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February Heritage Auctions (holy cow)!

Started by dem1138,

107 posts in this topic

Bronty

Bronty

Posted
Posted

Your last paragraph especially is well put. I'm not sure it's A+ in my book, but certainly A and certainly at a level where its desirable enough that the price just boils down to the dollars in play more than how good the piece is - its good enough... to loosely paraphrase your thoughts.

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Mephisto

Mephisto

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I don't understand how ASM 121 and ASM 122 would be art vs. Nostalgia? They are both are Nostalgic. Thy came out a month a part. The Norman Goblin did remain dead for almost 25 years. That legacy there is very nostalgic. Aside from bringing Norman back it's not like you can say they didn't with Gwen either with their horrible retcons of the past 15 years. Gwen and Norman affair? Plus not like Gwen Stacey wasn't brought back as a clone. Sure you can make that arguement that her death changed Spidey forever...but so did Uncle Ben's death. Granted he was only in one issue and not a reoccurring character when offed. Captain Stacey was also off.

 

 

Norman's death also had a long lasting effect on Spider-Man. His long time buddy Harry foubd out that Spider-Man was Parker and would go on to become the Green Goblin for nearly 2 decades. I find it very hard to believe that Norman's death was nostalgic for many of you old timers. Whether it be off the rack or reading the issue during your Hobgoblin or McSpidey days. I don't hear many of you guys mention much about the stories once we get to the second clone years...so how much stock do you really put into comics once Norman even came back? Perhaps the nostalgia factor just hasn't quite kicked in yet because we aren't at the 20 year mark...Yeah that's it. Maximum Clonage did gonna be hot in a few years.

 

I don't know if it holds tire still but I always remember ASM 122 being a higher price book than 121. I never even bothered to own a 121. For me any time you have a villain on a cover it's usually going to be a more dynamic cover.

 

I think ASM 121 is significant because the death of Gwen represents the loss of innocence for Marvel and their characters, taking on a decidedly darker tone (ie Wolverine, Punisher, more deaths, etc.) and as such, is more important than the death of a villain (been there, done that)

 

Wow between the "spoon" filter cutting off the first portion of my post, my own mistyping from the iPhone, and autocorrect changing things, my intended post was butchered.

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Mephisto

Mephisto

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I

I'd say your argument still holds tire.

 

lol that's the 2nd thing I noticed after seeing the post was cut off. I just saw the word tire buried in there and knew I didn't use it in that post. I did go back and fix some of it including getting the missing portion back.

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delekkerste

delekkerste

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Between #121 and #122, the former is the more important issue of the two. That said, the #122 cover has the money shot of Gwen dead in Spidey's arms with the GG bearing down on him and the #121 does not. The #121 cover gets an A+ for nostalgia, but as for the content/aesthetics...well, personally, I'd much rather have the #122 cover or the #121 complete story (or, heck, even just the last several pages of the book) over the #121 cover when it comes to the best content featuring Gwen's death. When the #121 complete story sold 5-6 years ago, I don't think anybody thought the cover was worth as much as the story; probably not even half as much judging from conversations I had with people at the time (heck, some here still don't think the cover is worth as much as what the #121 story sold for back then!)

 

We're in the hottest OA market in history now, so who knows what the #121 cover will sell for, especially if two certain BSDs go after it. That said, if it sells for $500K, or even $300K, I can think of a lot of Spidey art I'd rather have at that price. I mean, if this sells for 2-3+x what twice-up Romita covers are going for, that just tells me that pricing has become extremely inefficient in this overheated marketplace. In any case, best of luck to the seller, who, by all accounts, is a great guy.

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Cyclops

Cyclops

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#122's cover "says" more to me then the #121. It tells a story all by itself. A story about the history of the character and the title, not just the issue itself.

 

I look at #121 and I think about #121. When I look at #122, I think about everything. What came before and what came after. It's probably my favorite cover and has been since I was a kid.

 

 

 

 

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comix4fun

comix4fun

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#122's cover "says" more to me then the #121. It tells a story all by itself. A story about the history of the character and the title, not just the issue itself.

 

I look at #121 and I think about #121. When I look at #122, I think about everything. What came before and what came after. It's probably my favorite cover and has been since I was a kid.

 

 

 

 

 

 

That's cool and I agree about the storytelling aspect. However, the #122 isn't going anywhere anytime soon and the #121 is going up on the block where anyone has a shot at it. I think that's why the discussion circles around that piece. It's what's great AND what can be purchased.

 

I think the cover to AF 15 is the ultimate cover that would be the greatest piece anyone could own in this hobby....but no one's got a shot at owning that cover, sadly.

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Kevin76

Kevin76

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When I think "Holy Grail" I think AF #15 cover, not some panel page or splash some poster picked up cause he knew the right people and worked out a deal for it because as a kid he used to pin that picture on his wall and fap over.

 

The 121 cover is pretty amazing because it was such a big event in the ASM universe and that death still stands. From a design stand point, it's not the best shot of spidey because you can't see his face and it's off putting, back then they used to the cover to hep tell the story and to create drama to pull a reader in, unlike today it's all about "Well make it pretty so we can sell posters" which would be why they did most likely did away with any dialogue on the cover cause word balloons disturb the cover art too much.

 

Let's not kid ourselves, the dialogue on the cover of AF #15 really helps impact the image.

 

I personally like the #122 much more but the 121 cover is historical and being the first part of a 2 part storyline makes it all the better.

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comix4fun

comix4fun

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ASM 121 = Mona Lisa?

 

Not even close.

 

Action 1 cover is the "Mona Lisa" Just about every man, woman and child knows about an Action 1.

 

 

 

Sigh.

 

1) I used it as an example of why the "Freshness Factor" is not relevant to pieces of great quality or that are iconic or ubiquitous to our hobby.

 

 

2) Here's what I said....

 

 

I agree that the "fresh to market" phenomenon that could hamper a lesser piece or impulse purchase will be a moot point here.

 

This might just be the equivalent of our "Mona Lisa". I don't care how much it's been seen or exhibited or enjoyed prior to the sale, nothing's going to stop bloody melee for the rights to own from ensuing it should it ever come up for sale.

 

Being that we're talking about this hobby and I used the qualifier "our" it's clear I was talking about how iconic, recognizable, important, and well-remember the piece is in OUR hobby. And I was talking about an actual piece of art, that exists, that can be seen.

 

I wasn't saying this is our Mona Lisa because it's the greatest piece of art. I made the denotation because the Mona Lisa has been hanging publicly for decades and everyone's seen it, but none of that omnipresence would stop a bidding war of an epic scale in direct response to someone ruminating on the possibility that the ASM 121 cover being seen in a CAF gallery for years might somehow hinder its auction performance.

 

I won't even go into what else might be iconic, recognizable, or important in our hobby, especially as it pertains to artwork that is long gone and may no longer exist.

 

It's amazing how many people will stop dead in the middle of a paragraph, when the very next sentence describes, in detail, the meaning of the sentence that preceded it.

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tth2

tth2

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I think the cover to AF 15 is the ultimate cover that would be the greatest piece anyone could own in this hobby....but no one's got a shot at owning that cover, sadly.

Surely the covers to Action 1 and Detective 27, and maybe Superman 1 and Batman 1, would be greater?

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Brian Peck

Brian Peck

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I think Action #1 and Amazing Fantasy #15 are the two most famous-recognized covers in comic book history. Most people know those two cover images , but the cover for Detective #27 isn't as well know and Batman and Superman #1s even less so.

I feel Action #1 for DC collectors and Amazing Fantasy #15 for Marvel are the two pieces of oa most people would want. These two covers are timeless even modern readers and collectors know it and many would want to own if they have the finances.

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comix4fun

comix4fun

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I think the cover to AF 15 is the ultimate cover that would be the greatest piece anyone could own in this hobby....but no one's got a shot at owning that cover, sadly.

Surely the covers to Action 1 and Detective 27, and maybe Superman 1 and Batman 1, would be greater?

 

 

 

It's all personal. In many aspects of pop-culture, significance and relevance Spider-Man has bypassed the the "Big 2" and did so long ago.

 

My point was, it's moot (as it it pertains to my comment about how clearly and publicly displayed pieces are don't necessarily impact sales price) that how great or important those covers are, being that they either don't exist or have never been on the market for anyone to see, appreciate, or purchase.

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Bronty

Bronty

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I think the cover to AF 15 is the ultimate cover that would be the greatest piece anyone could own in this hobby....but no one's got a shot at owning that cover, sadly.

Surely the covers to Action 1 and Detective 27, and maybe Superman 1 and Batman 1, would be greater?

 

I agree with the "its all personal" sentiment but at the same time to me AF15 is a pretty clear choice. The first appearance of probably the most popular character in comics history drawn by the #1 comic artist of all time? That's tough to beat

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jjonahjameson1

jjonahjameson1

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I think the cover to AF 15 is the ultimate cover that would be the greatest piece anyone could own in this hobby....but no one's got a shot at owning that cover, sadly.

Surely the covers to Action 1 and Detective 27, and maybe Superman 1 and Batman 1, would be greater?

 

Not to most people born after 1970. Spidey is king and AF15 resonates with the masses.

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tth2

tth2

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I think the cover to AF 15 is the ultimate cover that would be the greatest piece anyone could own in this hobby....but no one's got a shot at owning that cover, sadly.

Surely the covers to Action 1 and Detective 27, and maybe Superman 1 and Batman 1, would be greater?

 

I agree with the "its all personal" sentiment but at the same time to me AF15 is a pretty clear choice. The first appearance of probably the most popular character in comics history drawn by the #1 comic artist of all time? That's tough to beat

I would much rather own the cover of Action 1. Detective 27, not so much.

 

I think the market would side with me too, as I imagine the cover of Action 1 would go for much more than AF 15.

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Bronty

Bronty

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The action 1 cover would be incredibly cool and certainly would be my pick of all the golden age covers, but I'm not so sure AF15 wouldn't go for more. We'll never know the answer anyways so its a moot point.

 

I agree re D27.

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