CGC Acquires Classics Inc - Response to your Questions

[joeypost]

The playing field is no less level now that it was 12 years ago as far as I can see.

 

CGC has slowly and steadily tilted the playing field in favor those selling CGC books and away from those buying CGC books, it's not really that hard to see if you look at it objectively.

 

How so? The same amount of information is available to all people. In fact, you can argue that everyone is better educated now than they were 12 years ago when nobody know who CGC was because now more people understand what CGC is providing.

 

The eyes see what the eyes want to see I guess...so maybe it's just me that sees it this way. You know I used to defend CGC's policies and practices just as you do now (well, not quite vigorously ), but CGC has changed, and so has my opinion of what their role in this hobby really is.

I think the other non-in house pressers will be most hurt by this,as now CGC has taken pressing in house.

I mean before there were a lot of hoop n loops to get a book pressed, now I can have CGC add a press to it for full maximum benefit. Most people were on the fence about pressing,BUT that era is over,as this new move now legitimizes pressing.

If people thought we have a lot of modern 9.8s before,then they haven`t seen nothing yet.

 

Have you ever actually had a book pressed?

 

Pretending that it's been in any way difficult or cumbersome to get books pressed these last few years is ridiculous - instead of sending the books to CGC, you simply sent the books to a pressing company who then pressed & submitted the books to CGC on your behalf. How is that "a lot of hoop n loops"?

 

Companies like CFP will continue to do just fine - CGC might add a pressing checkbox to the submission form, but that doesn't mean the service will actually be cheap, fast or give you a 20% discount on your grading fees like most of the other services do.

 

You also seem to be under the misapprehension that the modern 9.8 market is driven by pressing - it's not; it's driven by people going to stores, grabbing 9.8 copies of brand new books off the rack and immediately sending them to CGC. For most moderns, a $15 pressing fee would would kill any chance of a profit.

 

Not likely Mike, it DOES kill most of the wiggle room if you are looking to flip a book. Everything that CGC/CI are now claiming to provide, I have been doing for years. Keeping costs down, providing quicker turn around times and actually backing my product. How does doing something in-house for 2 to 3 times as much now make it all of a sudden better?

[skypinkblu]

CGCs stance has always been to label a book pressed if the book/cover has been cleaned. It is part and parcel of that technique that has to happen. So I a book has had its cover cleaned ( you can tell if it has been done) then by the very nature of the cleaning the cover has to be pressed.

 

But I wonder if this still the case. Are there any new label examples of this or are they all from the eary years of CGC? "Clean & press" used to be a common phase in the old days before the widespread practice of pressing alone, like "bread & butter" or "salt & pepper." I would guess that nowadays a book like this would only say "cover cleaned."

 

I'm pretty sure my GL #1 says cleaned and pressed, and it's newer label (although I bought it at least 8 years ago), but it's in the bank and I don't have the time to get it right now.

[pickycollector]

Notes to myself:

 

1- I shall never buy any CGC book graded in 2013 or thereafter.

 

2- I shall never send any more book to CGC in 2013 and thereafter to be graded.

 

3- I shall consider selling my whole collection now before the whole comic book market crashes if I want to finance my Everest climb project.

 

4- I shall start piling Twinkies to survive after the end of the World on 12/21/2012.

 

5- I shall start learning MMA fighting techniques against zombies.

 

6- I shall stop reading too much General and pressing threads after taking an ultra-strong coffee on a Monday morning.

[originalisbest]

! Your loss. The world will continue to spin.

[Ditch Fahrenheit]

! Your loss. The world will continue to spin.

 

As will this thread.

[MrBedrock]

 

I'm amused by the previous XRF discussion. If trace amounts of release paper silicone are important to the hobby, can you imagine the amount of organic material left by smearing a piece of bread across the surface of a comic book cover?

 

You could use an XRF made by Mattel to find that chemical signature.

You could almost imagine a future where an XRF would be used to count and document the number of fingerprint signatures.

[Theagenes]

 

I'm amused by the previous XRF discussion. If trace amounts of release paper silicone are important to the hobby, can you imagine the amount of organic material left by smearing a piece of bread across the surface of a comic book cover?

 

You could use an XRF made by Mattel to find that chemical signature.

You could almost imagine a future where an XRF would be used to count and document the number of fingerprint signatures.

 

Yeah maybe we really don't want to know what sort invisible residues are on our books.

[Ditch Fahrenheit]

 

I'm amused by the previous XRF discussion. If trace amounts of release paper silicone are important to the hobby, can you imagine the amount of organic material left by smearing a piece of bread across the surface of a comic book cover?

 

You could use an XRF made by Mattel to find that chemical signature.

You could almost imagine a future where an XRF would be used to count and document the number of fingerprint signatures.

 

Yeah maybe we really don't want to know what sort invisible residues are on our books.

 

 

I see a whole new industry opening up here. One with defect maps and an exciting array of holographic stickers.

[Bookery]

CGC has slowly and steadily tilted the playing field in favor those selling CGC books and away from those buying CGC books, it's not really that hard to see if you look at it objectively.

 

A logical impossibility.

 

There is no such thing as a "seller" without a "buyer".

 

If CGC were "tilting" things toward sellers, that means the sellers are able to sell more books than before... which means buyers are buying more books than before, which means buyers must prefer the "tilt" as much as sellers.

 

If something favors a seller without favoring a buyer, then there will be fewer buyers, and thus fewer sales, and sellers wouldn't want CGC to "tilt" things in their favor, since it would actually hurt them.

 

 

[blazingbob]

The "tilting" I am seeing is that CGC makes it "harder" to sell their product.

 

There should be no "if, ands or buts" when you are selling a certified book. That was the whole point in the "grading of comics" in the first place.

[sterlingcomics]

I think the other non-in house pressers will be most hurt by this,as now CGC has taken pressing in house.

I've used both Matt and Joey to press books for me in the past, and I can assure you that I personally will never use Matt again.

Out of curiosity, why?

[sterlingcomics]

The "tilting" I am seeing is that CGC makes it "harder" to sell their product.

 

There should be no "if, ands or buts" when you are selling a certified book. That was the whole point in the "grading of comics" in the first place.

What are the ifs ands or buts you are referring to? Disclosure?

[sterlingcomics]

If people thought we have a lot of modern 9.8s before,then they haven`t seen nothing yet.

 

Looks like we are going to have a lot of people getting broken financially--referring to the sellers.

[Racer-X]

I think the other non-in house pressers will be most hurt by this,as now CGC has taken pressing in house.

I've used both Matt and Joey to press books for me in the past, and I can assure you that I personally will never use Matt again.

Out of curiosity, why?

 

Also very interested in why you would say this. I had one experience with Matt and have an opinion based on this one time

[Hibou]

I think the other non-in house pressers will be most hurt by this,as now CGC has taken pressing in house.

I've used both Matt and Joey to press books for me in the past, and I can assure you that I personally will never use Matt again.

Out of curiosity, why?

 

Also very interested in why you would say this. I had one experience with Matt and have an opinion based on this one time

 

[sterlingcomics]

I think the other non-in house pressers will be most hurt by this,as now CGC has taken pressing in house.

I've used both Matt and Joey to press books for me in the past, and I can assure you that I personally will never use Matt again.

Out of curiosity, why?

 

Also very interested in why you would say this. I had one experience with Matt and have an opinion based on this one time

Plan on sharing it?

[Boozad]

CGC has slowly and steadily tilted the playing field in favor those selling CGC books and away from those buying CGC books, it's not really that hard to see if you look at it objectively.

 

A logical impossibility.

 

There is no such thing as a "seller" without a "buyer".

 

If CGC were "tilting" things toward sellers, that means the sellers are able to sell more books than before... which means buyers are buying more books than before, which means buyers must prefer the "tilt" as much as sellers.

 

If something favors a seller without favoring a buyer, then there will be fewer buyers, and thus fewer sales, and sellers wouldn't want CGC to "tilt" things in their favor, since it would actually hurt them.

 

 

Ebay have, without question, tilted things in favour of the buyer. So by your logic there should be hardly any sellers left on eBay?

[mschmidt]

If people thought we have a lot of modern 9.8s before,then they haven`t seen nothing yet.

 

Looks like we are going to have a lot of people getting broken financially--referring to the sellers.

 

Why are we pretending that pressing hasn't been prevalent till now?

[comeaux]

WOW !!! I thought collecting comics was supposed to be fun !!!

 

Understandably there are opposing views and opinions on this topic.

 

I tend to lean on the side of it’s not a real big deal but then again I’m not as heavily invested as many here on this board (but well on my way to being) as I collect for the enjoyment of collecting but would hope at some point in the future there is some value to the collection to pass on to my son.

 

I just do not understand the continuous rehashing of issues that have been identified and discussed, it’s like this thread continues on and on with no new discussion, it’s beating a dead horse. The situation is what it is so if a person doesn’t like the new developments then just sell all of your graded books and get out of the hobby.

 

Besides … it’s Monday … isn’t it time for this thread to dry up and blow away so that we can all focus on something else that will destroy the comic collecting hobby?

 

Oh and I’m expecting the “Shut the Fu(k up noob” comment

 

[mysterio]

CGC has slowly and steadily tilted the playing field in favor those selling CGC books and away from those buying CGC books, it's not really that hard to see if you look at it objectively.

 

A logical impossibility.

 

There is no such thing as a "seller" without a "buyer".

 

If CGC were "tilting" things toward sellers, that means the sellers are able to sell more books than before... which means buyers are buying more books than before, which means buyers must prefer the "tilt" as much as sellers.

 

If something favors a seller without favoring a buyer, then there will be fewer buyers, and thus fewer sales, and sellers wouldn't want CGC to "tilt" things in their favor, since it would actually hurt them.

 

 

I completely disagree, and am not clear on how you couldn't see the logic of Banner's argument.

 

You do need a buyer to have a seller, but his point (at least the way I read it) is that CGC is arming sellers with a number of ways to improve books in ways that will not be disclosed on labels. This would put a book that was gamed up to a 9.6 on a level playing field with a non-gamed 9.6, and probably for a lower cost basis. Buyers are now forced to deal with non-disclosure when considering a purchase, as they cannot know what was done or not done to a book they are buying even if it has a blue label. Buyers who are aware of this playing field will have choices to make on whether or not to buy a particular book, but at the end of the day they will either have to decide not to buy a book with an unknown history, or decide not to care about the unknown history and accept the label as-is. (i.e. Just the sort of handwringing that CGC was supposed to prevent in the first place.)

 

Of course this has been going on for years prior to this CI announcement, and I don't see things changing much after the announcement.