Need some opinions on this JIM 83..

[JiveTurkeyMoFo]

I would like some feedback on a book I purchased recently. It came as part of a collection, and was the only one in the bunch that has apparently been trimmed (or has had any type of detectable restoration done to it at all). It is what would otherwise be a White-paged (F+ 6.5 or perhaps 7.0) Journey into Mystery # 83.

 

First off, a little background, I know the former owner pretty well. He assembled his collection through the mail in the mid 70s and I've bought many books from him, all with really high (White) page quality, and this is the first that has any hint of resto. Everything else from his collection that I submitted to CGC has come back with a Blue Label, so I am pretty convinced this isn't his handiwork. Which leaves me to assume the trimming was done a long time ago. BTW, I believe the bottom edge has been trimmed, not the right side (which measures the same as other Marvels of the era, the length of the book, top to bottom, does not).

 

Anyway, here is my question. Considering there is no Color Touch or anything else done to it, how does Trimming affect the value of a book? Certified 6.5s have been bringing $1,900 (their approximate Guide value) on eBay...so what would this book be worth? Does anyone think its still worth submitting to CGC to either confirm my suspicions (or even better, be proven wrong).

 

I'd appreciate feedback and insight. Thanks!

 

[comicwiz]

Anyway, here is my question. Considering there is no Color Touch or anything else done to it, how does Trimming affect the value of a book? Certified 6.5s have been bringing $1,900 (their approximate Guide value) on eBay...so what would this book be worth? Does anyone think its still worth submitting to CGC to either confirm my suspicions (or even better, be proven wrong).

 

I can't really offer any advice on pricing, other than the old "CGC-it to maximize your return" adage, whether or not it comes back blue label or PLOD.

 

I can however offer you some suggestions/ideas to help you arrive at making your final decision.

 

Ultimately, I would send this in to CGC. However, had I been in your situation, I might walk this over to a Chartered member who submits to CGC, use their grading analysis to confirm your own suspicions, or choose a convention site where CGC has confirmed that they will do on the spot grading.

 

Depending on where you are located, and whether there is LCS in your area that is a chartered member/submitter, you might end up saving yourself the cost of grading if the LCS also confirms that it is definitely trimmed. Maybe we have it too good in TO, but that is exactly what Peter Dixon from Paradise Comics has been doing for many years, and I'd hope that all other LCS's who are submitters would follow suit.

 

It is also worth a shot to get your hands on an exhibitor badge at a convention where CGC will do on the spot grading, get inside before the doors open to the public, (here's the part that I just know the CGC guys are going to love me for) and just ask one of the CGC guys nicely -- maybe even approach Haspel or Borock if their around -- to possibly give you their professional opinion on the trim. At that point, you can decide whether to grade it or not. The on-the-spot grading means that CGC will have their graders at the show, and having the exhibitor badge will buy you some time to make your decision, and hand in your book before the attendees rush in. You may still have to contend with the high volume dealers/submitters, but your still likely to avoid the heavy traffic that usually guarantees CGC will not take anymore books after the first day of the convention.

 

One thing I have learned about detecting restoration/trims over the years is that it really is one of those areas where the more you learn, the less you really know. And one thing I won't do is buy any book that I suspect is trimmed from a scan. I only generally like making a determination on trims when I'm holding the book real-time. If I'm still doubtful, getting a second opinion, or possibly just sending in the book to get a professional opinion goes a long way to bypassing the hassle of selling a book with more/less restoration than you might have been able to pick-up yourself.

 

I hope this helps and best of luck.

[qualitycomix]

I would guess if this book is trimmed and comes back a 6.5 PLOD that it's value would be in the $600 - $700 range. About 1/3 unrestored assuming no other resto.

[Mr. Zipper]

What makes you think it's trimmed? The scan doesn't show any obvious problems.

 

I have no idea as to the value, but sending it to Matt Nelson for a resto check is another option. It would be faster and cheaper than CGC.

 

It is a sweet book in any case. If a sliver has been trimmed off of it, it's unfortunate, but not the end of the world.

[1st-and-keys]

 

I have no idea as to the value, but sending it to Matt Nelson for a resto check is another option. It would be faster and cheaper than CGC.

 

 

If you don't mind could you give me some info on who Matt Nelson is. I have yet to submit any of my books to CGC (the delay I've read about is a major reason) but I do have a few high grade older books that I would like to have checked for restoration just to be sure. You can PM me if you don't want to post the info. Thanks.

[comicwiz]

I have no idea as to the value, but sending it to Matt Nelson for a resto check is another option. It would be faster and cheaper than CGC.

 

Are you sure about it being cheaper Steve? The last time I checked, a resto check from folks like Matt could run you, at minimum $50 (and my price is probably on the conservative side), without shipping and handling.

[comicwiz]

If you don't mind could you give me some info on who Matt Nelson is. I have yet to submit any of my books to CGC (the delay I've read about is a major reason) but I do have a few high grade older books that I would like to have checked for restoration just to be sure. You can PM me if you don't want to post the info. Thanks.

 

http://www.comicrestoration.com/

 

And the whois on the above domain provides the following info:

 

Classic Conservations

PO Box 600263

Dallas, TX 75360

US

Phone: 985.640.1161

Email: spectre52@AOL.COM

 

I'm pretty sure that's at least Matt Nelson's email, website and contact info.

[1st-and-keys]

If you don't mind could you give me some info on who Matt Nelson is. I have yet to submit any of my books to CGC (the delay I've read about is a major reason) but I do have a few high grade older books that I would like to have checked for restoration just to be sure. You can PM me if you don't want to post the info. Thanks.

 

http://www.comicrestoration.com/

 

And the whois on the above domain provides the following info:

 

Classic Conservations

PO Box 600263

Dallas, TX 75360

US

Phone: 985.640.1161

Email: spectre52@AOL.COM

 

I'm pretty sure that's at least Matt Nelson's email, website and contact info.

 

 

Thanks again Wiz.

[sfilosa]

Send it to CGC.

 

Send it standard (will take a month) for $49 (less discount). If it's not trimmed, they will probably make you pay more (the $79), which you will be estatic to pay.

 

Definitely worth grading.

[Mr. Zipper]

I have no idea as to the value, but sending it to Matt Nelson for a resto check is another option. It would be faster and cheaper than CGC.

 

Are you sure about it being cheaper Steve? The last time I checked, a resto check from folks like Matt could run you, at minimum $50 (and my price is probably on the conservative side), without shipping and handling.

 

For a book at this price level, Matt's Pro Screen service would be $40 (+ shipping) and I presume you could get it back in a few weeks.

 

[comicwiz]

For a book at this price level, Matt's Pro Screen service would be $40 (+ shipping) and I presume you could get it back in a few weeks.

 

Its that darn exhange rate (US - CAD) that's always throwing me off...

Thanks for setting that straight Steve

[JiveTurkeyMoFo]

I appreciate all the feedback so far. As for my level of certainty about the trimming, here is what I can tell you:

 

The Negative:

 

- Top-to-Bottom measures approx 1/4" less then other Marvels of the era. Also, if you look at other JIM 83s, you'll see that there are two horizontal lines of Bricks on the building that Thor is standing on. My book only has one...which brings me to the second piece of negative news:

 

- The book appears to be trimmed right along that missing line of bricks and the bottom edge is impossibly straight in regards to the wear evident along the rest of the book. If there had been more space in the grey area between the top edge and the JIM title, I might be inclined to say its simply a bad factory cut, but there isn't, so I'm not.

 

- Since I have misgivings, and a conscience, I am not willing to try and pass this book off as unrestored. Damn that conscience.

 

The Positive:

 

- The biggest thing that keeps me wondering about this book is the fact that I'm 100% certain any trimming would have had to be done a while ago. When I bought the book, it was still in the cruddy Robert Bell poly bag that it was stored in nearly 30 years ago. I'm confident the last owner didn't do anything to it, leaving the trimming to be old and (possibly?) a result of the manufacturing process? I've read several threads on here that allude to trimming on some 60s Marvels to have been done at the site of printing. So, is it a factory trim, or did someone in the next 10 years decide to trim the book before it made its way into the hands of the former owner?

 

Does anyone know how common trimming was in the late 60s through early 70s in the back issue market?

 

Sigh...perhaps I should just use my three free Express Submissions coupon and get it over with.