Man caught with weapons at 'Dark Knight' screening

[Not*Sure*]

 

Also

Someone just complained on an AMC message board that they had a legal CCW and were in law enforcement and denied entry to a movie because of the weapon..BUT had a law enforcement officer with a weapon on his person been in that theater perhaps things would have ended differently I'm just saying..

 

AMC is also in some theaters confiscating backpacks,rucksacks and large purses from attendees ..some people are complaining that they have even offered to let AMC employees search their belongings and AMC says "Nope just leave it and pick it up upon exiting the theater" which is ridiculous..no WAY am I giving up my purse (even though I carry usually just a small wallet or wristlet) to some kid at the popcorn counter and expecting to have my money,jewelry,phone intact when I get it back.

 

Our local AMC has aslo instituted a rule that NO children under 18 will be admitted to ANY movie without a parent or guardian with them. No dropping of a 14 year old to watch a cartoon and pick them up later etc..weird.

[Tony S]

Also

Someone just complained on an AMC message board that they had a legal CCW and were in law enforcement and denied entry to a movie because of the weapon..BUT had a law enforcement officer with a weapon on his person been in that theater perhaps things would have ended differently I'm just saying..

 

AMC is also in some theaters confiscating backpacks,rucksacks and large purses from attendees ..some people are complaining that they have even offered to let AMC employees search their belongings and AMC says "Nope just leave it and pick it up upon exiting the theater" which is ridiculous..no WAY am I giving up my purse (even though I carry usually just a small wallet or wristlet) to some kid at the popcorn counter and expecting to have my money,jewelry,phone intact when I get it back.

 

Our local AMC has aslo instituted a rule that NO children under 18 will be admitted to ANY movie without a parent or guardian with them. No dropping of a 14 year old to watch a cartoon and pick them up later etc..weird.

 

I'm not doubting what you are saying, but it is hard to imagine a movie theater owner cutting their own throat (financially speaking) with the no one under 18 rule. I cannot count how many times I hauled my daughter and a van full of friends to a movie when they were all between the ages of 12-15. And they were often meeting up with still more friends.

 

Financial suicide....

 

As for an off duty law enforcement officer denied admittance due to carrying (concealed) his gun? Crazy. They should let him in for free....

[lizards2]

Also

Someone just complained on an AMC message board that they had a legal CCW and were in law enforcement and denied entry to a movie because of the weapon..BUT had a law enforcement officer with a weapon on his person been in that theater perhaps things would have ended differently I'm just saying..

 

AMC is also in some theaters confiscating backpacks,rucksacks and large purses from attendees ..some people are complaining that they have even offered to let AMC employees search their belongings and AMC says "Nope just leave it and pick it up upon exiting the theater" which is ridiculous..no WAY am I giving up my purse (even though I carry usually just a small wallet or wristlet) to some kid at the popcorn counter and expecting to have my money,jewelry,phone intact when I get it back.

 

Our local AMC has aslo instituted a rule that NO children under 18 will be admitted to ANY movie without a parent or guardian with them. No dropping of a 14 year old to watch a cartoon and pick them up later etc..weird.

 

I'm not doubting what you are saying, but it is hard to imagine a movie theater owner cutting their own throat (financially speaking) with the no one under 18 rule. I cannot count how many times I hauled my daughter and a van full of friends to a movie when they were all between the ages of 12-15. And they were often meeting up with still more friends.

 

Financial suicide....

 

As for an off duty law enforcement officer denied admittance due to carrying (concealed) his gun? Crazy. They should let him in for free....

My wife and I took the Concealed Weapons Training locally from the local District Attorney at the time, and the basic message was, don't bother with the permits as it just exposes you to liability..., and harassment from law enforcement, as you are flagged in the DMV records. We did not bother with the permits.

[3319comics]

Is there a provision in the law where off duty police have to carry weapons and enforce the law while off duty? Does this apply to firemen? building inspectors, etc? that they have to enforce code or put out a fire when they see it? Just askin to understand . Cause the Original article is praising the cop thats offduty doing stuff that he does while on duty but the AMC theater doesnt want any off duty cops in thier theaters>

 

What would have happened if there was nothing in the bag would the man have any legal recourse against the theater and cop? or what if it was just a regular guy, not a cop who stopped the guy and wanted to search the bag. Sounds like the offduty guy was just there to watch the movie and not an employee of the theater.

[CKB]

His story is he was just trying to help.....

 

http://www.latimes.com/news/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-batman-arrest-20120807,0,6641095.story

 

 

[Ares]

Is there a provision in the law where off duty police have to carry weapons and enforce the law while off duty? Does this apply to firemen? building inspectors, etc? that they have to enforce code or put out a fire when they see it? Just askin to understand . Cause the Original article is praising the cop thats offduty doing stuff that he does while on duty but the AMC theater doesnt want any off duty cops in thier theaters>

 

What would have happened if there was nothing in the bag would the man have any legal recourse against the theater and cop? or what if it was just a regular guy, not a cop who stopped the guy and wanted to search the bag. Sounds like the offduty guy was just there to watch the movie and not an employee of the theater.

 

The article Says

It was the bag that caught the eye of an eagle-eyed, off-duty police officer who was working security on Saturday night at a movie theater in Westlake,

 

So he was on duty technically

[shadroch]

No. An off-duty police officer working a second job is just that- an off duty police officer. He was not on duty. If he is not on the police departments pay clock, he's off-duty.

[fantastic_four]

No. An off-duty police officer working a second job is just that- an off duty police officer. He was not on duty. If he is not on the police departments pay clock, he's off-duty.

 

I think his point is that it was still his job to proactively look for people causing trouble. His authority as a security officer is different, but other than that, how would his role as a security guard have differed from his role as a police officer while standing there in that theater?

[musicmeta]

I don't care if the search was legal or not, that guy obviously was up to something.

 

Yes, why would you bring all those weapons to see a movie!? To protect yourself? C'mon! He was up to something for sure.

[3319comics]

No. An off-duty police officer working a second job is just that- an off duty police officer. He was not on duty. If he is not on the police departments pay clock, he's off-duty.

 

I think his point is that it was still his job to proactively look for people causing trouble. His authority as a security officer is different, but other than that, how would his role as a security guard have differed from his role as a police officer while standing there in that theater?

So do security guards have an arrest right or search rights or can they just ask him to leave ? I thought security guard working for the theater only enforce the theater rules ?

 

[fantastic_four]

So do security guards have an arrest right or search rights or can they just ask him to leave ? I thought security guard working for the theater only enforce the theater rules ?

 

I think anyone can make an arrest if they witness a felony: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizen's_arrest#United_States

[KingOfRulers]

No. An off-duty police officer working a second job is just that- an off duty police officer. He was not on duty. If he is not on the police departments pay clock, he's off-duty.

 

I think his point is that it was still his job to proactively look for people causing trouble. His authority as a security officer is different, but other than that, how would his role as a security guard have differed from his role as a police officer while standing there in that theater?

So do security guards have an arrest right or search rights or can they just ask him to leave ? I thought security guard working for the theater only enforce the theater rules ?

 

Being that the patron was not openly breaking any laws, nobody has a right to search or arrest him (unless he gave permission to search).

 

As far as I know, a business can refuse service to anybody.

[Ares]

No. An off-duty police officer working a second job is just that- an off duty police officer. He was not on duty. If he is not on the police departments pay clock, he's off-duty.

 

I think his point is that it was still his job to proactively look for people causing trouble. His authority as a security officer is different, but other than that, how would his role as a security guard have differed from his role as a police officer while standing there in that theater?

So do security guards have an arrest right or search rights or can they just ask him to leave ? I thought security guard working for the theater only enforce the theater rules ?

 

As it has been explained to me

Some security guards do (especially those who are armed/carry a firearm), in fact, have police powers over the property they are hired to protect. That means they are able to act as police officers on that property. However, to obtain that authority, the must be certified by the city/county/town and/or state.

 

An unarmed security guard, who simply wears a uniform, is unlikely to have any additional powers than a typical citizen. If you push them and run, you would be guilty of assault.

[fantastic_four]

As it has been explained to me

Some security guards do (especially those who are armed/carry a firearm), in fact, have police powers over the property they are hired to protect. That means they are able to act as police officers on that property. However, to obtain that authority, the must be certified by the city/county/town and/or state.

 

If his day job is a cop, wouldn't that be likely to automatically certify him in the way you're describing?

 

Either way, I guess we need to know exactly what happened between the guy with the guns and the security guard. The article does state he consented to having his bag searched, but did the off-duty cop ask him if he had a permit to carry concealed weapons, and if so, how did the guy respond? If he asked and the guy said "no," then that'd be a felony, and that should in turn give him the right to make a citizen's arrest.

[Designer Toast]

Is there a provision in the law where off duty police have to carry weapons and enforce the law while off duty?

 

Oregon is a strange state, as there is no mandate for full-time sworn officers to carry 24/7, but a reserve officer must carry at all times. Every cop I know carries all the time. I'm sure that some departments might have policies requiring their officers to carry off duty.

 

Any privately owned establishment/property that is open to the public can implement any rule they want. If they say no weapons allowed, then that's exactly what it means.

 

Next time you go to a concert or an athletic events, read the back of your ticket. Essentially, it is a contract that you agree to for entry into the event. Most also state no weapons allowed.

 

Then again, when has a law or a posted sign stopped anyone from doing what they wanted?

 

One more thing - when a cop is off duty and he sees something going down, he is obligated to report it. Department policy dictates if the officer is to take action or not.

 

Mike, your DA telling you not to bother with the permits is crazy. You're exposed to greater liability by not having a CHL and being in compliance with state law if you choose to carry. I tell people this all the time: The best thing to practice is avoidance when you can. If you decide to get the permit, I can put you in touch with the best CHL class in the state.

[hockey&comicsguy]

hockey&comics guy lives in Ohio and was bent about firearms. He did receive a strike recently too.

 

Yeah, yeah, Oil Can Boyd. You probably hit the notify button on me even though I was kidding with you. Sissy.

 

 

Anyway, this kind of thing doesn't happen where I live in Ohio. Along with the usual fare, my theater serves beer, wine, alcohol and sushi brought in from one of our local, upscale restaurants. I had a lovely yellowtail sashimi platter and a glass of Stella, topped off with some sweet, buttery, artery-clogging popcorn during my DKR experience.

 

We don't let paranoid crazies live in my town. And we certainly don't let them carry their guns into any privately owned business.

 

This guy was "afraid of going to the movies" and needed protection. My advice, move somewhere nicer.

[lizards2]

hockey&comics guy lives in Ohio and was bent about firearms. He did receive a strike recently too.

 

Yeah, yeah, Oil Can Boyd. You probably hit the notify button on me even though I was kidding with you. Sissy.

 

 

Anyway, this kind of thing doesn't happen where I live in Ohio. Along with the usual fare, my theater serves beer, wine, alcohol and sushi brought in from one of our local, upscale restaurants. I had a lovely yellowtail sashimi platter and a glass of Stella, topped off with some sweet, buttery, artery-clogging popcorn during my DKR experience.

 

We don't let paranoid crazies live in my town. And we certainly don't let them carry their guns into any privately owned business.

 

This guy was "afraid of going to the movies" and needed protection. My advice, move somewhere nicer.

Nice bit of elitism here. Gun control laws in this country have their roots in keeping weapons out of the hands of freed slaves. Many people, especially the poor, really don't have control over where they live - they are born there - without the support network or $ to improve their condition.

[hockey&comicsguy]

Nice bit of elitism here. Gun control laws in this country have their roots in keeping weapons out of the hands of freed slaves. Many people, especially the poor, really don't have control over where they live - they are born there - without the support network or $ to improve their condition.

 

You caught the snarky, elitism. Fantastic, that was exactly what I was going for. (thumbs u

[lizards2]

Is there a provision in the law where off duty police have to carry weapons and enforce the law while off duty?

 

Oregon is a strange state, as there is no mandate for full-time sworn officers to carry 24/7, but a reserve officer must carry at all times. Every cop I know carries all the time. I'm sure that some departments might have policies requiring their officers to carry off duty.

 

Any privately owned establishment/property that is open to the public can implement any rule they want. If they say no weapons allowed, then that's exactly what it means.

 

Next time you go to a concert or an athletic events, read the back of your ticket. Essentially, it is a contract that you agree to for entry into the event. Most also state no weapons allowed.

 

Then again, when has a law or a posted sign stopped anyone from doing what they wanted?

 

One more thing - when a cop is off duty and he sees something going down, he is obligated to report it. Department policy dictates if the officer is to take action or not.

 

Mike, your DA telling you not to bother with the permits is crazy. You're exposed to greater liability by not having a CHL and being in compliance with state law if you choose to carry. I tell people this all the time: The best thing to practice is avoidance when you can. If you decide to get the permit, I can put you in touch with the best CHL class in the state.

Well, I already had the class. My personal and social experiences, as well as from working with LE over the past 20 years, is that the occupation has more nut jobs, criminals and sexual predators than the general population. So no, I don't trust the average cop. To be fair, the DAs office has been filled with similar characters as well - we're in the process of flushing one right now.

[InvstmntComcSuply]

Is there a provision in the law where off duty police have to carry weapons and enforce the law while off duty?

 

Oregon is a strange state, as there is no mandate for full-time sworn officers to carry 24/7, but a reserve officer must carry at all times. Every cop I know carries all the time. I'm sure that some departments might have policies requiring their officers to carry off duty.

 

Any privately owned establishment/property that is open to the public can implement any rule they want. If they say no weapons allowed, then that's exactly what it means.

 

Next time you go to a concert or an athletic events, read the back of your ticket. Essentially, it is a contract that you agree to for entry into the event. Most also state no weapons allowed.

 

Then again, when has a law or a posted sign stopped anyone from doing what they wanted?

 

One more thing - when a cop is off duty and he sees something going down, he is obligated to report it. Department policy dictates if the officer is to take action or not.

 

Mike, your DA telling you not to bother with the permits is crazy. You're exposed to greater liability by not having a CHL and being in compliance with state law if you choose to carry. I tell people this all the time: The best thing to practice is avoidance when you can. If you decide to get the permit, I can put you in touch with the best CHL class in the state.

Well, I already had the class. My personal and social experiences, as well as from working with LE over the past 20 years, is that the occupation has more nut jobs, criminals and sexual predators than the general population. So no, I don't trust the average cop. To be fair, the DAs office has been filled with similar characters as well - we're in the process of flushing one right now.

 

I can understand your position in regards to LE, however all the stories I heard were that CC permit holders more given more slack than the general populace. Psychologically, the idea that a licensed gun owner is on the same "team" as the police, is more likely than your DAs position.