Trading Post/PIF/Giving Tree Discussion Thread

[Meeklo]

Donkey #2 was caught selling books I gave him here in a sales thread. His justification was that they were being sold well below market value...

 

In regards to selling stuff you get from the PIF, you own it now so do what you want with it. But maybe wait more than a week, be less obvious that you're just poaching PIF and don't rub our noses in it

 

I know this one is about me.

 

I asked for 1 or 2 books, and you sent a lot more than what I asked for. I'm not complaining about it, it was extremely generous. But yes, a week or two later I ran a sales thread and I included some of those extra books since I already read them. I sold a set of 15 Deadpool books for $5 instead of asking what they were worth. They were given to me for free, I'm not trying to get rich off of them, but I was trying to get money for another book I really wanted. I know people like Oceanavkid had abused the PIF system with those Infinity Gauntlet books and I was not trying to repeat it. After tech got upset that I was selling them, I just gave them to the buyer for free, which should have immediately proved I wasn't trying to abuse the system.

 

I can see where tech could get upset by this but there some other things to take into consideration.

 

1. I didn't ask for these books, it may be different if I turned around and sold the ones I did ask for.

 

2. I already read them and had no use for them.

 

3. And I was selling them for another book I did want, so you could say these were used to achieve something else I did want.

 

I respect tech as well as I never had a problem with him before. It just would have been nice if he could try to understand what I was thinking instead of immediately jumping to conclusions and not give me a chance.

[vaillant]

So many people? Guy, who advocated? I think just a few, on single posts, and as you say, mostly out of ignorance.

 

Most of the new participants cannot be aware of past abuses, so it’s just fine to summarize them, but again I haven’t seen much "advocating" in the sense you suggested.

 

My personal "bickering" happened mostly with Harvey over that specific situation (and not even caused by that) and that was pretty much explained. Were you referring to some specific post by recent participants?

[vaillant]

And to be clear, the only criticism I made always revolved about the same point, probably because I am irritated by sarcasm as I find it always inappropriate, no matter what.

 

I don’t want to get back over and over again on sentences et al, but this kind of sarcasm:

 

The only reason I brought it up is that Claudio was submitting your application for sainthood.

[HarveySwick]

[vaillant]

 

No intention to keep running in circles, it’s already settled, I just wished to tranquillize Guy, as I believe very little people was thinking to actively advocate for the "donkey minded".

 

Aside from that, I never criticize attempts to reproach when they are honest and balanced – no one denies the content of the criticism, but there has been too many jumps to conclusions which are totally arbitrary, based either on personal expectations or single facts elaborated in an incomplete and unsatisfying way.

 

A good example is the case of the ASM slab quoted by Hokie: I would obviously have not imagined neither what the gesture meant for Ben, nor what it meant for Bird, but I would have not cared at all if it was a gift and then he sold it.

It seemed pretty clear to me that when he started, Bird was fascinated by the slabs per se, not particularly interested in one or the other, he just liked to trade original art and the kind of items he collects, and I do believe he never thought Ben could have been affectioned to that particular slab, nor fully aware of a potential value (be it monetary or sentimental, or whatever).

 

Again, I am not trying to simplify, on the contrary, things are never so simple, and no one is supporting bad actions here (I mean myself), just to make things clear.

[JAM_NYC]

If I can add my as someone that lurks in the PIF thread but doesn't participate, what keeps me from jumping in is the fact that the same group of bad actors gets to exploit the goodwill of boardies without repercussion. Sure, once in a blue moon they may get called out on it. But it doesn't keep them from claiming the next offering that gets their donkey sense tingling.

 

Swickles tried to rectify some of the issues with his GT thread, but the same problems seemed to surface, unsurprisingly perpetrated by the same group of donkeys. He seemed to put a lot of effort into that thread, and a lot of his free time. I can only imagine his frustration dealing with that nonsense. It must have felt as cleansing as dropping a 10 pound deuce when he finally washed his hands of that endeavor.

 

The idea that anyone would person_without_enough_empathy about Harvey, Tech (who routinely would accept pyrite and offer up gold ingots in the name of moving things along), Hokie, etc., for calling out the clowns that consistently ruin what should be a great way for boardies to interact and share their love of comics is laughable. I'll get off my soapbox now, and return to the shadows...

[techvoodoo]

So many people? Guy, who advocated? I think just a few, on single posts, and as you say, mostly out of ignorance.

 

Most of the new participants cannot be aware of past abuses, so it’s just fine to summarize them, but again I haven’t seen much "advocating" in the sense you suggested.

 

My personal "bickering" happened mostly with Harvey over that specific situation (and not even caused by that) and that was pretty much explained. Were you referring to some specific post by recent participants?

 

I'm not going to go fish through the last few months of the thread and find every example of someone calling out a PIF abuse and being told they are wrong, or mean, or negative, or causing problems. Even just a few, especially after being corrected and explained to what the problem is, is a few to many.

[HarveySwick]

It must have felt as cleansing as dropping a 10 pound deuce when he finally washed his hands of that endeavor.

 

I couldn't have articulated that sentiment any better.

[vaillant]

So many people? Guy, who advocated? I think just a few, on single posts, and as you say, mostly out of ignorance.

 

Most of the new participants cannot be aware of past abuses, so it’s just fine to summarize them, but again I haven’t seen much "advocating" in the sense you suggested.

 

My personal "bickering" happened mostly with Harvey over that specific situation (and not even caused by that) and that was pretty much explained. Were you referring to some specific post by recent participants?

 

I'm not going to go fish through the last few months of the thread and find every example of someone calling out a PIF abuse and being told they are wrong, or mean, or negative, or causing problems. Even just a few, especially after being corrected and explained to what the problem is, is a few to many.

 

Thanks, now I see better what you mean, I recall a number of instances. That is why I never spoke of "negativity".

These instances are generalizations, and in these cases generalizations are not good, as we have seen each case is a standalone situation (or most of them, I do not deny there are instances of "pure" abuse).

[vaillant]

The idea that anyone would person_without_enough_empathy about Harvey, Tech (who routinely would accept pyrite and offer up gold ingots in the name of moving things along), Hokie, etc., for calling out the clowns that consistently ruin what should be a great way for boardies to interact and share their love of comics is laughable. I'll get off my soapbox now, and return to the shadows...

 

That’s an important point "a great way for boardies to interact": if only one would realize the nature of some people's generosity, they would start to feel ashamed.

 

Ben, Harvey, Guy have all righteously criticized, but obviously each one has his personal perception and each criticism had slightly different shades (and righteously so), so I don’t think grouping people makes much sense, in any case: I appreciate the criticism but I also wish it to be as much healthy as possible.

 

I don’t think it makes sense unless there are "donkey secret societies", that’s clear, but again, how do you know for sure?

[revat]

on a semi-related note...

 

there was once a boardie named oceanavekid. He could not follow the rules of sales threads, he made misleading statements, he occasionally junk donkeyed the pif, most famously claiming he would read something he claimed, then putting it up for sale in the next few days for a solid attempt at profit. His antics to me always gave me more of a 'immature dim-witted hustler' vibe, rather than a criminal master mind, like the white guy crackhead in the first few seasons of the Wire.

 

For his final PIF, he claimed something moderately good (can't remember what), and offered in return, to get his VF/NM X-Men 212 CGC SS'd by Claremont at his local Convention, I think he made some bold claim about it being worth near $100 or something (don't remember).

 

Either way, I claimed it, but with a twist. I didn't want his drekky X-Men 212, I had an X-Men KEY (well copper key) I wanted him to get signed for me. So I pm'd him, sent the comic...then...POOF. He got a strike and a vacation from the boards. He never responded to me. Not that he got my key comic, not that he submitted it, nothing.

 

Then about a month later, he's back on the boards, pm's me: "I submitted it". THen a few weeks later.... I got the mothertrucking slab! In higher grade than I thought! With the Claremont sig!

 

I daresay that was his last successful transaction on the boards. He didn't do right by everyone, but he did right by me. And I think that's in large part to the 'pressure' placed on him by some of our board members, so thank you to those guys (and gals?). And thank you to oceanavekid, wherever you are, hopefully watching the Lego Movie with gijoeisawesome somewhere over the rainbow.

[Bird]

 

A good example is the case of the ASM slab quoted by Hokie: I would obviously have not imagined neither what the gesture meant for Ben, nor what it meant for Bird, but I would have not cared at all if it was a gift and then he sold it.

It seemed pretty clear to me that when he started, Bird was fascinated by the slabs per se, not particularly interested in one or the other, he just liked to trade original art and the kind of items he collects, and I do believe he never thought Ben could have been affectioned to that particular slab, nor fully aware of a potential value (be it monetary or sentimental, or whatever).

 

Again, I am not trying to simplify, on the contrary, things are never so simple, and no one is supporting bad actions here (I mean myself), just to make things clear.

 

You are dead on here. I was portrayed in this trade as someone who sought out the book and begged for it "to display". The truth is that I was approached by CAHokie who said he wanted to trade for some original art. He showed me that ASM slab but it was, and is, just another comic to me. He never said it was special or anything. Then after some back and forth he settled on a piece of art and I asked what he wanted to offer me for it. He came back with that slab and I said okay. I never sought out that slab, it was the only one offered to me for the trade and who doesn't love Spider-man, so I took it. I briefly listed it for sale in a thread but took it down either that day or the next. I guess he saw that but never conveyed any disappointment until yesterday but I cannot mind read through the posts. Only in real life and you have to be standing right in front of me.

 

As far as "littering my sales threads" with stuff acquired through PIF that is just untrue. I have gotten two pieces of OA and some slabs only through PIF (one or two came with some comics as well) and have never listed any of them in a sales thread here that I can recall. I delete mosy of my sales threads soI cannot check but remnants do remain in my test threads. I did trade away the first piece of OA but learned right away that was frowned upon. No one outed me on this, I volunteered that info and apologized as I was learning the rules. Same with that post about the VCC unearthed yesterday; someone (CAHokie I guess) told me that was uncool so I learned again. I have only attempted to even sell slabs once that I recall, and they were slabs bought by me with the exception of the one CAHokie traded me. None were from PIF.

 

I was never supporting the donkeys. I just don't let it affect me if possible; I gave freely and let the chips fall where they may. I thought the rules were working and did not see why that was not enough. I did not like all that negative energy in the PIF thread and unfortunately let it affect me as well. Misery loves company and I got caught up in it too. A few months ago I gave away a RAK to a PIF player and never even got acknowledgment that it arrived or a thank you. Do I think that person is a bad man...no. He just is busy or forgot or whatever. I assume he liked it and was grateful...not a donkey.

 

So, in wrapping up my PIF experience you may feel free to call me a donkey now though. I cannot let those items sit "on display" in my house with all the negativity now associated with them. I ate more medication yesterday for my stress-exacerbated health issues than I had all week prior. I let it ruin my family night as well. That is my fault and I feel strongly that negative energy should be eliminated whenever possible. I am putting them up at clink with one or two exceptions - e.g. Griff's slab will stay as there is nothing but positivity there. Same with 1Cools PIF I got recently.

 

I re-read all my comments from yesterday earlier today. Do I wish I just stopped after the first one or two....yeah I guess so. But the piling on of vaillant seemed unfair so I came out guns blazing. We all make mistakes. ALL OF US. But when I sit in church and during The Lord's Prayer the phrase "forgive those that trespass against us" and I think about the PIF thread I have let it affect me far too much.

 

Again, thanks for the fun 6 months.

[CAHokie]

I never said you were a donkey. You did leave out the portion of the pm where you said you wanted to display it in your comic room because Peter Parker is always welcome there. Thats ok though.... No big deal. Ad i said, it is yours do with as you please. If you want to sell it the day you get it because "you didnt realize how much it was worth" that is up to you. It was weird ypu evwn used my picture.

[Bird]

I never said you were a donkey. You did leave out the portion of the pm where you said you wanted to display it in your comic room because Peter Parker is always welcome there. Thats ok though.... No big deal. Ad i said, it is yours do with as you please. If you want to sell it the day you get it because "you didnt realize how much it was worth" that is up to you. It was weird ypu evwn used my picture.

 

The picture is bad form I guess, yes. But I felt you mis-characterized the trade. I still don't know what it is worth, I got GPA but haven't looked up the things I own too much. That is why I took it down from the sale, I don't need the money and I realized it was bad form myself, so I took it down. I said I wanted it to display and that was true. It remained true until yesterday as anyone can see in my journal...it was displayed proudly.

 

No, Boboset called me a donkey. And based it on lies or mistaken assumptions.

 

But I apologize for my role in riling everyone up yesterday. I don't want that negativity and yet subjected others to it, for whatever reason. That was wrong. I should have taken more time to express myself or just stayed out of it.

 

As vaillant said, I was initially just fascinated by slabs. That quickly turned into a desire for certain slabs, as you all knew it would. And that means the early ones, ones that were just cool but not especially meaningful to me, became expendable. hence the very brief attempt to sell the one I got from you.

 

 

[Bird]

"you didnt realize how much it was worth"

 

I don't know why you put this in quotes, did I say that?

 

I had planned on doing this via PM with you but saw it get brought up in public again so i addressed it here.

[Bird]

Looking at my records I believe I have taken 5 PIFs (it seems like more though). 2 OA and 3 slabs. Hard to litter a sales thread with 5 things! I have obviously responded with 5 PIFs and know of at least 3 RAKs and 2 times I added on to a lingering option (which in hindsight may have been a mistake if I was facillitating donkeyness, tell the guy next time via PM if that is the case.) Yah Boboset, I am a donkey on the gravy train, huh?

 

I swore to myself that I would not defend myself here, but I guess I am more vain than I would like to be.

[CAHokie]

"you didnt realize how much it was worth"

 

I don't know why you put this in quotes, did I say that?

 

I had planned on doing this via PM with you but saw it get brought up in public again so i addressed it here.

 

Yes, you said that but it has already been deleted or edited out. This is all that is left. Again, i know it is your book to do with as you want and not even worth much. Just the principle. Especially since it was put up immediately.

 

 

Here are a few slabs I manages to accumulate. s/h will be exact postage, or at least what I am quoted from home computer. I bought GPA mostly to get good prices for these but found out that it was no help for most of these due to low sample or no recent data.

 

$90 ASM 136 CGC 8.5 about 20% below 90 day GPA average

 

 

I love that cover!

 

 

[Bird]

"you didnt realize how much it was worth"

 

I don't know why you put this in quotes, did I say that?

 

I had planned on doing this via PM with you but saw it get brought up in public again so i addressed it here.

 

Yes, you said that but it has already been deleted or edited out. This is all that is left. Again, i know it is your book to do with as you want and not even worth much. Just the principle.

 

 

Here are a few slabs I manages to accumulate. s/h will be exact postage, or at least what I am quoted from home computer. I bought GPA mostly to get good prices for these but found out that it was no help for most of these due to low sample or no recent data.

 

$90 ASM 136 CGC 8.5 about 20% below 90 day GPA average

 

 

I love that cover!

 

 

 

I don't even have a copy of that for sale listing myself. When spidrvacc asked me how much the other slab he wanted was I had no clue what I priced them at because Ideleted that immediately when I took it down. But you saved it huh? You must have been pizzed. Sorry. Next time PM me immediately, although there probably won't be a next time.

 

Listen, you want it back? It isn't worth the aggravation or bad feelings.

[Boboset]

Looking at my records I believe I have taken 5 PIFs (it seems like more though). 2 OA and 3 slabs. Hard to litter a sales thread with 5 things! I have obviously responded with 5 PIFs and know of at least 3 RAKs and 2 times I added on to a lingering option (which in hindsight may have been a mistake if I was facillitating donkeyness, tell the guy next time via PM if that is the case.) Yah Boboset, I am a donkey on the gravy train, huh?

 

I swore to myself that I would not defend myself here, but I guess I am more vain than I would like to be.

 

You only insta flipped 1 of your 5 PIF's and you only managed to deeply offend just one person, who happens to be one of the most generous and kind boardies here?

 

So you tried to insta flip Hokie's item. You had it for sale here using the exact same photo he used. You had it posted for sale here for only two days? Funny, two days seems to be a pretty average amount of time for a successful sales thread to run. Claiming "seconds thoughts" within minutes or even a few hours I can buy. But two days? Give me a break.

 

Nowhere did I call you a donkey or mention a gravy train. Find that statement. You can't as it doesn't exist.

 

I did say you insta flipped offers and for that you call me liar. I guess I should have said "offer" and left off the "s".

[CAHokie]

I don't want it back. It was covered in donkey mess when I got it and it went out the same way. Its not valuable and not worth any hassle. I just want to point out that I was never going to bring it up again, you did. I only replied when I felt it was mis-characterized.