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"Violation of Intellectual property rights"?

Started by Darthdiesel,

223 posts in this topic

Darthdiesel

Darthdiesel

Posted
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Posted
Souns like a direct hit at pedigree confused-smiley-013.gif

 

I agree... and I can't imagine Doug is too concerned... I find it highly unlikely that as a lawyer himself he wouldn't have been aware if it was much of a concern. juggle.gif

 

The irony here is that if the target of ComicLink's ad is as stated, there is a big grinning picture of Doug holding his prized 9.4 FF 1 & 5 (?) right on the opposite page 27_laughing.gif

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supapimp

supapimp

Posted
Posted

Sounds like someone is all ticked off at the competition, and is using inflammatory (and highly illogical) statements to get their point across.

 

Very bad advertisement IMO, as it makes them look scared and highly unprofessional.

 

you're right, he no longer has a monopoly on the market. but that's what happens when you have poor customer service. foreheadslap.gifconfused-smiley-013.gif

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Silver Surfer

Silver Surfer

Posted
Posted
Souns like a direct hit at pedigree confused-smiley-013.gif

 

I agree... and I can't imagine Doug is too concerned... I find it highly unlikely that as a lawyer himself he wouldn't have been aware if it was much of a concern. juggle.gif

 

The irony here is that if the target of ComicLink's ad is as stated, there is a big grinning picture of Doug holding his prized 9.4 FF 1 & 5 (?) right on the opposite page 27_laughing.gif

 

Can someone post a scan of these pages for our viewing pleasure? OT- anyone notice the FF#5, 9.2 posted on Colmore's website?

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BronzeBruce13

BronzeBruce13

Posted
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I'm a little "tuckered-out" from the 'House threads and haven't posted here at the forums THIS much in a looong time, but I have to chime in on this one too.

 

I've been aware of this pending battle for several weeks after catching a "pissed off" Doug on the phone right after he received a contact from Josh's lawyer ordering him to "cease and desist". I've wanted to discuss this and see what everyone else thought too, but had no idea if I should start a discussion all things considered. Now that its in the open though, here's what I know and my take...

 

Simply put, to this point, none of the communications from Josh's lawyer to Doug (and now Doug's lawyer as well), which I've heard in their entirety, have specified anything remotely convincing IMO as to a violation of intellectual property. A consignment or e-commerce website "has to" show a picture of the product, list a price and possibly have a component for negotiating (bid/counter offer, etc.). These are all that have been mentioned to my knowledge in the vaguest of ways as to what is possibly violating CL's intellectual properties. I think its bullsh!t quite frankly. If there was any merit to all this I would think eBay would have sued CL long ago. This particular action smells of desperation and reminds me of big business tactics without substance that are designed to overwhelm a smaller/newer competitor with legal expenses to force them out of the game.

 

This is not the first time Josh has tried to "hold down" what he considers to be a potential competitor with what I consider to be unfair tactics. Although I never shared this publicly (just with a few people privately) I too have been on the receiving end. I was restricted/banned from selling, but not buying* on the new comiclink since its inception simply because I confided in Josh that I was working on my own site. Now he did not tell me that I was banned officially at that point, he just would not respond to my repeated attempts to create a CL sellers account and contact him until "I got the message" so to speak. When I confronted him on the phone he first said something to the effect (not a quote) "he was too busy to get back to me and had consignors with better books to address.. yadda... yadda". Then, 15 minutes later, he called back stating he was "less than honest" and said he did not allow me an account because of my pending site and felt I should list there exclusively. That also contradicts what I understood his listing rules to be. At the time, they said you could have books listed on your own site and CL at the same time, but they had to be listed at an equal or greater price on your site (like Archangels has recently done). Keep in mind, my site was not even close to arriving at that point and not going to be a consignment site. I can't imagine any non-consignment site up presently that sells comics that does not have, or has not had a percentage of friends books up too... as was my plan.

 

Out of perceived friendship, I shared my plans with Josh well in advance, thinking nothing of it. I made it clear my intentions were not to compete with him as a consignment site. It would not make sense anyway since we had spoken on more than one occasion of the possibility of me working for him at some point, in which case my site would not have come at all or ceased existing. I assumed I had his trust for these reasons and also because I was the one that alerted him to the fact that his new site became "uncloaked" during development, months before its arrival. That's obviously not something a person who was planning on being a competitor would do. They would shut up and gather as much info as possible to have an edge and try to beat him to market so he appeared to be the copycat and the one susceptible to a BS lawsuit. Some may recall that Murph (I think) discovered the uncloaking initially and made a post that generated little interest at the time.

 

The idea for my site initially, as some of you know, was to create one that allowed me to list my own products for sale/trade and also those of a small trusted group of friends and customers that included more than a few forumites at no charge. It was to be a closed environment essentially. The only fees I contemplated were a share of the operating costs which would have been minimal as I had friends that were donating webspace, web development, etc. It was supposed to be, and may yet still be at some point... a non-profit site designed to increase my, and a select group of friends' ability to reach more potential customers and increase our network. I'll admit after I was banned, I considered many other options and was also approached by an investor to become a consignment site... which I declined.

 

After experiencing all this, I expected that a lawsuit was very possible regardless of what I put forth and that concern was later reinforced for reasons I won't disclose.

 

Anyway, I encourage Doug to battle this to the end regardless of expense as I'm thrilled he's provided an alternative. Finally, I can list on a consignment site again. I rarely need to, but its nice to have the option. Currently, I've listed 20+ books there, sold several and have received strong offers on others. Doug's' customer service is fantastic and most of all "I trust him". I've convinced a few friends to try him out too. 20+ more books are heading for pedigreecomics.com soon.

 

There are more consignment sites coming and I believe you can expect more lawsuits. A couple forum members that have similar projects underway... better be ready. Competition was bound to come to such a simple business model. As Redhook said in regards to competition when it comes, you "adapt or die"... or try to win any way possible it seems depending on your ethics.

 

I expect I've made myself a target now and would not be surprised if at some point some clever cheap shots at my rep. will be hurled.

 

I encourage everyone to at least consider consigning with Doug. He's going to be out a considerable amount of BS legal fees just for trying to conduct an honest business... and any new business will help him.

 

Let the games begin... as it appears Josh has started an ad campaign designed to elicit sympathy and support... all for the audacity of legit competition to finally show up!

 

 

 

 

 

 

* for the record, I just bought a book from CL I had to have. I wonder if I'll get it now.

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namisgr

namisgr

Posted
Posted

Having dealt with intellectual property issues as a scientist who spent 13 years in the biotechnology industry, I can think of only one potentially legitimate legal gripe: trade secret. If another comic-selling web site uses knowledge to construct its auction software that could be construed as being the trade secret of another, then perhaps there could be legitimacy to the claim of "violation of intellectual property rights". More likely, though, is that the claim is an expression of sour grapes.

 

If a new high grade dealership brings more high end collectors into the market, then their addition to the fraternity of dealers should be greeted with favor. If, on the other hand, there are a finite number of high end collectors conducting their business with an increasing number of dealers, then the fear of "cannabilization" is real. My sense, based on the continuing remarkable price appreciation for ultra high grade Silver and Bronze, is that the pool of high end collectors continues to grow.

 

What do you all think?

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supapimp

supapimp

Posted
Posted

that does it! i'm officially boycotting CL. mad.gif please be prepared to receive emails stating in the subject "PLEASE REMOVE ME FROM YOUR MAILING LIST". acclaim.gif whining/crying over compettion is ridiculous, confused.gif if i were doug i'd file a counter suit for monopoly. 893scratchchin-thumb.gif

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Silver Surfer

Silver Surfer

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Posted

Doug has earned my vote as "the true gentlemen of these boards" and his customer service and attitude is second to none. That was enough for me to list a few of my books on his website. Given that he is a lawyer I'm sure he can call in a few markers from colleagues that specialize in patent/copyright law (if he doesn't already). This gives new meaning to the word "frivolous".

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drbanner

drbanner

Posted
Posted

Thanks for the post Bru, and stick around! 893crossfingers-thumb.gif

 

Legal mumbo-jumbo notwithstanding, I don't see how Josh has a foot, toe, or ingrown toenail to stand on...it's beyond silly. Think Circuit City tried to sue Best Buy for their websites (or vice-versa)??

 

(However, any cease-and-desist orders from your lawyers to mine will never stop me from posting the "Official DC Bronze Trading Post" one of these days!! mad.gif)

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Foolkiller

Foolkiller

Posted
Posted

The story by Bruce above is very enlightening. Somehow, I'm not surprised though, that Josh took the route of trying to scare Doug into subserviance.

 

I'm a little shocked though, considering that if it's just a scare tactic, and knowing Doug is a lawyer, I'm surprised he went this route. There's little if not no chance of Josh suceeding with this, and it's going to cost him a fair amount of money to get this suit rolling if that's what he chooses.

 

I have one or two friends who do IP work and I ran it by them -- most of them laughed at first, but one of them paused for a second and told me that the body of law was very tricky on this, and it's the mechanism Josh is going for here, not the end result of actual success. He's trying to wear Doug down because he's new and may not have the funds available or the ability to fight this suit.

 

Before I go ripping Josh to shreds, I think we ought to take a step back from this "mob mentality" rush to judgment. Bruce has a personal experience which should be very enlightening in the analysis... but before going off half cocked, hopefully more information, either from doug or josh, will come out.

 

However, I really, really hope that Doug doesn't cave, and that Josh is fought tooth and nail. As I said before, I think Josh and his lawyer are deluding themselves if they think they have a successful cause of action here -- but I'm betting that's not their goal. Personally, I'd love nothing more than a blatant statement that Josh does not own the market on this kind of site -- and competition will be allowed in.

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OldGuy

OldGuy

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Posted

Based on my years and years of knowing virtually nothing about intellectual property rights, never having done business of any kind with Josh or Doug and basically not having a clue what anyone is talking about here, I'd have to say.............

 

I love reading and collecting comics!

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drbanner

drbanner

Posted
Posted
(However, any cease-and-desist orders from your lawyers to mine will never stop me from posting the "Official DC Bronze Trading Post" one of these days!! mad.gif)

 

893scratchchin-thumb.gif Care to elaborate? 893crossfingers-thumb.gif

 

Jim

 

It's a joke...do you recall Bruce's sig line he carried for a while about an upcoming website with "trading post" in the title? Do you recall my sig line about an "Official DC Bronze Trading Post"? BB13 was a little alarmed until he figured out it was just going to be a post in the marketplace forum, but now I think I'm going to have my lawyers get after Rip for this post instead! mad.gif

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