CGC Acquires Classics Inc - Response to your Questions

[Theagenes]

You laugh, but I was using it in my office for a month before we found out we were supposed to get a permit from the state Dept. of Health.

 

Hmmm. That might put a glitch into the whole cost-of-operation plan. You're going to have to pay your staffers a lot if using the device is going to shorten their lifespans!

 

 

Those permits are meant to ensure it is used properly. It's no different a precaution than making sure laser devices used to identify fakes don't get into the hands of kids who think it's could be fun to shine it in each their eyes. Not to mention that the primary reason why devices exist is for the purpose of detecting the presence of chemicals far more harmful to human health than any harm from use during testing.

 

Exactly. It's basically CYA to insure the person using it is trained properly.

[brendanb438]

Oh, nice edit.

 

And you even remembered to pretend it hadn't been edited.

 

There you go, I changed it back just for you. So know you now. Or is that now you know. Oh yeah dang English language gets me everytime using now or know correctly when trying to criticize others. I see we both share that problem.

 

Also maybe you and Esq can be BFFs or something.

[batman_fan]

I just got through reading an article on thee transfer of trace amounts of silicone from release paper liners. The amount would miniscule and would depend on the brand of release paper, but it should be detectable by several methods, including the device I have. I;m really intrigued now and may try it out as soon as get a chance.

 

Being able to do that would be great! How does the device work? The dream would be to do it through a CGC case but that depends on the technique being used.

 

That would trickier because it would also be detecting all of the elements of the slab, but it might not be impossible.

 

The problem would that what you you would basically be looking for is elevated levels of silicon on the cover. This is problematic because there would already be a lot of silicon from the kaolin clay that's used in some glossy paper. You would need to build a database of signatures from non-pressed types of cover stock from different eras and companies, then likewise for pressed versions so you could compare the two. It might also be that there are trace elements in the release paper that transfer to the book during the pressing process that aren't in comic paper. That would make it much easier.

 

So how does it work, is it some type of spectroscopy?

[Theagenes]

I just got through reading an article on thee transfer of trace amounts of silicone from release paper liners. The amount would miniscule and would depend on the brand of release paper, but it should be detectable by several methods, including the device I have. I;m really intrigued now and may try it out as soon as get a chance.

 

Being able to do that would be great! How does the device work? The dream would be to do it through a CGC case but that depends on the technique being used.

 

That would trickier because it would also be detecting all of the elements of the slab, but it might not be impossible.

 

The problem would that what you you would basically be looking for is elevated levels of silicon on the cover. This is problematic because there would already be a lot of silicon from the kaolin clay that's used in some glossy paper. You would need to build a database of signatures from non-pressed types of cover stock from different eras and companies, then likewise for pressed versions so you could compare the two. It might also be that there are trace elements in the release paper that transfer to the book during the pressing process that aren't in comic paper. That would make it much easier.

 

So how does it work, is it some type of spectroscopy?

 

Yes. (thumbs u

[comicwiz]

You laugh, but I was using it in my office for a month before we found out we were supposed to get a permit from the state Dept. of Health.

 

Hmmm. That might put a glitch into the whole cost-of-operation plan. You're going to have to pay your staffers a lot if using the device is going to shorten their lifespans!

 

 

Those permits are meant to ensure it is used properly. It's no different a precaution than making sure laser devices used to identify fakes don't get into the hands of kids who think it's could be fun to shine it in each their eyes. Not to mention that the primary reason why devices exist is for the purpose of detecting the presence of chemicals far more harmful to human health than any harm from use during testing.

 

Exactly. It's basically CYA to insure the person using it is trained properly.

 

This post from 2010 is around the time I seriously started looking into the subject. If you think it's worth putting our heads together and having a go at this, I'd be game.

[mintcollector]

Maybe they can 'sticker' books that are deemed to be 'pressed?'

 

Or refuse to 'sticker' those books that were not deemed to have ever been 'pressed?'

 

Yes, I am being sarcastic...

 

'mint'

 

 

[Comicopolis]

 

 

But more importantly... look at all of the people here on these boards that don't want pressed books in their collection. They would all be sending their already-slabbed books back in to CGC for resubmission to discover which are pressed and which aren't.

 

 

 

I don't know if that number of people is that significant, and I'm willing to bet a few of those people like to say they don't want pressed books more than they actually care. I know for a fact there are those that say they don't want them but still press them to sell them for more money. Hard to have any respect for those guys.

 

I think there would be very few people send their books back to CGC. It would be a situation of "what I don't know won't hurt me." That would also put them in a moral conundrum about disclosure. Especially if they thought there is a chance of losing money. Sure there are those that would be righteous and stick to their guns, but most would take the hippocratic path.

 

Maybe there are still people who thing pressing IS restoration, but don't hate all restoration, just want disclosure. There is a lot of pressure from those who press a lot of books, and who have from the beginning, to make this a non issue, and they seem to be a lot more vocal than the other side, or sides....I guess I see 3 sides here, it's a triangle;) The original decision by CGC to try and make it a non issue had a lot of monetary thought behind it. The same as not disclosing one type of cleaning.

 

[comicwiz]

The running joke in certification is when something becomes too hard or unprofitable to detect, it's the next notch on the "unable to detect' list.

[namisgr]

It uses Raman spectroscopy. It's fairly expensive technology from the perspective of the comic book collecting hobby, and I doubt it could be used in a cost effective way. It would work, however.

[Comicopolis]

Oh, nice edit.

 

And you even remembered to pretend it hadn't been edited.

 

There you go, I changed it back just for you. So know you now. Or is that now you know. Oh yeah dang English language gets me everytime using now or know correctly when trying to criticize others. I see we both share that problem.

 

Also maybe you and Esq can be BFFs or something.

 

How soon is now?

 

And when will you know?

[namisgr]

The running joke in certification is when something becomes too hard or unprofitable to detect, it's the next notch on the "unable to detect' list.

 

One can only chuckle at a defense of pressing that lauds it as a benign process on the one hand, and one that few collectors care about, and yet on the other bemoans the prospect that identifying it on the CGC label or graders notes would place a stigma on pressed books and lower their desirability and value in the marketplace.

[Davenport]

 

So how does it work, is it some type of spectroscopy?

 

Yes. (thumbs u

Handheld spectroscopy is a fascinating wildcard to the whole shebang. Google poped this one:

 

Block Engineering LaserScan™ Analyzer

 

The LaserScan™ Analyzer, shown in Figure 1, is a revolutionary, handheld instrument from Block Engineering (Marlborough, MA) that can be used as an ideal tool for inspection of surfaces to detect the presence of silicone, validate its removal or chemically analyze the properties of any films on the surface. For example, it can be used by a production engineer to examine metal surfaces and provide rapid feedback for the presence of residual silicones on surfaces that are being prepared for bonding or painting.

 

 

[Theagenes]

It uses Raman spectroscopy. It's fairly expensive technology from the perspective of the comic book collecting hobby, and I doubt it could be used in a cost effective way. It would work, however.

 

Yep, that's the gist of it. Since I happen to have access to one, I'll run some tests when I get the chance see how effective it is.

[Comicopolis]

The running joke in certification is when something becomes too hard or unprofitable to detect, it's the next notch on the "unable to detect' list.

 

One can only chuckle at a defense of pressing that lauds it as a benign process on the one hand, and one that few collectors care about, and yet on the other bemoans the prospect that identifying it on the CGC label or graders notes would place a stigma on pressed books and lower their desirability and value in the marketplace.

 

It frequently makes me chuckle.

[batman_fan]

It uses Raman spectroscopy. It's fairly expensive technology from the perspective of the comic book collecting hobby, and I doubt it could be used in a cost effective way. It would work, however.

 

But if someone had access to the equipment (via a university), then the cost structure becomes much more viable

[Theagenes]

The running joke in certification is when something becomes too hard or unprofitable to detect, it's the next notch on the "unable to detect' list.

 

One can only chuckle at a defense of pressing that lauds it as a benign process on the one hand, and one that few collectors care about, and yet on the other bemoans the prospect that identifying it on the CGC label or graders notes would place a stigma on pressed books and lower their desirability and value in the marketplace.

 

Well, in fairness, it could be a completely benign process, and most people could acknowledge that, but yet still avoid books labeled as "pressed" because they'd be different than their other labels. We collectors are OCD by nature. Most restoration techniques are benign or even beneficial, yet that purple label book with a bit of ct is going to sell for considerable less than a comparable blue label book with a bit of ct, even though the actual amount of ct might not be very different. Is this rational behavior? No, but it the stigma effect can be very real even if it is irrational.

 

 

[gyro-1]

You guys realy think shining a laser at comics is going to be popular?

 

 

[Davenport]

It uses Raman spectroscopy. It's fairly expensive technology from the perspective of the comic book collecting hobby, and I doubt it could be used in a cost effective way. It would work, however.

 

But if someone had access to the equipment (via a university), then the cost structure becomes much more viable

Maybe someone at the nosebleed levels could take one in partial trade toward a comic book.

[Theagenes]

It uses Raman spectroscopy. It's fairly expensive technology from the perspective of the comic book collecting hobby, and I doubt it could be used in a cost effective way. It would work, however.

 

But if someone had access to the equipment (via a university), then the cost structure becomes much more viable

 

Yes.

[Comicopolis]

You guys realy think shining a laser at comics is going to be popular?

 

 

Yeah, but once people realize that it removes defects by using magic everybody will love it.

 

Disclaimer: Magic is NOT restoration.