Why is Spiderman #50 value high?

[Spyder!]

GSX 1 is insanely important. If not for the fact that it's extremely plentiful in all grades, that book would be crazy expensive.

 

Is there another single issue with multiple major first appearances, other than Batman 1 and FF 1?

 

X-Men #1? Iron Man #55?

 

It's a fun question to think about!

 

Yeah, forgot X-Men 1. Also, FF 48.

 

Otherwise, I don't think there are a ton of instances where a single book contains multiple first-appearances of really important characters.

 

FF 48 !

 

I will spend the rest of the day trying to think of more... (obsession?)

[jsilverjanet]

I think that the comics also pushed him into a greater role (Civil War)

 

Honestly, Civil War basically discarded the characters and ushered an era of arbitrary takes, regardless of whatever happened before. Just take Peter Parker, Tony Stark and Reed Richards: these are quickly turned into something pretty much unrecognizable. And even Straczynski, which by himself was taking any kind of liberties with other characters (Spidey, Dr. Strange) but was pretty faithful on the FFs, he felt out of place as he wrote the Civil War issues.

 

It didn’t happened overnight, obviously, but you get the point.

 

you missed my point - I was referring that Iron Man was put into the spotlight as a major character in a major storyline, whereas before he was on the sidelines always taking orders from Cap.

 

I get that you dislike what the last 20-30 years of writers have done to some of these characters but I can't imagine maintaining the same types of storylines for over 50 years as society has evolved over that time.

 

:shrug:

[AGGIEZ]

GSX 1 is insanely important. If not for the fact that it's extremely plentiful in all grades, that book would be crazy expensive.

 

Is there another single issue with multiple major first appearances, other than Batman 1 and FF 1?

 

X-Men #1? Iron Man #55?

 

It's a fun question to think about!

 

Yeah, forgot X-Men 1. Also, FF 48.

 

Otherwise, I don't think there are a ton of instances where a single book contains multiple first-appearances of really important characters.

 

 

+ Action Comics #252 (Super Girl and Metallo)

 

+ DC Comics Presents #26 (Cyborg, Raven, Starfire, New Teen Titans)

 

+ DC Comics Presents #47 (He-man and Skeletor)

[Chip Cataldo]

FF #45.

 

FF Annual #6?

 

Peace,

 

Chip

[kav]

Agreed. Robert Downey Jr. Portrayal of Tony Stark was excellent. There is a reason why he was getting paid as much as he was to reprise and his fellow actors were complaining about pay.

 

As I said, as much as one influences the other, I hold that these movies cannot and shouldn’t be compared to the original comics, to decades of stories through which the characters "lived" and accompanied many people in their upbringing. This mostly lasted up to the early 1990s, not beyond that.

 

True, the current Marvel comics are influenced by the movies (and vice-versa) but the actual comics hold almost nothing of Marvel’s original poetics and conception, which they have deliberately disowned and thrown away – in favor of what I have yet to understand.

 

I know you consider some of the old stories sacred but some of them were just silly. The writing wasn't the best at times, and I think as much as you dismiss "the modern era" your also a bit biased and nostalgic about the old issues. We've had discussion before, I respect your opinion but you should also be mindful that not everything publish in the past 20 years as been "junk"

I think Ed Brubaker and Sean Phillips demonstrated that pretty effectively

[vaillant]

I know you consider some of the old stories sacred but some of them were just silly. The writing wasn't the best at times, and I think as much as you dismiss "the modern era" your also a bit biased and nostalgic about the old issues. We've had discussion before, I respect your opinion but you should also be mindful that not everything publish in the past 20 years as been "junk"

 

No, I don’t (re: "sacred"), you miss the point.

I entirely agree there was a good deal of bad stories in any given era, what I am questioning is something that has objectively changed and with some study and work could be pinpointed to specific moments and editorial choices, for which they basically rescinded with everything they have meaningfully built little by little in 40 years.

 

To be even more clear: a story can be "good" but not respecting at all what the Marvel age conception was. The 1980s "junk", was just "junk", the modern stories are problematic precisely because they may even be "well written" but they are standalone things, more than often authorial exercises putting the writer/artist into the limelight instead of the wholeness which was proper of the Marvel age.

 

The removal of the Comics Code also introduced various degrees of problems: in absence of self-imposed rules, whose comics are "suitable for children" and which not? Which are "respectful" (of whatever instance) and which not?

Now I can read a title, or any other title, but they basically have nothing to do with each other. One rated "T", another rated "T+", whatever, it no longer has the inspirational quality and consistency the Marvel age (or Marvel "universe") has had in its general lines for 40+ years, however one may force himself to look at it.

[MR SigS]

BTW, Chris I do not know if you have read the early Iron Man stories (in title, not in ToS), but I am just discovering most of them and I am amazed at the very high quality of both narration and content (and art as well).

 

I think you're missing my point though. I'm not trying to take anything away from Iron Man, his stories, or his creation.

 

My point is more the household name of the other characters I mentioned. Before the Iron Man film, you didn't see kids running around with Iron Man figures or dressing up like him for Halloween. I bet a lot of people wouldn't have even known who Iron Man was or even more importantly who Tony Stark was.

 

The films really changed all that.

 

Agreed. Robert Downey Jr. Portrayal of Tony Stark was excellent. There is a reason why he was getting paid as much as he was to reprise and his fellow actors were complaining about pay.

 

In my opinion I wouldn't say Downey Jr portrayed Stark so much as reinvented him.

 

To be honest, I never really cared for Iron Man outside of an Avengers issue. I'm not saying there was ever anything wrong with the character, I just couldn't identify or relate to Stark in any way :shrug:

[Turtle]

Cap #1 had Cap and Bucky

[AGGIEZ]

Cap #1 had Cap and Bucky

 

AND Red Skull

[vaillant]

I get that you dislike what the last 20-30 years of writers have done to some of these characters but I can't imagine maintaining the same types of storylines for over 50 years as society has evolved over that time.

 

:shrug:

 

Honestly: they did not "evolve": evolution requires a conscious effort, shared ground, participation, not the kind of directives and treatment the management started to have in the 1990s (the Louise Simonson case with Bob Harras is emblematic) – they rather "involved" to something which did not belong to their slow and constant maturation as it had been for years.

 

It‘s not surprising, for example, that among the characters more difficult to write, and thus more mistreated along the years (even in the 1980s, I agree) we find some which for different reasons require a solid background and intellectual honesty from writers, like the Fantastic Four (the current series is embarassing to say the least, and let’s not talk about the Matt Fraction previous runs).

The X-Men were already messed up in the early 1990s, so no surprise they can basically do whatever they want with what is left, i.e. hollow mannequins.

[Spyder!]

I know you consider some of the old stories sacred but some of them were just silly. The writing wasn't the best at times, and I think as much as you dismiss "the modern era" your also a bit biased and nostalgic about the old issues. We've had discussion before, I respect your opinion but you should also be mindful that not everything publish in the past 20 years as been "junk"

 

Your right, not everything published in the past 20 years has been junk. Just most of it!

[ChrisInBaltimore]

I know you consider some of the old stories sacred but some of them were just silly. The writing wasn't the best at times, and I think as much as you dismiss "the modern era" your also a bit biased and nostalgic about the old issues. We've had discussion before, I respect your opinion but you should also be mindful that not everything publish in the past 20 years as been "junk"

 

No, I don’t (re: "sacred"), you miss the point.

I entirely agree there was a good deal of bad stories in any given era, what I am questioning is something that has objectively changed and with some study and work could be pinpointed to specific moments and editorial choices, for which they basically rescinded with everything they have meaningfully built little by little in 40 years.

 

To be even more clear: a story can be "good" but not respecting at all what the Marvel age conception was. The 1980s "junk", was just "junk", the modern stories are problematic precisely because they may even be "well written" but they are standalone things, more than often authorial exercises putting the writer/artist into the limelight instead of the wholeness which was proper of the Marvel age.

 

The removal of the Comics Code also introduced various degrees of problems: in absence of self-imposed rules, whose comics are "suitable for children" and which not? Which are "respectful" (of whatever instance) and which not?

Now I can read a title, or any other title, but they basically have nothing to do with each other. One rated "T", another rated "T+", whatever, it no longer has the inspirational quality and consistency the Marvel age (or Marvel "universe") has had in its general lines for 40+ years, however one may force himself to look at it.

 

What modern Marvel books do you read? I still feel like the universe is there, it just isn't as tight as it once was though.

[kav]

Hawkeye was good up to issue 6

[Old Fashion PB and J]

I know you consider some of the old stories sacred but some of them were just silly. The writing wasn't the best at times, and I think as much as you dismiss "the modern era" your also a bit biased and nostalgic about the old issues. We've had discussion before, I respect your opinion but you should also be mindful that not everything publish in the past 20 years as been "junk"

 

Your right, not everything published in the past 20 years has been junk. Just most of it!

Biggest crock of lies ever.

[Old Fashion PB and J]

Well, that’s an american problem, not a worldwide problem.

 

And that is paradoxical, because although obviously Spidey and the FF (and X-Men since the 1980s) have always been more popular, in most cases it is amazing how popular US culture fagocitates things at a rate that in a short time span now you lose sight of what has happened before.

 

I think the USA is the only country on earth where in the 1990s (don’t know now) the average boy or girl almost did not even know who Mickey Mouse or Donald Duck were, and they all knew who Sonic was.

 

American/North American kids all knew and loved Mickey Mouse and Donald Duck in that era. Disney films have always been huge, and every kid dreamed of going to Disneyland / Disney World. Disney staples always have been deeply ingrained in American pop-culture.

 

+1,000,000

 

I grew up in the 90's and everyone knew/loved Disney. Crazy to suggest otherwise.

Watched Ducktales, Darkwing Duck, Chip and Dale rescue rangers..

[Crimebuster]

GSX 1 is insanely important. If not for the fact that it's extremely plentiful in all grades, that book would be crazy expensive.

 

Is there another single issue with multiple major first appearances, other than Batman 1 and FF 1?

 

X-Men #1? Iron Man #55?

 

It's a fun question to think about!

 

Yeah, forgot X-Men 1. Also, FF 48.

 

Otherwise, I don't think there are a ton of instances where a single book contains multiple first-appearances of really important characters.

 

More Fun Comics #73 - Green Arrow, Aquaman, Speedy

Flash Comics #1 - Flash, Hawkman, Hawkgirl

Marvel Comics #1 - Human Torch, Sub-Mariner, Ka-Zar

Pep Comics #22 - Archie, Betty, Jughead

[COI]

GSX 1 is insanely important. If not for the fact that it's extremely plentiful in all grades, that book would be crazy expensive.

 

Is there another single issue with multiple major first appearances, other than Batman 1 and FF 1?

 

X-Men #1? Iron Man #55?

 

It's a fun question to think about!

 

Yeah, forgot X-Men 1. Also, FF 48.

 

Otherwise, I don't think there are a ton of instances where a single book contains multiple first-appearances of really important characters.

 

More Fun Comics #73 - Green Arrow, Aquaman, Speedy

Flash Comics #1 - Flash, Hawkman, Hawkgirl

Marvel Comics #1 - Human Torch, Sub-Mariner, Ka-Zar

Pep Comics #22 - Archie, Betty, Jughead

 

Good stuff.

 

Maybe we should compile a list.

[kav]

Youngblood #1:

Shaft (team leader)

Badrock

Link

Vogue

Chapel

Diehard

[Spyder!]

GSX 1 is insanely important. If not for the fact that it's extremely plentiful in all grades, that book would be crazy expensive.

 

Is there another single issue with multiple major first appearances, other than Batman 1 and FF 1?

 

X-Men #1? Iron Man #55?

 

It's a fun question to think about!

 

Yeah, forgot X-Men 1. Also, FF 48.

 

Otherwise, I don't think there are a ton of instances where a single book contains multiple first-appearances of really important characters.

 

More Fun Comics #73 - Green Arrow, Aquaman, Speedy

Flash Comics #1 - Flash, Hawkman, Hawkgirl

Marvel Comics #1 - Human Torch, Sub-Mariner, Ka-Zar

Pep Comics #22 - Archie, Betty, Jughead

 

Good stuff.

 

Maybe we should compile a list.

 

Do it! I think it should be at least 3 significant first appearances in a single issue. 2 is just too easy.

[Mephisto]

And I also guess the fact Miller used Kingpin and turned it into a major antagonist of Daredevil as well, this enlarged the "collecting pool" of the issue, as much as it has happened with issues of each and every series.

 

Kingpin is pretty big and has Great cross over appeal with Spider-Man and Daredevil. He probably became THE Daredevil villain. Awhile back I would have said Bullseye but after reading more Daredevil stories it's clearly Kingpin. Due to what (or who Bullseye has killed he's 1A, but is often someone else's pawn...Kingpin,Mysterio). Kingpin had a long history with Spider-Man before being Daredevil's problem. Even after the first Miller run he resurfaced once again in Spider-Man during the classic Hobgoblin run. Most of DD's villains had been a joke until Kingpin came in and Bullseye was made a little more serious than previously depicted. With Kingpin appearing in the Daredevil Netflix show there may be some more interest in the character if the show is done better than the movie from last decade.