else to make green or purple) but I kind of figured it would affect the grade. All the signatures are in the white area below the indicia, which I figure is the best place it can be as it does not interfere with any story or printing.

[faster friends]

I have a blue label Moon Knight #1 9.8 signed by Bill on the 1st page.

[etanick]

I have a blue label Moon Knight #1 9.8 signed by Bill on the 1st page.

+1

 

I have a book I bought at a con back in the early 80's with Byrne there and I had him singed the book on the first page. I sub the book back in 2009 so I too will say whoever think it does hurt isn't entirely correct.

 

I stand by what I have.

 

I have a few other slabs that I feel is fairly graded with notes about signatures on the 1st page. Not once did I think the book was graded harshly from that signature.

[mschmidt]

I have a blue label Moon Knight #1 9.8 signed by Bill on the 1st page.

+1

 

I have a book I bought at a con back in the early 80's with Byrne there and I had him singed the book on the first page. I sub the book back in 2009 so I too will say whoever think it does hurt isn't entirely correct.

 

I stand by what I have.

 

I have a few other slabs that I feel is fairly graded with notes about signatures on the 1st page. Not once did I think the book was graded harshly from that signature.

 

I have 9.8s as well with unverified signatures on the interior.

 

That CGC treats an unverified signature as a grade-affecting defect isn't up for discussion, though - it's a fact that's been confirmed by CGC numerous times:

 

If you have a comic that has an unwitnessed signature already and you have it signed again in front of a witness, it may be submitted for Signature Series for that second signature. The first signature will be accounted for in the grading and the second will be noted as a verified signature on the label.

[etanick]

what isn't also up for discussion is the large amount of books in 9.8 slabs with unverified sig inside.

 

it is what it is and the OP now know you, me, Fastfriends, and many others have 9.8 slabs with unverified sig regardless of what anyone say or believe.

[mschmidt]

You're missing the point.

 

Nobody is claiming that an otherwise 9.8 book with an unverified, interior signature automatically comes back with a 9.6 label, because how much an unverified signature affects the grade is another one of those CGC trade secrets that nobody outside of CGC knows for sure.

 

Saying, however, that the unverified signature doesn't affect the grade at all is wrong.

[telerites]

You're missing the point.

 

Nobody is claiming that an otherwise 9.8 book with an unverified, interior signature automatically comes back with a 9.6 label, because how much an unverified signature affects the grade is another one of those CGC trade secrets that nobody outside of CGC knows for sure.

 

Saying, however, that the unverified signature doesn't affect the grade at all is wrong.

 

The intent of my question is what Michael has responded to and perhaps I could have been more clear and simply asked if it does impact the grading. I see that CGC says it does but as to what extent is up to the graders.

 

Knowing the 9.8s exist with unverified interior signatures is also very helpful to me. I honestly did not know so I appreciate all the comments and help

[Boozad]

That CGC treats an unverified signature as a grade-affecting defect isn't up for discussion, though - it's a fact that's been confirmed by CGC numerous times:

 

If you have a comic that has an unwitnessed signature already and you have it signed again in front of a witness, it may be submitted for Signature Series for that second signature. The first signature will be accounted for in the grading and the second will be noted as a verified signature on the label.

 

I'm pretty sure that's referring to signatures on the cover Michael. It's saying pre-signed books can be submitted for SS if the cover is signed again in front of a witness, although the unverified signature/s will be factored into the grading. Whether that applies to interior signatures I don't know, but I don't think so.

[mschmidt]

That CGC treats an unverified signature as a grade-affecting defect isn't up for discussion, though - it's a fact that's been confirmed by CGC numerous times:

 

If you have a comic that has an unwitnessed signature already and you have it signed again in front of a witness, it may be submitted for Signature Series for that second signature. The first signature will be accounted for in the grading and the second will be noted as a verified signature on the label.

 

I'm pretty sure that's referring to signatures on the cover Michael. It's saying pre-signed books can be submitted for SS if the cover is signed again in front of a witness, although the unverified signature/s will be factored into the grading. Whether that applies to interior signatures I don't know, but I don't think so.

 

This applies to interior signatures as well, Gav :thumbsup:

 

If the second signature is witnessed then the comic will receive a yellow Signature Series label, but the original signature may affect the grade slightly (more so if it was on the cover of the book).

 

The quote is from this thread where Gemma is specifically asked about a signature on the interior splash page:

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=4176100#Post4176100

[Green]

Interior sigs usually wont affect the grade. But there are always variables such as signing with marker and having bleed through, or the creator pressing hard and causing punctures or dents in multiple pages etc. A nice clean unsmeared signature in the bottom margin in ballpoint pen usually will not hurt the grade.