Alan Moore Says Superheroes a 'cultural catastrophe',

[Prince Namor]

He's basically saying that people into superhero comics are in a form of arrested development.

 

Hmm.

 

That makes sense.

[Nexus]

Guilty as charged!

 

And so what if it's true? Enjoy whatever you enjoy, who cares what Moore or anyone else feels about it. People getting all riled up over this shows a distinct lack of self-awareness.

[the authority]

I love Moore and Frank Miller as far as their contributions to comics are concerned. I see them as opposite sides of the same coin. They both see things in black and white with very little gray. While I read The Dark Knight Returns, Sin City, The Watchmen, and The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen annually, I look to neither of these guys for advice. I learned as a child meeting my favorite baseball player, that heroes can, and will, disappoint you if you allow them the power.

 

I view Grant Morrison the same way. His major contributions came later but to a certain generation, he is their "Moore". His take on the JLA was as enjoyable as almost anything I read in the '90s. He breathed new life and brought new characters into the X-men, a book I'd grown tired of reading until his run with Quitely. Throw Warren Ellis in there too. He happens to be my personal favorite.

 

It happens to be the stories we love, not necessarily the writers opinions. There have been less than a handful of writers who've driven mt away from their stories over their personal views. I just view them as slightly eccentric and extremely talented.

 

 

 

[jsilverjanet]

Love him or hate him, the Pádraig Ó Méalóid interview is a must-read. A master class in demolishing your opponent's argument. And trash talk. I almost feel bad for Grant Morrison. He gets schooled yet again. He should quit poking the bear because he just gets destroyed every time.

 

I was reading the interview on a plane that had engine trouble. It was a bit scary as we had to get diverted to another airport with a longer runway. As we approached, I could see all the emergency vehicles on the ground. My first thought was to call my family. My second was that I hoped I got to finish the interview before anything bad happened.

 

 

I would have been busy figuring out what stewardess I'd be making out with as the plane exploded

 

That being said I'm going to look for this interview now.

 

People need to give Alan Moore a break. He's a great writer, changed the comic industry and inspired a lot of your current favorite creators. You may not agree with what he has to say, but he's earned the right to say it.

[kav]

He was a great writer. Not much was good after Miracleman. Pretentious yes, good-not really.

[newshane]

The best artists are usually insane.

 

 

[kav]

Kirby wasn't wacky.

Maybe he's the only one....

[the authority]

The best artists are usually insane.

 

 

...or are we insane and they're perfectly normal ?

 

[kav]

The best artists are usually insane.

 

 

...or are we insane and they're perfectly normal ?

 

[Davenport]

He's basically saying that people into superhero comics are in a form of arrested development.

 

Hmm.

 

That makes sense.

He wasn't that personal about it, was he? My take was that by continuing superheroes, successive generations were depriving themselves of their own mythologies based on their own experiences. A form of self-inflicted deprivation (in his mind).

 

Personally what I think Moore fails to take into account is our unique time in cinematic graphics. It's only fairly recent that superheroes could faithfully be depicted on the big screen. CG has been like 4-color jet fuel for superheroics, and that party's just starting.

[Bronty]

I am going to go out on a limb here but I don't understand why people dump on someone for being who they want to be. Alan Moore has enriched the comic book world and even his Crossed +100 has been excellent. He is one of the only writers whose works I can revisit and pick up something I completely missed on the first, second etc... reads. I am glad he is candid in his interviews and they do go to places most don't. I can appreciate leaving the norm behind and he never disappoints me. My

 

Amen brother

[joe_collector]

"To my mind, this embracing of what were unambiguously children's characters at their mid-20th century inception seems to indicate a retreat from the admittedly overwhelming complexities of modern existence," he wrote to Ó Méalóid

 

This is actually a very astute comment.

[joe_collector]

He's basically saying that people into superhero comics are in a form of arrested development.

 

No, he's saying that because of the demands and conflicts present in modern life, normally-rational adults are regressing to the safety of childhood and their mythological heroes.

 

The Twilight Zone episode "Walking Distance" is a great exploration of this theme.

 

 

[Turtle]

Alan Moore, blah blah blah....pull a Howard Hughes and go away already.

 

I heard he is going to sell some Skybound boxes before he goes away!

 

Right! Alan Moore has always been a kind of genius\slash\doosh,so be gone already.

 

 

That read in my head "genius slash slash slash doosh".

[Prince Namor]

He's basically saying that people into superhero comics are in a form of arrested development.

 

No, he's saying that because of the demands and conflicts present in modern life, normally-rational adults are regressing to the safety of childhood and their mythological heroes.

 

Regressing to the safety of your childhood isn't a form of arrested development?

 

My understanding of psychologically healthy would be that 'the demands and conflicts present in modern life' wouldn't be enough of a traumatic experience to cause such a regression.

[ComicConnoisseur]

Also Alan Moore at 70 lashing out at his fans kind of reminds me of when Ringo of The Beatles turned 70,and told his fans to stop sending him fan mail.

 

Peace and love. Peace and LOVE.

Also, Alan Moore is awesome.

 

Also also, why does everyone assume he's a millionaire?

 

[Prince Namor]

He's basically saying that people into superhero comics are in a form of arrested development.

 

Hmm.

 

That makes sense.

He wasn't that personal about it, was he?

 

No, I'm probably reading between the lines...

 

My take was that by continuing superheroes, successive generations were depriving themselves of their own mythologies based on their own experiences. A form of self-inflicted deprivation (in his mind).

 

That makes sense. I was bored with superheroes to some degree by the time I was 13... I was ready to make my own adventures into the world...

 

Personally what I think Moore fails to take into account is our unique time in cinematic graphics. It's only fairly recent that superheroes could faithfully be depicted on the big screen. CG has been like 4-color jet fuel for superheroics, and that party's just starting.

 

From what I understand from interviews I've read of him is that, this is PRECISELY what he's talking about.

 

Mainstream comic readers are so spoiled by the ease at which the 'house style' tells a story that they fail to understand the potential comics have and the infinite amount of ways they can tell a story that uniquely exceed what can be done in any other form of art. Moore has said that comic-written-by-him-of-your-choice-that-was-turned-into-a-movie didn't need to be made into a movie because it was written as a comic book and said everything that needed to be said within that format.

 

The only real reason to do it, is to make money.

 

 

[Cat-Man_America]

"To my mind, this embracing of what were unambiguously children's characters at their mid-20th century inception seems to indicate a retreat from the admittedly overwhelming complexities of modern existence," he wrote to Ó Méalóid

 

This is actually a very astute comment.

 

Astute on one level, but not entirely accurate. Comic books weren't totally aimed at children and neither were the costumed characters that evolved after Superman. Originally, comic books were an experiment, marketed to compete with the growth and popularity of Sunday newspaper comics. While kids may have been a big part of the target audience comic books were rarely age specific.

 

Ten cent comics were created as disposable entertainment and seen by many during the early years as low-brow page turners for those with limited reading skills. But anyone analyzing the history of the genre should keep in mind that comic books came into being at the height of the depression when schooling above the 3rd grade level was a luxury and any literature costing more than a dime was beyond the means of most kids and many adults.

 

Comic books filled a valuable cultural niche that continued at home and abroad throughout the war years. Millions of comics featuring patriotically themed costumed superheroes were shipped overseas to our troops fighting in Europe and the Asian theater. After the war comic books underwent a gradual change to racier visual content to satisfy the changing interests of soldiers returning home.

 

If Alan Moore prefers using dismissive hyperbole as a shorthand for belittling the broader historical relevance of costumed characters on which much his own creative fame is based, well, more power to him. He's certainly entitled to do that and I wish him well retiring from public life.

 

But to think that taking a brief respite from the mind-numbing inundation of modern social and political realities should be cause for consternation makes no sense to me. What is wrong with the desire to escape, to find simple solace in stepping away from the overwhelming complexities of modern existence? Why should an appreciation of the past be considered a "cultural catastrophe" to Alan?

 

As a well regarded wordsmith and would-be philosopher of cultural relevance Alan Moore should at least have a passing familiarity with Georges Santayana. If so, he'd be aware that "retreating" isn't what folks are doing. Nostalgia for a more idealized time has always been a part of our culture even when the times remembered were far from ideal.

 

Those professing insight into the human condition should be fully cognizant of the fact that reflecting upon our past and learning from it is what makes progress possible.

 

Separating fantasy from reality is what differentiates childhood from adulthood. As an adult the ability to fantasize and periodically lose oneself in our more childlike imaginations enhances creativity. To my way of thinking this is healthier than constantly ruminating over things we have little control over.

 

What I find truly sad in Mr. Moore's jaded world-view is his apparent desire to drag everyone into the dystopian bowels of it from his much lauded position as a creative icon emeritus in the comics industry. What he seems to advocate is a vanquishing of escapist pleasure and innocence from our lives in order to join him reveling in despair for the human condition.

 

Misery does love company I suppose, but while I admire his grand achievements of decades past I'd rather not be one of the folks suffering for Alan Moore's art as he tells us we're all heading south in a hand basket.

[AmazingComics413]

 

"To my mind, this embracing of what were unambiguously children's characters at their mid-20th century inception seems to indicate a retreat from the admittedly overwhelming complexities of modern existence," he wrote to Ó Méalóid

 

This is actually a very astute comment.

 

Astute on one level, but not entirely accurate. Comic books weren't totally aimed at children and neither were the costumed characters that evolved after Superman. Originally, comic books were an experiment, marketed to compete with the growth and popularity of Sunday newspaper comics. While kids may have been a big part of the target audience comic books were rarely age specific.

 

Ten cent comics were created as disposable entertainment and seen by many during the early years as low-brow page turners for those with limited reading skills. But anyone analyzing the history of the genre should keep in mind that comic books came into being at the height of the depression when schooling above the 3rd grade level was a luxury and any literature costing more than a dime was beyond the means of most kids and many adults.

 

Comic books filled a valuable cultural niche that continued at home and abroad throughout the war years. Millions of comics featuring patriotically themed costumed superheroes were shipped overseas to our troops fighting in Europe and the Asian theater. After the war comic books underwent a gradual change to racier visual content to satisfy the changing interests of soldiers returning home.

 

If Alan Moore prefers using dismissive hyperbole as a shorthand for belittling the broader historical relevance of costumed characters on which much his own creative fame is based, well, more power to him. He's certainly entitled to do that and I wish him well retiring from public life.

 

But to think that taking a brief respite from the mind-numbing inundation of modern social and political realities should be cause for consternation makes no sense to me. What is wrong with the desire to escape, to find simple solace in stepping away from the overwhelming complexities of modern existence? Why should an appreciation of the past be considered a "cultural catastrophe" to Alan?

 

As a well regarded wordsmith and would-be philosopher of cultural relevance Alan Moore should at least have a passing familiarity with Georges Santayana. If so, he'd be aware that "retreating" isn't what folks are doing. Nostalgia for a more idealized time has always been a part of our culture even when the times remembered were far from ideal.

 

Those professing insight into the human condition should be fully cognizant of the fact that reflecting upon our past and learning from it is what makes progress possible.

 

Separating fantasy from reality is what differentiates childhood from adulthood. As an adult the ability to fantasize and periodically lose oneself in our more childlike imaginations enhances creativity. To my way of thinking this is healthier than constantly ruminating over things we have little control over.

 

What I find truly sad in Mr. Moore's jaded world-view is his apparent desire to drag everyone into the dystopian bowels of it from his much lauded position as a creative icon emeritus in the comics industry. What he seems to advocate is a vanquishing of escapist pleasure and innocence from our lives in order to join him reveling in despair for the human condition.

 

Misery does love company I suppose, but while I admire his grand achievements of decades past I'd rather not be one of the folks suffering for Alan Moore's art as he tells us we're all heading south in a hand basket.

 

 

[Prince Namor]

"To my mind, this embracing of what were unambiguously children's characters at their mid-20th century inception seems to indicate a retreat from the admittedly overwhelming complexities of modern existence," he wrote to Ó Méalóid

 

This is actually a very astute comment.

 

Astute on one level, but not entirely accurate. Comic books weren't totally aimed at children and neither were the costumed characters that evolved after Superman. Originally, comic books were an experiment, marketed to compete with the growth and popularity of Sunday newspaper comics. While kids may have been a big part of the target audience comic books were rarely age specific.

 

Ten cent comics were created as disposable entertainment and seen by many during the early years as low-brow page turners for those with limited reading skills. But anyone analyzing the history of the genre should keep in mind that comic books came into being at the height of the depression when schooling above the 3rd grade level was a luxury and any literature costing more than a dime was beyond the means of most kids and many adults.

 

Comic books filled a valuable cultural niche that continued at home and abroad throughout the war years. Millions of comics featuring patriotically themed costumed superheroes were shipped overseas to our troops fighting in Europe and the Asian theater. After the war comic books underwent a gradual change to racier visual content to satisfy the changing interests of soldiers returning home.

 

If Alan Moore prefers using dismissive hyperbole as a shorthand for belittling the broader historical relevance of costumed characters on which much his own creative fame is based, well, more power to him. He's certainly entitled to do that and I wish him well retiring from public life.

 

Some interesting points.

 

I don't believe his position was an attack on the history of comics, but rather the stagnation, retreading, and retarding of superhero comics as the primary source of comic books over the last 20 years.

 

But to think that taking a brief respite from the mind-numbing inundation of modern social and political realities should be cause for consternation makes no sense to me. What is wrong with the desire to escape, to find simple solace in stepping away from the overwhelming complexities of modern existence? Why should an appreciation of the past be considered a "cultural catastrophe" to Alan?

 

I ask myself this... "What has the modern comic book done in the last 20 years to it's benefit as an art form?"

 

Got some movies made? That's commerce.

 

Got more books in the book stores? That's commerce.

 

Sold some higher dollar collectibles. Ok.

 

As an art form, is it acceptance or respect we're looking for?

 

As a well regarded wordsmith and would-be philosopher of cultural relevance Alan Moore should at least have a passing familiarity with Georges Santayana. If so, he'd be aware that "retreating" isn't what folks are doing. Nostalgia for a more idealized time has always been a part of our culture even when the times remembered were far from ideal.

 

Those professing insight into the human condition should be fully cognizant of the fact that reflecting upon our past and learning from it is what makes progress possible.

 

With all due respect, I'm curious as to what you think the progress is that Marvel and DC use to publish their comics now, that is a benefit to their readers.

 

I honestly can't think of any.

 

It seems to me they've taken the basic core element of a superhero story - Something happens that threatens life as everyone knows it (i.e. Jimmy Olsen becomes a Giant Fish Man), and the superhero shows up to fix it so everything goes back to normal - and stretched it out from a 5 page story to a 22 page story to a 2 part story to a 6 part story to a year long 'event'.

 

There's nothing wrong with escaping into a world of fantasy and entertainment, but, isn't something wrong with stepping into a world of pandering and patronization?

 

Separating fantasy from reality is what differentiates childhood from adulthood. As an adult the ability to fantasize and periodically lose oneself in our more childlike imaginations enhances creativity. To my way of thinking this is healthier than constantly ruminating over things we have little control over.

 

I like a little of both, but I understand each way's reasoning.

 

What I find truly sad in Mr. Moore's jaded world-view is his apparent desire to drag everyone into the dystopian bowels of it from his much lauded position as a creative icon emeritus in the comics industry. What he seems to advocate is a vanquishing of escapist pleasure and innocence from our lives in order to join him reveling in despair for the human condition.

 

Pop Music made an entire industry from it.

 

Misery does love company I suppose, but while I admire his grand achievements of decades past I'd rather not be one of the folks suffering for Alan Moore's art as he tells us we're all heading south in a hand basket.

 

Yeah, he's just a dude. With an opinion. Like anyone else.

 

But, I think if 90% of all novels released were variations of the 'Dime Store Romance' novels of the past, no one would have any issue with saying, MAYBE.... the novel could be so much more....

 

Really I think reflecting on the past isn't what makes progress, it's thinking of what could be better. Mono didn't go to stereo from someone saying, "Man I sure love the buzz of that single speaker sound in my ear!", it came about because some one thought it could be better. Someone thought something from the past could be done better....

 

Rather than just regurgitated over and over again for another generation.

 

We're just lapping up another generations regurgitated art puke. It doesn't mean the original meal was bad.