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Certified Collectibles Group (CCG) Acquires Classics Incorporated
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Started by bgraves-migration,

1,496 posts in this topic

gaz973

gaz973

Posted
Posted
So assuming the graders still won't know a CI submission from any other.

 

What happens when a $1000 CI submission does not meet the projected grade? There will be a strong incentive to, at a minimum "run it through again at no charge to see if we catch the graders on a better day" again, and again and ..... or even a CI employee directly inquiring from the graders "what will it take to make this a x.x?"

Hey, it doesn't need it to be someone important complaining about a given grade to get their book bumped up. A while back there was a guy who wasn't happy with the grade his AF # 15 got and he was complaining about it on the boards. After everyone telling him that he just had to accept it, they were proven wrong by the head of CGC taking it in for a review and giving it that bump.

 

If CGC have done that in the past for a regular customer, why do people think they'll have a problem with giving a bump to a book because Matt Nelson couldn't get the expected grade after a press?

A better question is, why do people think this wasnt already happening. If there is collusion between CI and CGC (im not saying there is) it started over 10 years ago.

Well, most threads bashing Matt Nelson have mysteriously disappeared. :o

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Green

Green

Posted
Posted
So assuming the graders still won't know a CI submission from any other.

 

What happens when a $1000 CI submission does not meet the projected grade? There will be a strong incentive to, at a minimum "run it through again at no charge to see if we catch the graders on a better day" again, and again and ..... or even a CI employee directly inquiring from the graders "what will it take to make this a x.x?"

Hey, it doesn't need it to be someone important complaining about a given grade to get their book bumped up. A while back there was a guy who wasn't happy with the grade his AF # 15 got and he was complaining about it on the boards. After everyone telling him that he just had to accept it, they were proven wrong by the head of CGC taking it in for a review and giving it that bump.

 

If CGC have done that in the past for a regular customer, why do people think they'll have a problem with giving a bump to a book because Matt Nelson couldn't get the expected grade after a press?

A better question is, why do people think this wasnt already happening. If there is collusion between CI and CGC (im not saying there is) it started over 10 years ago.

Well, most threads bashing Matt Nelson have mysteriously disappeared. :o

:ohnoez:
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MrBedrock

MrBedrock

Posted
Posted

Well, most threads bashing Matt Nelson have mysteriously disappeared. :o

Only because they were stupid.

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Green

Green

Posted
Posted

Well, most threads bashing Matt Nelson have mysteriously disappeared. :o

Only because they were stupid.

Yes, multiple instances of solid 'shilling' evidence by a major hobby player is stupid.
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MrBedrock

MrBedrock

Posted
Posted

Well, most threads bashing Matt Nelson have mysteriously disappeared. :o

Only because they were stupid.

Yes, multiple instances of solid 'shilling' evidence by a major hobby player is stupid.

Yes, stupid.

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Davenport

Davenport

Posted
Posted
Is it presumed that Classics won't "learn anything new" when they get a peek at CGC's secret grading criteria?

 

(shrug)

 

I have no idea. Matt was already pretty good at reverse engineering CGC's grading model (as many people are who handle a lot of books). I'm assuming they might learn more about the system.

 

I'm more curious as to why a thread stops dead when I post in it.

 

:insane:

Reading this stuff gets to be a bit much. :facepalm:

 

Okay, conflict of interest...

 

Heritage/ Jim Halperin ever have troubles involving collectibles-grading shenanigans? The answer's not hard to find:.FTC and Forbes article

 

Is he an investor in a comic book grading company? Apparently.

 

Who was used for the Heritage/Parrino 2002 Nic Cage auction? google books link

 

When PCS was nixed, who stepped in as CGC's marketing partner, filling the void? Scoop

 

What became of CGC's head grader? Senior Consignment Director at Heritage

 

And who's moving to Sarasota? Wall Street Journal

 

Individually every news article and press release can be spun away. But it takes some serious mental-gymnastics not to see a potential conflict of interest when they're taken as a whole.

 

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Green

Green

Posted
Posted
Is it presumed that Classics won't "learn anything new" when they get a peek at CGC's secret grading criteria?

 

(shrug)

 

I have no idea. Matt was already pretty good at reverse engineering CGC's grading model (as many people are who handle a lot of books). I'm assuming they might learn more about the system.

 

I'm more curious as to why a thread stops dead when I post in it.

 

:insane:

Reading this stuff gets to be a bit much. :facepalm:

 

Okay, conflict of interest...

 

Heritage/ Jim Halperin ever have troubles involving collectibles-grading shenanigans? The answer's not hard to find:.FTC and Forbes article

 

Is he an investor in a comic book grading company? Apparently.

 

Who was used for the Heritage/Parrino 2002 Nic Cage auction? google books link

 

When PCS was nixed, who stepped in as CGC's marketing partner, filling the void? Scoop

 

What became of CGC's head grader? Senior Consignment Director at Heritage

 

And who's moving to Sarasota? Wall Street Journal

 

Individually every news article and press release can be spun away. But it takes some serious mental-gymnastics not to see a potential conflict of interest when they're taken as a whole.

Fantastic post!

 

I like the part about halperin having to pay back 100k in scammed money at the age of 13. lol Hobbies are sweet.

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roastedbagel

roastedbagel

Posted
Posted
CGC has given me a bump before.. Mark H .. from a 9.8 to 9.9 on two books... and I am as average as you can get.. (granted..it was for Will to Power..but still)

 

I brought them in... told them I respectfully disagreed with their grade...asked them to point out the flaws..etc.. after looking at the book again..they agreed with me.. (two others did not get bumped..

 

 

wut

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Beige

Beige

Posted
Posted

There is an easy way around this.

Willpower.

Don't send your books in for the "CI" treatment.

Use other independant sources - there are loads around you know lol

If you want to press - then go to Tony or Joey and then get them slabbed.

Or go straight to CGC.

 

My issue with this is:

 

No word from CGC on their own ruddy boards to clarify any issues - thats very arrogant.

 

No attempt to decrease Tat's - thats very poor.

 

Don't trust CI - don't use them (shrug)

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batman_fan

batman_fan

Posted
Posted
There is an easy way around this.

Willpower.

Don't send your books in for the "CI" treatment.

Use other independant sources - there are loads around you know lol

If you want to press - then go to Tony or Joey and then get them slabbed.

Or go straight to CGC.

 

My issue with this is:

 

No word from CGC on their own ruddy boards to clarify any issues - thats very arrogant.

 

No attempt to decrease Tat's - thats very poor.

 

Don't trust CI - don't use them (shrug)

 

I think you have too high of an opinion of the power of people on this board. The basic questions you have to ask are:

 

1. Does this change impact CGC revenue in a negative way - NO

2. Will people complain about it and demand CGC take certain actions to make them happy - YES

3. Does CGC care about question #2 - see answer to question 1, NO.

4. Does this change impact CGC revenue in a positive way - YES

 

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drbanner

drbanner

Posted
Posted
CGC has given me a bump before.. Mark H .. from a 9.8 to 9.9 on two books... and I am as average as you can get.. (granted..it was for Will to Power..but still)

 

I brought them in... told them I respectfully disagreed with their grade...asked them to point out the flaws..etc.. after looking at the book again..they agreed with me.. (two others did not get bumped.

I'm glad your books got the grade (you think) they deserved, but being able to talk to CGC face-to-face to lobby for a grade change (and succeeding!) is sort of scary. :eek:

 

I remember the AF 15 episode mentioned above, and recall a similar discussion concerning one of Doug's HG FF 1's, maybe even one of the pedigree copies? If you can do it, Doug can do it, the AF 15 guy can do it, then dagnabbit, so can I! But Matt or Kenny walking down the hallway and banging on the door yelling "Haspel, get out here!"? No, 'cause that would be a conflict of interest, right? lol

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mschmidt

mschmidt

Posted
Posted
CGC has given me a bump before.. Mark H .. from a 9.8 to 9.9 on two books... and I am as average as you can get.. (granted..it was for Will to Power..but still)

 

I brought them in... told them I respectfully disagreed with their grade...asked them to point out the flaws..etc.. after looking at the book again..they agreed with me.. (two others did not get bumped.

I'm glad your books got the grade (you think) they deserved, but being able to talk to CGC face-to-face to lobby for a grade change (and succeeding!) is sort of scary. :eek:

 

I remember the AF 15 episode mentioned above, and recall a similar discussion concerning one of Doug's HG FF 1's, maybe even one of the pedigree copies? If you can do it, Doug can do it, the AF 15 guy can do it, then dagnabbit, so can I! But Matt or Kenny walking down the hallway and banging on the door yelling "Haspel, get out here!"? No, 'cause that would be a conflict of interest, right? lol

 

CGC has always allowed for reviews of individual books - I'm sure if you tried to do it with every single book you subbed, they'd politely tell you to *spoon* off after a while, but I've also had a reviewed book that was bumped up (and another one that was left as is). Sometimes CGC screws up on the grade :shrug:

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skypinkblu

skypinkblu

Posted
Posted

When CGC started using purple labels of death to id restored books, it gave those books a stigma. I'm with Bob-a-loo, if these books are now fixed in house, I'm hoping it will take some of the stigma away.

 

However, I have been thinking of how practical adding restoration/removal, etc to the CGC menu will be.

Kenny's work is amazing, but he's in Indiana...that means books are still going to be mailed to him. I have not submitted books to Matt in a number of years...but when I did, the time frame rivaled CGC's present timing problems and out did them.

The work Kenny does is very time consuming. What if MORE people want this service now that it's going to be offered by CGC....how is this going to effect timeframes?

 

I know that I had books take 6 months or more just for some fairly minor restoration...nothing that would

even come close to EP and at least one friend had books being worked on for a year or more.

We could be talking years...and if they add new people, they'd need an extensive amount of training, or they would not be up to the work that Matt or Kenny could perform.

 

I wonder about books being sent in and coming back in a few years. :shrug:

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