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My proposal for the End of the Silver Age/ Beginning of Bronze:

Started by Forbush-Man,

36 posts in this topic

Forbush-Man

Forbush-Man

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I know it's been discussed before, but with new members come great responsibility! Also there are some points to be brought up which deserve mentioning. Just posted this on a thread in the Silver Age forum, but thought I'd throw it out here to see what responses come about:

 

 

I agree with the concept of FF # 102 (last continuous Kirby issue) as a stopping point for Silver Age Marvels, as we were all shocked to learn Kirby had left Marvel to go to DC. This was truely the end of an era for Marvel.

 

I also agree that different ages take place at different times (however, the Silver Age does begin with Showcase # 4, but we're talking about Marvel's Silver Age).

 

Here is my slant on this; A number of things occur between June, 1969 and December, 1970:

 

 

The last .12 issues are dated right around June, 1969. Mort Weisinger retires from DC 1970. The release of the Overstreet Price Guide had a profound impact on the collecting hobby which can not be understated. Kirby leaves Marvel to go to DC and rocks the collecting community (this, too, can not be understated). Alter-Ego is revived with issue # 10 (first new issue since 1964 and first pro-zine issue). The release of two significant books about comics: Steranko's History of the Comics (Originally supposed to be titled "Stan Lee's History of the Comics") & All in Color for a Dime. Conan the Barbarian # 1 released 1970 & begns trend toward sword & sorcery/mystical thymes. The first San Diego Comics Con occurs( mini con, March 21, 1970 and San Diego Golden State Comic Con,August 1-3, 1970.

 

The 1995 Overstreet Price Guide describes the Definition of Bronze Age as:

"(1) Non-specific term not in general acceptance by collectors which denotes comics published from approximatley 1970 through 1980.(2) Term which descries "The Age" of comics after the Silver Age."

 

I, personally, have always contributed the end of the Silver Age to (1) The leaving of Kirby from Marvel (2) the rise in price to .15 per issue (3) Kirby's 4th world books released (Feb. 1971), which gives a beginning of the Bronze Age (and end of the Silver Age) between June, 1969-February, 1971. Just MHO.

 

Any comments? popcorn.gif

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BassGMan

BassGMan

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Sure, it's nice and neat to come up with one date that applies to everything, but with many ongoing series that ran from the 60s through the 70s, I think it is more realistic to designate a "start of the bronze age" for each particular series. May sound complicated, but in my head, for example, I don't care what the "rules" say, but take House Of Mystery. For that series the Bronze Age started with issue #174 dated June 1968. For The X-Men, the Bronze Age started with issue # 94 dated August 1975. So there! ------Sid

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Zonker

Zonker

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In general I go along with your thinking... but the first Kirby Fourth World was actually in Jimmy Olsen in 1970, so I'd back it up a bit to 1970 in general, with GL/GA 76, Fantastic Four #103, Conan #1 and Detective 395 (first O'Neil/Adams Batman collaboration 'New/Old Look' that drove a stake in the Adam West TV version, leading to the Frank Miller Batman, Tim Burton Batman, etc.)

 

Sid brings up the clear problem with this approach, what to do about the House of Mystery books in 1968/1969, which certainly were trendsetters for Bronze Age themes. Personally, I lump early HoM with other late-Silver Age precursors like Deadman, Steranko Nick Fury, Adams Brave & Bold. But that's just me.

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Forbush-Man

Forbush-Man

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In general I go along with your thinking... but the first Kirby Fourth World was actually in Jimmy Olsen in 1970, so I'd back it up a bit to 1970 in general, with GL/GA 76, Fantastic Four #103, Conan #1 and Detective 395 (first O'Neil/Adams Batman collaboration 'New/Old Look' that drove a stake in the Adam West TV version, leading to the Frank Miller Batman, Tim Burton Batman, etc.)

 

Sid brings up the clear problem with this approach, what to do about the House of Mystery books in 1968/1969, which certainly were trendsetters for Bronze Age themes. Personally, I lump early HoM with other late-Silver Age precursors like Deadman, Steranko Nick Fury, Adams Brave & Bold. But that's just me.

 

Good point on the Jimmy Olson's, Zonker. I persoanlly prefer the start of individual titles by Kirby: New Gods, Forever people & Mister Miracle,...but that's just me. That's the way I percieved it at the time I was buying the books from the stands.

 

For the most part, the House of Mystery line is reffered as Bronze Horror, so that works for me. After all, there is no ONE defining book for the Bronze Age.

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Forbush-Man

Forbush-Man

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Perhaps it would be a good idea for each person contributing to this debate to include their view of the end of the Silver Age/ Beginning of Bronze: we may all gain some new insight from this. 893scratchchin-thumb.gifpopcorn.gif

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joe_collector

joe_collector

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After all, there is no ONE defining book for the Bronze Age.

 

Maybe not, but similar to the Silver Age, I think there is one for both Marvel and DC.

 

And this whole "House of Mystery" deal is totally off-base, as that was simply a change in focus from the Dial H for Hero days into a more horror-based format. It's not like DC wasn't doing horror at the time, as books like House of Secrets were pumping out very similar content.

 

No way HOM 174 was an Age-defining book, and was just a shift away from the poor-selling Dial H format, into a comic resembling the other DC horror books.

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BassGMan

BassGMan

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After all, there is no ONE defining book for the Bronze Age.

 

Maybe not, but similar to the Silver Age, I think there is one for both Marvel and DC.

 

And this whole "House of Mystery" deal is totally off-base, as that was simply a change in focus from the Dial H for Hero days into a more horror-based format. It's not like DC wasn't doing horror at the time, as books like House of Secrets were pumping out very similar content.

 

No way HOM 174 was an Age-defining book, and was just a shift away from the poor-selling Dial H format, into a comic resembling the other DC horror books.

 

I didn't mean to say that HOM #174 was an age defining book overall, just meant that for that particular series I consider it to have changed into bronze from silver. Same thing with my comment about X-Men #94. Just two examples of a major change in a book that I believe are age defining to that series. But hey, that's just me. And be thankful you are not me. -----Sid

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joe_collector

joe_collector

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Just two examples of a major change in a book that I believe are age defining to that series. But hey, that's just me.

 

I understand, and all I was saying that I think a resurgence in horror and crappy sales of Dial H for Hero had more to do with the change, than any attempt to "do something new". If DC didn't already have a horror books out there, I'd be more inclined to see it as a Silver/Bronze transition.

 

On the other hand, 1970's series like Manhunter and Spectre were a result of the changing times, and a need to push the envelope.

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Forbush-Man

Forbush-Man

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Just put a poll in the Permanent Comic Collecting & Poll forum. You can choose any or all of the following:

 

.15 cent cover price begins

Kirby leaves Marvel, 1970

Conan # 1 debut

.25 cent Giant cover price

Kirby's 4th world begins

Overstreet Price Guide # 1, 1970

other factor(s) not listed in poll

 

Poll will last until Aug. 28th. You must vote to view results. Just FYI. 893crossfingers-thumb.gif

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Norrin_Radd

Norrin_Radd

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Just put a poll in the Permanent Comic Collecting & Poll forum. You can choose any or all of the following:

 

.15 cent cover price begins

Kirby leaves Marvel, 1970

Conan # 1 debut

.25 cent Giant cover price

Kirby's 4th world begins

Overstreet Price Guide # 1, 1970

other factor(s) not listed in poll

 

Poll will last until Aug. 28th. You must vote to view results. Just FYI. 893crossfingers-thumb.gif

 

Hello??? Green Lantern #76!!! (also Conan #1 and Kirby's move to DC)

 

All of which happened in 1970 .

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Forbush-Man

Forbush-Man

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Just put a poll in the Permanent Comic Collecting & Poll forum. You can choose any or all of the following:

 

.15 cent cover price begins

Kirby leaves Marvel, 1970

Conan # 1 debut

.25 cent Giant cover price

Kirby's 4th world begins

Overstreet Price Guide # 1, 1970

other factor(s) not listed in poll

 

Poll will last until Aug. 28th. You must vote to view results. Just FYI. 893crossfingers-thumb.gif

 

Hello??? Green Lantern #76!!! (also Conan #1 and Kirby's move to DC)

 

All of which happened in 1970 .

 

You had me at "Hello"! 27_laughing.gifshy.gifdevil.gifhi.gif

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hobbes

hobbes

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Not sure whether others would agree but I've always associated these "bordered" issuses with the Bronze age. Just my two cents...

 

Anybody have any idea why the bordered covers became popular during the 70's?

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