A Shadow Speaks

[egambart-migration]

Hello Everyone - I suppose I have been what you call a 'shadow', and often visited the Board without actually particpating - Until very recently when I logged in to warn Board members about an Ebay scam.

 

Simply reading the posts over the last couple of years I note that the majority of posts are CGC oriented, either positively or negatively - And I've also noticed that those who are most positive about CGC can also be the most negative.

 

I have ben involved with CGC grading since their inception, and once told a now affiliate of Heritage that the "time would come when you would not be able to get a premium price for a 'good' book without it being CGC graded". To give you an idea of how early this was he told me I was crazy, and he "loved the smell of his Mile-High copies". He obviously has now embraced the CGC idea.

 

CGC are not infallible, and every excellent Heritage catalogue gives us the opportunity of detecting how infallible they can be, simply because of the number of books for us to visually compare.

 

Personally I am not a fan of the Signature Series, and in the past have avoided books with a signature, even if obviously the signature was of someone affiliated with the issue. I also personally think that if any collector were offered, for example an ASM 1 'Universally' graded 9.4 or a 'Signature Series', at the same grade signed by Stan Lee, that alnost 100% would choose the 'Universal' - In the past a signature on a book was considered a blemish. I also do not like the 10.0 grade, although as a businessman I understand the commercial value to CGC of the carrot. Perfection has to be subjective even with the most exhaustive of crtiteria. However this is a purely personal preference.

 

As far as the grading goes I have found it to be fairly consistent if I compare my early graded books with ones recently graded, although I must admit that Golden-Age books do seem to have been slightly more leniently graded in the early years.

 

I have noticed that in the main most attacks on CGC on this Board have been due to certain commercial decisions that they have made - Most recently the affiliation with Wizard. CGC was formed as a commercial enterprise - Have no delusions that they began out of lofty concern for the state of the hobby - I also personally think that they have managed to balance this commercialism with integrity in light of various hiccups which have been the subjects of lengthy posts on this Board - all of which I think they have weathered admirably - So much so in fact, that even if a credible competitor were to enter the fray, CGC would be very difficult to dislodge from their current number one position, and every commercial affiliation they make; like the 'Signature Series' and the Wizard affiliation ensures their longevity in one facet or another.

 

It seems to me that what alot of you would like, without actually spelling it out is CGC to grade nothing but 'older' books - To do away with all speculative practices like 'Pre-Grading', which adds to turn-around times; To stick to Universal & Modern, plus obviously 'Restored' labels; to add a few more Steve Borocks rather than graders - I think every book still ends up on his desk for a second look - Adding another new grader just adds another person putting piles on his desk.

 

The strange anomoly here is that virtually every member on this Board is involved in the 'buying' and 'selling' of comics, and thus involved in the hobby for the same reason as CGC - trying to make a living out of a hobby that they love.......

 

Sorry for this lengthy post, but the bottom line here is that I guaranty, that on the assumption a grading service is needed, you will not get better than CGC.

 

 

"Walking down a lonely road I walk in fear and dread; and having once turned round turn round no more my head - because I know that close behind a fearful fiend doth tread" - E A Poe

[joe_collector]

The strange anomoly here is that virtually every member on this Board is involved in the 'buying' and 'selling' of comics, and thus involved in the hobby for the same reason as CGC - trying to make a living out of a hobby that they love.......

 

What the are you talking about?

 

Oh yeah, and Welcome to the Boards!

[OldGuy]

Oooooooook. Welcome to the boards.

[drbanner]

Welcome (back) to the boards, a tribute!

 

Welcome back,

Your dreams were your ticket out.

 

Welcome back,

To that same old place that you laughed about.

 

Well the names have all changed since you hung around,

But those dreams have remained and they're turned around.

 

Who'd have thought they'd lead ya (Who'd have thought they'd lead ya)

Here where we need ya (Here where we need ya)

 

Yeah we tease him a lot cause we've hot him on the spot, welcome back,

Welcome back, welcome back, welcome back.

[AlexH]

Personally I am not a fan of the Signature Series, and in the past have avoided books with a signature, even if obviously the signature was of someone affiliated with the issue. I also personally think that if any collector were offered, for example an ASM 1 'Universally' graded 9.4 or a 'Signature Series', at the same grade signed by Stan Lee, that alnost 100% would choose the 'Universal'

 

What kind of an example is this? A SS copy of ASM #1 in 9.4 doesn't exist. How can you say that a collector wouldn't want it???

 

Here is an ASM #1 that has been signed by Stan Lee (as a signature series book), which sold on Heritage:

 

SS ASM#1 CGC 3.5 $3,220.00

 

Here are recent sales on Ebay of books in similar grade:

Universal ASM#1 CGC 3.0 $1,375.00

Universal ASM#1 CGC 3.0 $1,525.00

 

So basically the signed copy sold for twice as much as the similarly graded universal issues. Still think people would take the Universal over the Signature Series book?

[joe_collector]

So basically the signed copy sold for twice as much as the similarly graded universal issues. Still think people would take the Universal over the Signature Series book?

 

Bad example.

 

Those are extremely low-grade copies, and a signature on the cover has no impact at this level, and in the case of a SS Stan Less certification, would naturally sell at a premium.

 

I highly doubt you'd find the same price structure at the CGC 9.4 and up grades, as these BSDs are looking for pristine copies and realize that any writing on the cover lowers the potential resale or trade value.

[AlexH]

So basically the signed copy sold for twice as much as the similarly graded universal issues. Still think people would take the Universal over the Signature Series book?

 

Bad example.

 

Those are extremely low-grade copies, and a signature on the cover has no impact at this level, and in the case of a SS Stan Less certification, would naturally sell at a premium.

 

I highly doubt you'd find the same price structure at the CGC 9.4 and up grades, as these BSDs are looking for pristine copies and realize that any writing on the cover lowers the potential resale or trade value.

 

Since there are no high copies of this particular book that have been graded, it is a moot point. But it was the example originally given. Since most "keys" in high grades don't usually get SS'd, it is tough to say.

 

The most notable example of proving my point (that I can think of right now) would be the Cerebus #1 CGC 9.4 that will be auctioned off in June. I would be willing to bet that this will command a huge premium. We'll just have to wait and see.

[texasknight]

The strange anomoly here is that virtually every member on this Board is involved in the 'buying' and 'selling' of comics, and thus involved in the hobby for the same reason as CGC - trying to make a living out of a hobby that they love.......

Wrong !

I think you would find the number of people that are "buying and selling to make a living" on this board are very VERY few.

Most of the selling happens for one of three reasons...

 

A) - Tastes change, and what you may currently have in your possesion doesnt look nearly as good now as something else that had piqued your interest..i.e.

Let me sell this book so I can afford to buy that book

 

B) - Every now and then, we all need a little bit of extra cash (see my post in the marketplace concerning my Wolvie #1 9.8 up for sale)

 

C) - Upgrades --- Replacing your 9.4 with a 9.8 .. might as well get some money out of that 9.4

[joe_collector]

The most notable example of proving my point (that I can think of right now) would be the Cerebus #1 CGC 9.4 that will be auctioned off in June. I would be willing to bet that this will command a huge premium. We'll just have to wait and see.

 

I'd bet real money that if Sim auctioned off two distinct sets of these Sim File Copies, 1) CGC 9.4 pristine, unsigned Universal copies, and 2) CGC 9.4 SS signed/numbered/etc. copies, that the unsigned Universal books would sell for more.

 

As it is now, there's nothing to see, as the last I heard, Sim wasn't releasing any unsigned, CGC Sim file copies. Or am I wrong?

[awe4one]

The strange anomoly here is that virtually every member on this Board is involved in the 'buying' and 'selling' of comics, and thus involved in the hobby for the same reason as CGC - trying to make a living out of a hobby that they love.......

Wrong !

I think you would find the number of people that are "buying and selling to make a living" on this board are very VERY few.

Most of the selling happens for one of three reasons...

 

A) - Tastes change, and what you may currently have in your possesion doesnt look nearly as good now as something else that had piqued your interest..i.e.

Let me sell this book so I can afford to buy that book

 

B) - Every now and then, we all need a little bit of extra cash (see my post in the marketplace concerning my Wolvie #1 9.8 up for sale)

 

C) - Upgrades --- Replacing your 9.4 with a 9.8 .. might as well get some money out of that 9.4

 

Or D) - Selling because you enjoy it....

 

Jim

[FFB]

In 9.4? Yes. I would take the universal over the sig series every single dingle time.

 

Personally I am not a fan of the Signature Series, and in the past have avoided books with a signature, even if obviously the signature was of someone affiliated with the issue. I also personally think that if any collector were offered, for example an ASM 1 'Universally' graded 9.4 or a 'Signature Series', at the same grade signed by Stan Lee, that alnost 100% would choose the 'Universal'

 

What kind of an example is this? A SS copy of ASM #1 in 9.4 doesn't exist. How can you say that a collector wouldn't want it???

 

Here is an ASM #1 that has been signed by Stan Lee (as a signature series book), which sold on Heritage:

 

SS ASM#1 CGC 3.5 $3,220.00

 

Here are recent sales on Ebay of books in similar grade:

Universal ASM#1 CGC 3.0 $1,375.00

Universal ASM#1 CGC 3.0 $1,525.00

 

So basically the signed copy sold for twice as much as the similarly graded universal issues. Still think people would take the Universal over the Signature Series book?

[FFB]

Egggggsackly.

 

 

Bad example.

 

Those are extremely low-grade copies, and a signature on the cover has no impact at this level, and in the case of a SS Stan Less certification, would naturally sell at a premium.

 

I highly doubt you'd find the same price structure at the CGC 9.4 and up grades, as these BSDs are looking for pristine copies and realize that any writing on the cover lowers the potential resale or trade value.

[AlexH]

The most notable example of proving my point (that I can think of right now) would be the Cerebus #1 CGC 9.4 that will be auctioned off in June. I would be willing to bet that this will command a huge premium. We'll just have to wait and see.

 

I'd bet real money that if Sim auctioned off two distinct sets of these Sim File Copies, 1) CGC 9.4 pristine, unsigned Universal copies, and 2) CGC 9.4 SS signed/numbered/etc. copies, that the unsigned Universal books would sell for more.

 

As it is now, there's nothing to see, as the last I heard, Sim wasn't releasing any unsigned, CGC Sim file copies. Or am I wrong?

 

Hmmm, I think you are right. So that is also a bad example.

 

See if this makes sense (I'm generalizing here):

 

- the Universal 9.4 would have more buyers

- the SS 9.4 would probably command more money

 

[Kevin Boyd]

As it is now, there's nothing to see, as the last I heard, Sim wasn't releasing any unsigned, CGC Sim file copies. Or am I wrong?

 

Nope. He signed them all.

 

K