Is it time for Kirby's 4th world to get the respect it deserves?

[ComicConnoisseur]

I don't know if this is the right thread to say so, but I found the damn things almost unreadable as a kid. I went back a few years ago and really, really wanted to enjoy them, but was really aggravated by the writing. Now I love Kirby, and the artwork on them certainly crackles with energy, but for me with comics, you need art AND story, and the dialogue just kills, in my opinion. As much as they (apparently) hated to admit it, Kirby was never better than with Lee, and Lee was never better than with Kirby.

Stan Lee and Jack Kirby remind me of John Lennon and Paul McCartney.

Very talented creators while alone,but created historic pop culture while teamed up that people are still talking about 50 plus years later.

 

[Prince Namor]

...I would have liked to have seen what Roy Thomas could do with Kirby's ideas...

 

A shame we never saw that....

[Prince Namor]

I don't know if this is the right thread to say so, but I found the damn things almost unreadable as a kid. I went back a few years ago and really, really wanted to enjoy them, but was really aggravated by the writing. Now I love Kirby, and the artwork on them certainly crackles with energy, but for me with comics, you need art AND story, and the dialogue just kills, in my opinion. As much as they (apparently) hated to admit it, Kirby was never better than with Lee, and Lee was never better than with Kirby.

Stan Lee and Jack Kirby remind me of John Lennon and Paul McCartney.

Very talented creators while alone,but created historic pop culture while teamed up that people are still talking about 50 plus years later.

 

Paul and John stopped writing 'together' long before the Beatles officially broke up.

[jools&jim]

 

I don't know if this is the right thread to say so, but I found the damn things almost unreadable as a kid. I went back a few years ago and really, really wanted to enjoy them, but was really aggravated by the writing. Now I love Kirby, and the artwork on them certainly crackles with energy, but for me with comics, you need art AND story, and the dialogue just kills, in my opinion. As much as they (apparently) hated to admit it, Kirby was never better than with Lee, and Lee was never better than with Kirby.

Stan Lee and Jack Kirby remind me of John Lennon and Paul McCartney.

Very talented creators while alone,but created historic pop culture while teamed up that people are still talking about 50 plus years later.

Paul and John stopped writing 'together' long before the Beatles officially broke up.

John was in many ways the Beatle with the most to say (artistically speaking), and his solo career really does remind me a bit of Jack Kirby's "solo" career after leaving Marvel and Stan: a clear break from the past (although with some important links to it), challenging, semi-popular, uneven, lots of false starts...rarely (if ever) ordinary, NEVER boring, and always worth the effort.

 

 

[Prince Namor]

If Kirby (and Lee) had for some reason been stopped from doing the Fantastic Four around issue #15-20, but the rest of the Universe had continued on; we'd still have some great characters in Dr. Doom, the Thing, the Skrulls, etc.

 

Just like the 4th World.

 

But they were able to finish it. To round out the story, add to it, and create a masterpiece.

 

Unlike the 4th World, which WAS cut short and interfered with.

 

[Prince Namor]

I don't know if this is the right thread to say so, but I found the damn things almost unreadable as a kid. I went back a few years ago and really, really wanted to enjoy them, but was really aggravated by the writing. Now I love Kirby, and the artwork on them certainly crackles with energy, but for me with comics, you need art AND story, and the dialogue just kills, in my opinion. As much as they (apparently) hated to admit it, Kirby was never better than with Lee, and Lee was never better than with Kirby.

Stan Lee and Jack Kirby remind me of John Lennon and Paul McCartney.

Very talented creators while alone,but created historic pop culture while teamed up that people are still talking about 50 plus years later.

Paul and John stopped writing 'together' long before the Beatles officially broke up.

John was in many ways the Beatle with the most to say (artistically speaking), and his solo career really does remind me a bit of Jack Kirby's "solo" career after leaving Marvel and Stan: a clear break from the past (although with some important links to it), challenging, semi-popular, uneven, lots of false starts...rarely (if ever) ordinary, NEVER boring, and always worth the effort.

 

 

Well said!

[JuliusSeizure]

 

Kirby gets away with those excesses, like the rough dialogue. Whereas it would seem puerile and lazy from another writer, once you read enough of Kirby's comics you can understand the boyish enthusiasm at the root of it. He's just constantly going for broke to entertain me, an inferno of ideas just bursting out through his mind and pen onto the page. The over-the-top dialogue is just part of that, and you roll with it.

 

The gentleman who brought 8-year-old me, through the convention long boxes, two issues of android gangsters fighting talking gorillas (Kamandi 19-20) earned himself the extra quote marks and exclamation points.

 

Very well said!

That is what struck me most on my recent re-reading; the sheer volume of genuinely interesting ideas. Any one of which would today be padded into a 6 issue trade.

 

Thank you! I agree with you - the big two comics companies have been mining Kirby's ideas for stories for several decades.