Illustration Art - Alternatives to Heritage

[Monkeyman]

I bought a piece in the most recent Heritage illustration art auction and was disappointed to note the following:

 

- Buyers premium is now 25%.

- No credit cards on orders over $2,500 in the US.

- 3% charge for international buyers using credit cards on orders over $2,500.

- Third party shipping required for anything that is framed. My quote from one of the three recommended shippers for a smallish piece (15" x 20" or so) was $165.

 

I'm thinking it is time to find somewhere else to buy, but Heritage seems to be by far the largest source. Any other suggestions for IA?

 

Mike

[pinupcartoonguy]

Depends what kind of IA you're interested in. As an example, Mitch Itkowitz always has a nice selection of IA, and there are a few other dealers that don't advertise online.

 

 

[Monkeyman]

I have purchased from Mitch in the past. Any names of other dealers would be appreciated.

[Monsterhoodoo]

http://www.tarabaillustrationart.com/

 

Fred used to work for Illustration House. He's in San Diego every year, and generally brings some nice things. I bought a nice Booth from him one year, and a Kley another.

[Monkeyman]

I have noticed ads in Illustration magazine for Streamline Illustrations (Leo Brereton, leostreamline@sbcglobal.net). He says he specializes in original art noir illustrations for pulps, paperbacks and adventure magazines. Has anyone dealt with him?

 

Mike

[pinupcartoonguy]

I have. He exhibits in S.D. every year. He's first rate.

[artdealer]

Unfortunately, Leo will no longer be exhibiting at San Diego, and no longer advertising in Illustration Mag.

MI

[tth2]

I bought a piece in the most recent Heritage illustration art auction and was disappointed to note the following:

 

- Buyers premium is now 25%.

Are you buying or consigning? If buying, why would this matter?

[alxjhnsn]

I bought a piece in the most recent Heritage illustration art auction and was disappointed to note the following:

 

- Buyers premium is now 25%.

Are you buying or consigning? If buying, why would this matter?

 

Q: Why would a 25% buyers premium matter to the buyer?

A: Because it means the buyer pays a lot more money. Admittedly, Heritage is good about telling you that when you bid, but it is a lot of money.

[Bronty]

uh oh, here we go.

[tth2]

I bought a piece in the most recent Heritage illustration art auction and was disappointed to note the following:

 

- Buyers premium is now 25%.

Are you buying or consigning? If buying, why would this matter?

 

Q: Why would a 25% buyers premium matter to the buyer?

A: Because it means the buyer, if he's mathematically illiterate, pays a lot more money. Admittedly, Heritage is good about telling you that when you bid, but it is a lot of money.

Fixed that for ya! (thumbs u

[Speedy-D]

I bought a piece in the most recent Heritage illustration art auction and was disappointed to note the following:

 

- Buyers premium is now 25%.

Are you buying or consigning? If buying, why would this matter?

 

Q: Why would a 25% buyers premium matter to the buyer?

A: Because it means the buyer, if he's mathematically illiterate, pays a lot more money. Admittedly, Heritage is good about telling you that when you bid, but it is a lot of money.

Fixed that for ya! (thumbs u

I understand the argument: "Just factor the BP into your max bid." If you're willing to pay $1000, your max bid should be $800 (with a BP of 25%). However, I would be very surprised if, in the real world, a high BP didn't result in higher prices paid, BP being included.

[delekkerste]

I understand the argument: "Just factor the BP into your max bid." If you're willing to pay $1000, your max bid should be $800 (with a BP of 25%). However, I would be very surprised if, in the real world, a high BP didn't result in higher prices paid, BP being included.

 

Agreed. It's kind of like the argument that stock splits shouldn't have any effect on market value, and yet, empirically, oftentimes they do.

 

In any case, the increase in BP has the effect of increasing transaction costs for the seller. If I am buying something that will eventually be re-sold, Heritage grabbing a bigger share of the proceeds is something that definitely concerns me and makes me want to bid on fewer items and probably at lower prices unless it's something so desirable that I won't need to use Heritage to re-sell it, or something that I will definitely hang onto for the long run. Unfortunately, much of the material in these auctions has a limited market outside of Heritage at this point.

 

Also, Heritage started the bidding on all the lots in this auction (or at least on the higher-priced lots I was tracking) at the low-end of the pre-sale price (which also happened to be the reserve), unlike their comic auctions where the bidding starts at $1. I felt that this stunted the bidding activity and, combined wtih the psychological hurdle of the larger BP and the very real liquidity and transaction cost concerns I mentioned above, these factors all conspired to make this last Illo. auction a bit of a dud.

[tth2]

Also, Heritage started the bidding on all the lots in this auction (or at least on the higher-priced lots I was tracking) at the low-end of the pre-sale price (which also happened to be the reserve), unlike their comic auctions where the bidding starts at $1. I felt that this stunted the bidding activity and, combined wtih the psychological hurdle of the larger BP and the very real liquidity and transaction cost concerns I mentioned above, these factors all conspired to make this last Illo. auction a bit of a dud.

They've always started their art auctions at an effective reserve amount, unlike the comic auctions. I think the main reason this auction was a disappointment was because the material on offer was pretty disappointing. I know that when I got the catalog, I flipped through it pretty quickly because nothing grabbed me. I think I put in a couple of token bids, and that was it.

[pinupcartoonguy]

Ditto.

[delekkerste]

They've always started their art auctions at an effective reserve amount, unlike the comic auctions. I think the main reason this auction was a disappointment was because the material on offer was pretty disappointing. I know that when I got the catalog, I flipped through it pretty quickly because nothing grabbed me. I think I put in a couple of token bids, and that was it.

 

Actually, neither of us is correct. Looking at the catalog, it looks like they normally start their art auctions at half of the low estimate so some momentum builds up to the reserve price. BUT, some of the estimates were more aggressive in this sale (e.g., 2 of the Elvgrens were $40-$60K and another 2 were $50-$75K, while an inferior Miss Sylvania example carried the usual Heritage $30-$40K Elvgren estimate). Usually, I just throw in a token bid amount so the lot appears on the "MyBids" page, but this time the starting bids were high enough that I only placed a bid on 1 lot that had a low estimate and tracked the rest of the auction on the "MyTrackedLots" page.

 

I agree that it was not an impressive offering, but I do think that the aggressive reserve prices/starting bid levels and the psychological impact of the increased BP (and very real liquidity implications of such) also played a role.

[tth2]

They've always started their art auctions at an effective reserve amount, unlike the comic auctions. I think the main reason this auction was a disappointment was because the material on offer was pretty disappointing. I know that when I got the catalog, I flipped through it pretty quickly because nothing grabbed me. I think I put in a couple of token bids, and that was it.

 

Actually, neither of us is correct. Looking at the catalog, it looks like they normally start their art auctions at half of the low estimate so some momentum builds up to the reserve price. BUT, some of the estimates were more aggressive in this sale (e.g., 2 of the Elvgrens were $40-$60K and another 2 were $50-$75K, while an inferior Miss Sylvania example carried the usual Heritage $30-$40K Elvgren estimate). Usually, I just throw in a token bid amount so the lot appears on the "MyBids" page, but this time the starting bids were high enough that I only placed a bid on 1 lot that had a low estimate and tracked the rest of the auction on the "MyTrackedLots" page.

 

I agree that it was not an impressive offering, but I do think that the aggressive reserve prices/starting bid levels and the psychological impact of the increased BP (and very real liquidity implications of such) also played a role.

I never even think about the BP in terms of its impact on selling. I just assume I`m so skilled in identifying undervalued pieces that my gains will be so huge as to render BP impact immaterial.

[glenbru]

A great alternative is Dan Murphy's GRAPEFRUITMOON gallery.

 

http://grapefruitmoongallery.com/

 

Dan is a terrific guy and is willing to work with you. I had one of the best experience's working with him--he's very knowledgable, is willing to take time to help you find what you want and is willing to advise--a real plus for someone like me who just entered the illustration market. We talked a lot about condition, restoration, etc. In addition, the two paintings I bought from him, two pulp paintings form the 30's by Saunders and Baumhoffer, came beautifully framed and were packaged by Fort Knox. I recommend Dan wholeheartedly!

 

The Saunders...

http://www.comicartfans.com/GalleryPiece.asp?Piece=754802&GSub=113711

 

The Baumhoffer...

http://www.comicartfans.com/GalleryPiece.asp?Piece=764212&GSub=114885

 

 

Glen

[Monkeyman]

I bought a piece in the most recent Heritage illustration art auction and was disappointed to note the following:

 

- Buyers premium is now 25%.

Are you buying or consigning? If buying, why would this matter?

 

Q: Why would a 25% buyers premium matter to the buyer?

A: Because it means the buyer pays a lot more money. Admittedly, Heritage is good about telling you that when you bid, but it is a lot of money.

 

This is what I was getting at. Although the buyer's premium should be factored in by the buyers, I don't think it always is. A higher buyer's premium can also mean higher reserves as the seller wants to guarantee a minimum amount in their pocket. It also just seems to be getting ridiculously high and I am less interested in dealing with Heritage because they seem to be squeezing me for every penny they can.

 

Mike

[DStorm]

I have bought from Fred Taraba as well as Leo a few times and they are both great and fair guys. Good to talk to as well. I didn't realize that Leo wasn't going to do San Diego anymore. That's too bad. Is Fred splitting his booths with someone else or doing just 1 booth because he told me he would be there?

 

I'm not really a dealer, but I do sell some on the side. I don't get new stuff in very often but it's worth checking out my site every couple months. www.pulpillustrationart.com

 

I agree about Heritage. The high buyer's premium, shipping BS and lack of credit cards is a HUGE turnoff. Unless I am absolutely dying for something I won't bid anymore. It's a bummer because as you said they have the best supply.

 

Any more dealers out there??? I would like to know too.

 

Thanks!